This is so well-stated it's boring.
- buffalofan19

This sounds like a backhanded compliment.

I mean, I haven't read too many guys or gals on here that used the word "genius".

I think the guy has a great resume, though (yes, he had Crosby, Malkin, Fleury, but as AGM, he was tasked to help develop well, hire the coaches in WB to do just that, and backfill the NHL roster, and he did it to the tune of 3 Stanley Cups). He has worked his way up the chain and has earned the right to build this thing right, imo.

We're all just impatient at this point, and rightly so.

Just my opinion.
- Powerslave

And i would counter that expecting winning after a coach firing, 3 off seasons and 3 drafts no longer qualifies as impatience

And i would counter that expecting winning after a coach firing, 3 off seasons and 3 drafts no longer qualifies as impatience
- jcragcrumple

i think the bigger issue is that we sucked so bad with GMTM that we are lumping his years with Botts as part of his tenure almost for the rebuild. I could be wrong but we sucked for too long

I'm not here to defend Murray. He sucked. But when people talk about Botterill being patient and building the right way, it is relevant to say that he has only made 18 draft selections in 3 years while rebuilding
- jcragcrumple

He's not using all of his picks on prospects, which at this stage of our team, is the right approach. You still want at least 5 picks a year, while using some of those on current NHL talent.

He's building exactly how he stated he would. Making moves for the short and long term future.

He used picks on Skinner, Miller, Vesey, Sheary and Montour.

The chances of those 5 players playing meaningful minutes in the NHL are 100%. They are also all in their mid 20's. Just a few years older than our current core.

the picks.. 1st, 2 2nds, 2 3rds, 4th and 5th... well, let's just say their chances of success are overall less than 50% combined.

He's drafting guys who, like Broads mentioned, have very solid early returns, and using some of his Bottcoins on current NHLers to help this team succeed sooner.

I'm not going to sit here and tell you Botts is batting a 1000. But he's stuck to his plan, and outside of what's presumed to be a forced God trade, he's been solid.

I'm actually liking that six-pick strategy and those 3rds he used were for NHL players, unlike the crap shoot that is the draft, especially in the third round
- Michael Pachla

It's still a double standard regarding "wasting assets" which we all hated gmtm for: the 2nd rounders for gorges, dlo and Fasching vs. 3 thirds for beaulieu, scandella and Vesey

It's better than the gmtm moves, but in retrospect we'd be better off having not done at least 2 of 3

I would agree, but for the cost of acquisition, it's really no skin off the Sabres backs if he plateaus in his professional development. Sheary and/or Vesey may very well be worth new 1 or 2 year deals.
- TheSabresTaco

Like I said, he didn't make the trade to be a rental.

And i would counter that expecting winning after a coach firing, 3 off seasons and 3 drafts no longer qualifies as impatience
- jcragcrumple

Year 1 was assessment.

You can't just come in and start gutting without knowing what you have.

And there are 30 other GM's in the league trying to beat you. So, sh!t takes time.

If it's true that he's getting at least 4 years, personally I'm glad. The madness has to stop at some point.

He's not using all of his picks on prospects, which at this stage of our team, is the right approach. You still want at least 5 picks a year, while using some of those on current NHL talent.

He's building exactly how he stated he would. Making moves for the short and long term future.

He used picks on Skinner, Miller, Vesey, Sheary and Montour.

The chances of those 5 players playing meaningful minutes in the NHL are 100%. They are also all in their mid 20's. Just a few years older than our current core.

the picks.. 1st, 2 2nds, 2 3rds, 4th and 5th... well, let's just say their chances of success are overall less than 50% combined.

He's drafting guys who, like Broads mentioned, have very solid early returns, and using some of his Bottcoins on current NHLers to help this team succeed sooner.

I'm not going to sit here and tell you Botts is batting a 1000. But he's stuck to his plan, and outside of what's presumed to be a forced God trade, he's been solid.
- TheSabresTaco

Yours is a very well thought out response. I'll just say that I want to see the results this year before annointing his plan a success

It's still a double standard regarding "wasting assets" which we all hated gmtm for: the 2nd rounders for gorges, dlo and Fasching vs. 3 thirds for beaulieu, scandella and Vesey

It's better than the gmtm moves, but in retrospect we'd be better off having not done at least 2 of 3
- jcragcrumple

you forgot the McNabb one too

Year 1 was assessment.

You can't just come in and start gutting without knowing what you have.

And there are 30 other GM's in the league trying to beat you. So, sh!t takes time.

If it's true that he's getting at least 4 years, personally I'm glad. The madness has to stop at some point.
- Powerslave

The most telling comment of the entire season was Botterill admitting that the team was vastly outperforming expectations. Everyone in the org knew how good they probably should have been, and leading the league wasn't it. There's no waving a magic wand and saying here's 5 of the best free agents and a couple 22 year old top draft picks, go on out and dominate.

The best teams drafted well years ago. The Sabres did not. Good teams don't give up good players for bad or lesser players for no reason.

Keys to the team
Draft well
Sign intelligent FA contracts
Develop your young players

Fin

Year 1 was assessment.

You can't just come in and start gutting without knowing what you have.

And there are 30 other GM's in the league trying to beat you. So, sh!t takes time.

If it's true that he's getting at least 4 years, personally I'm glad. The madness has to stop at some point.
- Powerslave

recycling GMs every 3 years isn't going to be good.. GMTM was a mess and i understand firing him.. we need to see improvement this year

Yours is a very well thought out response. I'll just say that I want to see the results this year before annointing his plan a success
- jcragcrumple

Very few people are anointing the plan as a success. They're just stating that it's a plan that is both recognizable and in a stage that is too early to label a failure.

