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Forums :: Blog World :: Mike Augello: Development camp, defensive dealings and D-Day approaching for Marner
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burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tavares is sledge hockey level - Islesrbettr, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Jun 25 @ 8:15 AM ET
are you seriously suggesting that, RIGHT NOW, Matthew's is on par with the elite of the elite in the league...despite the fact that he plays completely sheltered minutes and has never cracked 75pts.....is that REALLY what you're saying?
- sensarmy_11


He's not sheltered

Are you suggesting that the guy who has the most 5on5 goals over the last 3years isn't elite?
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:16 AM ET
congrats....what exactly does that have to do with anything.....unless you're trying to point out the fact that my train wreck of a team has had infinitely more success than your juggernaut of a team has in the last 2 decades.

I get it, Ottawa's owner is a broke ass POS, and the team is bad..........it doesn't detract from the the fact that your team has a poop TON of holes in it, that can't be fixed due to cap mismanagement......as much as you wish it could detract from it.

- sensarmy_11


The Leafs are close to the cap because of drafting a lot of talent. That's the reason. The 2 worst contracts were given out by Lou. Hearing you claim Tavares is a bad contract is odd. He's a franchise C and the best UFA available in at let 12 years. Kevin Hayes just got 7.14 per.
sensarmy_11
Location: NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Jun 25 @ 8:17 AM ET
Based on NHL salary structure, Marner does not score enough goals. Did you know only 1 forward without a 30 goal season has ever gotten 8 million+ per? (Draisaitl and he had 29 goals). So Marner deserves 11 or 12?

Does Point and Rantanen deserve 11 or 12?

- RogerRoeper


the only players who deserve those contracts, IMO, are the ones who both score and set up goals.....guys like McDavid, Ovechkin, Kucherov, etc.

Matthew's scores a poop ton, but sets up very few....Marner is the opposite. but at the end of the day, Marner is who sets his value and he clearly wants to be paid similar to Matthew's. he's as important to your team, maybe more so, than Matthew's is.
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:17 AM ET
LOL @ Matthews "Sheltered". 30 other NHl coaches would be playing this guy 22+ minutes a night.

RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:19 AM ET
the only players who deserve those contracts, IMO, are the ones who both score and set up goals.....guys like McDavid, Ovechkin, Kucherov, etc.

Matthew's scores a poop ton, but sets up very few....Marner is the opposite. but at the end of the day, Marner is who sets his value and he clearly wants to be paid similar to Matthew's. he's as important to your team, maybe more so, than Matthew's is.

- sensarmy_11


NO. That's not how it works. a set-up winger can't be comparing himself to a goal scoring C just because that argument works for him.


And regarding the 1st point., that might be YOUR opinion, but the facts tell us you need to be a top goal scorer to be amongst the highest paid forwards.
The Law
Toronto Maple Leafs
Joined: 01.29.2008

Jun 25 @ 8:19 AM ET
congrats....what exactly does that have to do with anything.....unless you're trying to point out the fact that my train wreck of a team has had infinitely more success than your juggernaut of a team has in the last 2 decades.

I get it, Ottawa's owner is a broke ass POS, and the team is bad..........it doesn't detract from the the fact that your team has a poop TON of holes in it, that can't be fixed due to cap mismanagement......as much as you wish it could detract from it.

- sensarmy_11


Explain that please. "Can't be fixed" implies the Leafs are stuck with bad contracts. Give us a list of those contracts that can't be moved.

Truth is that Zaitsev's contract is a bit of a turd but otherwise every other meaningful contract on the team is a valuable asset. It's a wealth of riches. If Dubas wants to move a high priced forward other gm's will be tripping over themselves to get in line.

The only problem for the Leafs is that their decade of pooptyness allowed them to load up on elite young talent.

Sucks ...
sensarmy_11
Location: NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Jun 25 @ 8:21 AM ET
He's not sheltered

Are you suggesting that the guy who has the most 5on5 goals over the last 3years isn't elite?

