Please explain....pretty sure that the incoming guys had more pts than the outgoing. And are certainly less costly, which helps resign marner.
- burn

ahhhh. No. No they didnt. The 5 I listed LEAVING had 154 points
the 4 coming in had 127
Even leaving out Zaitsev so you compared 4 vs 4....140 out, 127 in.

So, points are not everything, but your staement is not even close to correct.

The problem I see with the Leafs is not the cap position they're in. If you think you can contend, you should be maxed out cap wise. I think the issue is with the balance of their cap spending. It's too forward heavy. I don't know enough about their young defense prospects but they're going to need to develop some quality young defenseman to take on bigger roles or else make a trade of some kind to add some long term depth to that position. They mitigated the problem somewhat with Barrie but he's in the last year of a deal and is going to want big money moving forward. Especially with the offensive numbers he is likely to put up on the Leafs.
- MJL

Their top two prospects are Dmen.

I'd actually expect Hawk fans to appreciate what Dubas is doing more then most. They lived this reality in 2010-15. They moved some great young talent needing new deals out for picks and moved on to win two more cups.

Dubas has actually gone a different route and kept the young guys and moved all the bad contracts at a pretty reasonable cost. We'll see if we're betting on the right group of young talent but for better or worse he's lined them up to stay together for the next 4/5 years, minimum.

That's good work.
- The Law

Yeah they won two cups, and you definitely can't taking anything away from that, but look at them now.
I think that's the downfall the Leafs will be trying to avoid once their window starts to close in 5/6 years. Winning the cup is the ultimate goal, but winning it lots would be better. They won't want to fall off the cliff like the other teams that won before, like LA and Chicago, and soon to be Pittsburgh.

The problem I see with the Leafs is not the cap position they're in. If you think you can contend, you should be maxed out cap wise. I think the issue is with the balance of their cap spending. It's too forward heavy. I don't know enough about their young defense prospects but they're going to need to develop some quality young defenseman to take on bigger roles or else make a trade of some kind to add some long term depth to that position. They mitigated the problem somewhat with Barrie but he's in the last year of a deal and is going to want big money moving forward. Especially with the offensive numbers he is likely to put up on the Leafs.
- MJL

That is part of the problem, although difficult to address. I think the hope is that the homegrown D-talent is coming and we need to bridge ourselves to get there. It is difficult to "force" the issue of balance... you end up with trades like Hall for Larsson. I still question why we held on to Nylander. Hopefully he proves me wrong.

There are a couple other "problems". This team NEEDS a playoff win. Losing in the first round can quickly become a culture. I think what people need to remember is that the core is still very young and inexperienced. Compare the Bruins/Capitals playoff experience to the leafs among their top-end players. So, a team with a very inexperienced core has drawn one of the top couple teams in the league, with very experienced core players... not an easy matchup.

I am also sick of seeing soft goals by Ander5en.

There should be an entrance test to get into certain blogs. Answer a couple of CBA questions before being able to post. Then we can avoid the constant rehashing of misinformation.
- The Law

To be fair, I don't think he (Matchett) is trolling... and I honestly am not positive how all of this works, or why. I do believe that it was done for a reason, to give us more LTIR flexibility after the season starts (I think?)

ICYMI: why the Leafs snagged Clarkson:
https://twitter.com/EarlS...tatus/1153799226175848454

And Mike Johnston also mentioned that Leafs can put players on LTIR right now, so this 10.55M can be to sign Marner at any point.

Also, Dubas (and Pridham) have set up us for cap success for the long-term and have skillfully maneuvered us out of cap rough waters, no thanks in part to Lou's signings (Marleau and Zaitsev).

We have clear skies after this year and will have our stars locked up long term. There are decision to be made with Muzzin and Barrie, but these are good problems to have.

To be fair, I don't think he is trolling... and I honestly am not positive how all of this works, or why. I do believe that it was done for a reason, to give us more LTIR flexibility after the season starts (I think?)
- Aetherial

me neither, but like you I don't pretend to know any better

we can contrast this with the casual hockey fan of another team (who probably mows lawns all day) who waltzes in here and acts like he knows more than the lawyer/capologist whose full time job dealing with the ins and outs of this

the (frank)ing audacity

guy might as well walk into a hospital and tell the heart surgeon his opinion on angioplasty

ICYMI: why the Leafs snagged Clarkson:
https://twitter.com/EarlS...tatus/1153799226175848454

And Mike Johnston also mentioned that Leafs can put players on LTIR right now, so this 10.55M can be to sign Marner at any point.
- gravyface

I read that yesterday also, based on that it sounds like a smart move, and they get a 4th...and no more sparky for me to listen to fans cry about

win win win

How do the in/out stack up in terms of goals and pts last year?
- burn

Not sure, but that is not even the real point.

Before the off-season everyone was boning up over how badly the Leafs were screwed and how they had no room to sign Marner AND they would lose other players.

Their dreams of joy at our expense have all come crashing down. We signed all the key players, escaped from under our bad contracts and are arguably better now, or at least have not become appreciably worse.

Losing the first hurts, but nothing else significant was sacrificed that was not adequately replaced.

me neither, but like you I don't pretend to know any better

we can contrast this with the casual hockey fan of another team (who probably mows lawns all day) who waltzes in here and acts like he knows more than the lawyer/capologist whose full time job dealing with the ins and outs of this

the (frank)ing audacity

guy might as well walk into a hospital and tell the heart surgeon his opinion on angioplasty
- poopstash

Some people here derive significant satisfaction in their lives from imaging bad things happening to the Leafs.