- burn


not at all, I'm saying Marner is equally elite. I do that by pointing out some of the "weaknesses" in Matthew's game. they're both elite players....I'm just saying people are insane if they think Matthew's is worth 12 and marner is only worth 9
burn
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Tavares is sledge hockey level - Islesrbettr, ON
Joined: 08.02.2006

Jun 25 @ 8:22 AM ET
the difference, like you said, is that Eichel and Matthews got paid to eat up a bunch of UFA years.....Matthews is getting paid the same dollars and can walk for nothing the second he's eligible to be a UFA. he basically bent Dubas over a barrel.....Dubas also made Tavares the 2nd highest paid player in the league.....so why the (frank) would Marner sit there and take a "team discount" when Dubas is handing out massive player friendly deals as if there was no cap
- sensarmy_11



They're not asking for a discount. They arleady offered him MORE than guys that are his comps like kucherov, and he said no.

How is getting paid more than kucherov a discount?
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:22 AM ET
not at all, I'm saying Marner is equally elite. I do that by pointing out some of the "weaknesses" in Matthew's game. they're both elite players....I'm just saying people are insane if they think Matthew's is worth 12 and marner is only worth 9
- sensarmy_11


Or they just view the highest paid NHL players and see the top goal scorers and centres get paid the most?

What is Rantanen worth?
sensarmy_11
Location: NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Jun 25 @ 8:23 AM ET
Explain that please. "Can't be fixed" implies the Leafs are stuck with bad contracts. Give us a list of those contracts that can't be moved.

Truth is that Zaitsev's contract is a bit of a turd but otherwise every other meaningful contract on the team is a valuable asset. It's a wealth of riches. If Dubas wants to move a high priced forward other gm's will be tripping over themselves to get in line.

The only problem for the Leafs is that there decade of pooptyness allowed them to load up on elite young talent.

Sucks ...

- The Law


fair enough, the holes can be fixed by trading high priced forwards and creating other holes.

I get it, you guys have lots of high-end talent up front.......and if you think you can win a cup with 50-60% of your cap tied up in 5 or 6 guys, then have at it.
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:24 AM ET
The funny thing is if the Leafs offered Nylander around the league 10 + GMs would want him. Meanwhile non-Leaf fans claim he's got the worst contract

RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:24 AM ET
fair enough, the holes can be fixed by trading high priced forwards and creating other holes.

I get it, you guys have lots of high-end talent up front.......and if you think you can win a cup with 50-60% of your cap tied up in 5 or 6 guys, then have at it.

- sensarmy_11


The Blues won the cup. There are many contenders.
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:24 AM ET
fair enough, the holes can be fixed by trading high priced forwards and creating other holes.

I get it, you guys have lots of high-end talent up front.......and if you think you can win a cup with 50-60% of your cap tied up in 5 or 6 guys, then have at it.

- sensarmy_11


The Blues won the cup. There are many contenders.
sensarmy_11
Location: NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Jun 25 @ 8:25 AM ET
They're not asking for a discount. They arleady offered him MORE than guys that are his comps like kucherov, and he said no.

How is getting paid more than kucherov a discount?

- burn


we both know that deals signed in Florida aren't comparables that can be used.....and to pretend they are is just stupid.

a deal that has an 8 mil aav in florida is probably a 10-10.5 deal anywhere else.
The Law
Toronto Maple Leafs
Joined: 01.29.2008

Jun 25 @ 8:26 AM ET
not at all, I'm saying Marner is equally elite. I do that by pointing out some of the "weaknesses" in Matthew's game. they're both elite players....I'm just saying people are insane if they think Matthew's is worth 12 and marner is only worth 9
- sensarmy_11


Removing your biased exaggerations from the equation I would say that the majority of Leafs fans around here probably think that Matthews would be 12 on an 8 yr deal and Marner would be 10.

On 5 year deals Matthews at 11 and Marner at 9 isn't ridiculous or naive. Matthews got an extra 1/2 Milly and Marner probably does too ....
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:26 AM ET
we both know that deals signed in Florida aren't comparables that can be used.....and to pretend they are is just stupid.

a deal that has an 8 mil aav in florida is probably a 10-10.5 deal anywhere else.

- sensarmy_11


Then explain Ekblad and Callaghan deals?
poopstash
Los Angeles Kings
Joined: 03.21.2015

Jun 25 @ 8:27 AM ET
wow, someone is defensive this morning....wonder why
- sensarmy_11


My flight had to make an emergency landing in Ottawa and now I'm stuck here breathing in fumes from the dumpster fire that is the Senators organization

The Law
Toronto Maple Leafs
Joined: 01.29.2008

Jun 25 @ 8:30 AM ET
My flight had to make an emergency landing in Ottawa and now I'm stuck here breathing in fumes from the dumpster fire that is the Senators organization
- poopstash


Just be happy you're there during the 6 weeks of decent weather they get every year.
sensarmy_11
Location: NS
Joined: 06.01.2009

Jun 25 @ 8:31 AM ET
The funny thing is if the Leafs offered Nylander around the league 10 + GMs would want him. Meanwhile non-Leaf fans claim he's got the worst contract
- RogerRoeper


I actually don't think his contract is that bad........I think it looks that way partly because he kind of poop the bed a little after signing it........but there are WAAAAYYY worst contracts than that.
MaximusAurelius
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: #FireDubas
Joined: 04.23.2012

Jun 25 @ 8:32 AM ET
The funny thing is if the Leafs offered Nylander around the league 10 + GMs would want him. Meanwhile non-Leaf fans claim he's got the worst contract
- RogerRoeper


That's why he is gone after his bonus.
Simply put, impossible to win a cup with approx 50% of your total caphit spent on just 4 players (Matthews 11.6; Tavares 11; Marner 10.5 (for argument's sake); Nylander 6.9 --> 40mln / 81.5 is almost 50%).

The logical solution would then to trade the least out of those 4 players - which would be Nylander (there is really no argument there).

who was the guy I had a bet with regarding Nylander being traded yes/no before start of next season? I better start picking my good cause foundation for your donation soon :D
RogerRoeper
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Toronto, ON
Joined: 03.27.2007

Jun 25 @ 8:33 AM ET
That's why he is gone after his bonus.
Simply put, impossible to win a cup with approx 50% of your total caphit spent on just 4 players (Matthews 11.6; Tavares 11; Marner 10.5 (for argument's sake); Nylander 6.9 --> 40mln / 81.5 is almost 50%).

The logical solution would then to trade the least out of those 4 players - which would be Nylander (there is really no argument there).

who was the guy I had a bet with regarding Nylander being traded yes/no before start of next season? I better start picking my good cause foundation for your donation soon :D

- MaximusAurelius


I think Nylander could be traded next summer, but it won't be this summery
MaximusAurelius
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: #FireDubas
Joined: 04.23.2012

Jun 25 @ 8:34 AM ET
Then explain Ekblad and Callaghan deals?
- RogerRoeper

Ekblad has a 7.5mln AAV... he's completely right.
look at William Karlson's new contract with LV - 5.9mln (although for a very long term) for a great scoring 2 way offensive player. that's quite a good deal for Vegas. part of that is term, and part of that is tax related.
winsix
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: Henry Hudson's Fairchild 24 South Porcupine
Joined: 04.03.2016

Jun 25 @ 8:35 AM ET
That is exactly accurate about the Senators franchise..... Our team is a piece of sh!t and a train wreck and has sunk into the gutter of the NHL further than any team in living memory.

I get it, Ottawa's owner is a broke ass POS, and the team is horrible.......... the fact that we hired the cheapest coach that we could find doesn't help our chances of being anything but a bottom feeding team. I troll this site only because I am totally jealous of the Leafs who are loaded with talent while the Sens are fielding a team that would have difficulty competing at the AHL level.

- sensarmy_11


Fixed
MaximusAurelius
Toronto Maple Leafs
Location: #FireDubas
Joined: 04.23.2012

Jun 25 @ 8:35 AM ET
I think Nylander could be traded next summer, but it won't be this summery
- RogerRoeper

so leafs are going with

Rielly-Muzzin
Dermott - Holl
Rosen - Liljegren
on D
and Sparks as a backup goalie?

this year not aiming for playoffs?
21peter
Atlanta Thrashers
Location: Peter I Island
Joined: 11.18.2014

Jun 25 @ 8:36 AM ET
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