Not sure, but that is not even the real point.

Before the off-season everyone was boning up over how badly the Leafs were screwed and how they had no room to sign Marner AND they would lose other players.

Their dreams of joy at our expense have all come crashing down. We signed all the key players, escaped from under our bad contracts and are arguably better now, or at least have not become appreciably worse.

Losing the first hurts, but nothing else significant was sacrificed that was not adequately replaced.
- Aetherial

And losing what is likely a late first isn't that bad. There's firsts that yield Seguin and Hamilton, but there's also a lot of Tyler Biggses in the late first.

I don't care about the actual numbers or the impact of bringing back Clarkson's contract.

This is (frank)ing funny.

Some people here derive significant satisfaction in their lives from imaging bad things happening to the Leafs.
- Aetherial

It's the Hatred That Unites Them All

I don't care about the actual numbers or the impact of bringing back Clarkson's contract.

This is (frank)ing funny.
- Scabeh

Imagine if he shows up to camp all jacked on roids and coke with a huge weight lifter's belt on over his sweater "I'm (frank)ing ready! LET'S GOOOOO!"

I don't care about the actual numbers or the impact of bringing back Clarkson's contract.

This is (frank)ing funny.
- Scabeh

It is

One thing is crystal clear for me about this off-season...

A number of teams had RFA and/or cap issues. It seems like a lot of them STILL do. The Leafs have managed to take care of everything else and narrowed the focus down to Marner. They also seem positioned to deal with whatever happens in that situation.

Dubas had a tough job, because the landscaped for RFA's has quickly and dramatically changed and they were hamstrung by a couple bad Lamoriello contracts.

I do not see where any other team has done a better job of proactively addressing their issues this off-season.

ahhhh. No. No they didnt. The 5 I listed LEAVING had 154 points
the 4 coming in had 127
Even leaving out Zaitsev so you compared 4 vs 4....140 out, 127 in.

So, points are not everything, but your staement is not even close to correct.
- hawk35

My check your math I think your 127 number is wrong.

How is it not correct? They didn’t appreciably decrease their pts production if any from what went in and out. What isn’t correct? They didn’t lose a stud defense first guy and bring in inept d guys.

You can’t sit there and tell people theyre wrong without proof, especially when proof and been provided as to why YOU are wrong.

It is

One thing is crystal clear for me about this off-season...

A number of teams had RFA and/or cap issues. It seems like a lot of them STILL do. The Leafs have managed to take care of everything else and narrowed the focus down to Marner. They also seem positioned to deal with whatever happens in that situation.

Dubas had a tough job, because the landscaped for RFA's has quickly and dramatically changed and they were hamstrung by a couple bad Lamoriello contracts.

I do not see where any other team has done a better job of proactively addressing their issues this off-season.
- Aetherial

fire dubas - max

It is

One thing is crystal clear for me about this off-season...

A number of teams had RFA and/or cap issues. It seems like a lot of them STILL do. The Leafs have managed to take care of everything else and narrowed the focus down to Marner. They also seem positioned to deal with whatever happens in that situation.

Dubas had a tough job, because the landscaped for RFA's has quickly and dramatically changed and they were hamstrung by a couple bad Lamoriello contracts.

I do not see where any other team has done a better job of proactively addressing their issues this off-season.
- Aetherial

I'm not sure where acquiring Clarkson fits with the cap space needed to sign Marner and not busting over 10% in the offseason and all that.

But overall, I think Dubas has done a tremendous job this summer. Did way better than most thought he would.

If he can somehow sign Marner to an acceptable amount, give this guy a raise.

Yes they can
- burn

Please explain to me how you can use LTIR (a cap overage allowance) before your roster is set.

I really mean that, in a non-antagonistic way. I really want to understand. When the Flyers had Chris Pronger in semi-retirement, they couldn't tap into his LTIR until the season started.

ahhhh. No. No they didnt. The 5 I listed LEAVING had 154 points
the 4 coming in had 127
Even leaving out Zaitsev so you compared 4 vs 4....140 out, 127 in.

So, points are not everything, but your staement is not even close to correct.
- hawk35

154 over 5 guys

127 (your math is wrong) over 4 guys.

Do you think that there is a problem there?

Yeah they won two cups, and you definitely can't taking anything away from that, but look at them now.
I think that's the downfall the Leafs will be trying to avoid once their window starts to close in 5/6 years. Winning the cup is the ultimate goal, but winning it lots would be better. They won't want to fall off the cliff like the other teams that won before, like LA and Chicago, and soon to be Pittsburgh.
- UsernameUnknown

The would consider themselves to fall off a cliff like pitts, la, and Chicago.
Lucky!
It would mean theyve won multiple cups.
Right now the leafs are trying to figure out how to climb the mountain

154 over 5 guys

127 (your math is wrong) over 4 guys.

Do you think that there is a problem there?
- burn

Yeah but Leafs

Please explain to me how you can use LTIR (a cap overage allowance) before your roster is set.
- jmatchett383

It’s been widely reported as fact by capfreindly and Elliot freidman that summer ltir is a thing and has in fact been used by multiple teams before. This is now common knowledge.

It’s a pretty easy thing to find on the web if you look

ICYMI: why the Leafs snagged Clarkson:
https://twitter.com/EarlS...tatus/1153799226175848454

And Mike Johnston also mentioned that Leafs can put players on LTIR right now, so this 10.55M can be to sign Marner at any point.
- gravyface

Good thread.
Thanks for posting it