Yours is a very well thought out response. I'll just say that I want to see the results this year before annointing his plan a success
- jcragcrumple

Whether his plan bears fruit is an entirely different conversation. Future is all projections and opinions. But past can be broken down in so many ways to determine "success". Without making a big long post about it, there were potholes, but we've definitely moved down the road towards the goal.

recycling GMs every 3 years isn't going to be good.. GMTM was a mess and i understand firing him.. we need to see improvement this year
- SabresFaninIndiana

There's really no other way to break down 19-20.

Very few people are anointing the plan as a success. They're just stating that it's a plan that is both recognizable and in a stage that is too early to label a failure.
- buffalofan19

I agree, it's not a failure yet. I don't think Botterill should have been fired this year, it's just time for his plan to come together in '18-'19. There are only 3 players on this team from GMTM's regime who Botterill hasn't extended* - bogo, okposo and risto. So 20 out of 23 players are here through Botterill's decisions, and I think that makes it fair to say that it's his roster now, and he should be expected to show results.

*erod, McCabe, reinhart, eichel, Larry, girgs, ullmark were here but Botterill has given them contracts

I'm not here to defend Murray. He sucked. But when people talk about Botterill being patient and building the right way, it is relevant to say that he has only made 18 draft selections in 3 years while rebuilding
- jcragcrumple

GMTM traded away 1st round picks. GMBotts traded away lower picks to move up in rounds 2 and 3. It's not quantity it's quality

I mean, I haven't read too many guys or gals on here that used the word "genius".

I think the guy has a great resume, though (yes, he had Crosby, Malkin, Fleury, but as AGM, he was tasked to help develop well, hire the coaches in WB to do just that, and backfill the NHL roster, and he did it to the tune of 3 Stanley Cups). He has worked his way up the chain and has earned the right to build this thing right, imo.

We're all just impatient at this point, and rightly so.

Just my opinion.
- Powerslave

Legit no one is calling him a genius.

It just is funny how the goalposts continuously move

He was getting criticized for not making moves

Now He’s made a few, and good ones at that, but he’s now low-balling and penny pinching and giving up too many 3rds?

Ridiculous

Legit no one is calling him a genius.

It just is funny how the goalposts continuously move

He was getting criticized for not making moves

Now He’s made a few, and good ones at that, but he’s now low-balling and penny pinching and giving up too many 3rds?

Ridiculous
- sbroads24

Agreed.

And summer is a bad time around these parts.

I agree, it's not a failure yet. I don't think Botterill should have been fired this year, it's just time for his plan to come together in '18-'19. There are only 3 players on this team from GMTM's regime who Botterill hasn't extended* - bogo, okposo and risto. So 20 out of 23 players are here through Botterill's decisions, and I think that makes it fair to say that it's his roster now, and he should be expected to show results.

*erod, McCabe, reinhart, eichel, Larry, girgs, ullmark were here but Botterill has given them contracts
- jcragcrumple

It absolutely is his roster, but what has to be recognized is that a few of the most important pieces are 20,20,19,18 and 22.

But putting the “playoffs or fired” ultimatum, in the most top heavy division in hockey just seems like you’re looking for a reason to want him fired

Legit no one is calling him a genius.

It just is funny how the goalposts continuously move

He was getting criticized for not making moves

Now He’s made a few, and good ones at that, but he’s now low-balling and penny pinching and giving up too many 3rds?

Ridiculous
- sbroads24

Sure, but let's see how they pan out

And not specifically genius, but you did say "indisputably great at managing the cap"

The superlatives have flown around for 3 off seasons. Now let's see how he did

Sure, but let's see how they pan out

And not specifically genius, but you did say "indisputably great at managing the cap"

The superlatives have flown around for 3 off seasons. Now let's see how he did
- jcragcrumple

That was the MO that got him hired in the first place.

To me, someone that is good at managing the cap is giving his team the ability to relatively easily make roster changes if a season goes poorly. Botterill has done that.

Sure, but let's see how they pan out

And not specifically genius, but you did say "indisputably great at managing the cap"

The superlatives have flown around for 3 off seasons. Now let's see how he did
- jcragcrumple

I was referencing his time in Pittsburgh where he was in charge of the cap and did an undeniably great job for them.

And he has done well with the cap here so far.

I seriously think we’re forgetting the mess he inherited.

He took over a bottom 10 cap team with 3 core players to speak of, one which wanted out

He has 2 legit criticisms that are 100% on him IMO

1. Housley
2. Not trading Ristolainen

I was referencing his time in Pittsburgh where he was in charge of the cap and did an undeniably great job for them.

And he has done well with the cap here so far.

I seriously think we’re forgetting the mess he inherited.

He took over a bottom 10 cap team with 3 core players to speak of, one which wanted out

He has 2 legit criticisms that are 100% on him IMO

1. Housley
2. Not trading Ristolainen
- sbroads24

I hate to add this as it's SUCH a sensitive topic, but the value he got for ROR. I have no problem with the ROR trade (was all for it) but I always felt the value was a little low.

I would put that at number 2.

I hate to add this as it's SUCH a sensitive topic, but the value he got for ROR. I have no problem with the ROR trade (was all for it) but I always felt the value was a little low.

I would put that at number 2.
- gcomella34

I think he's saying that's on Pegula, which i'm not going to dispute because it's not worth getting into the weeds on that

Legit no one is calling him a genius.

It just is funny how the goalposts continuously move

He was getting criticized for not making moves

Now He’s made a few, and good ones at that, but he’s now low-balling and penny pinching and giving up too many 3rds?

Ridiculous
- sbroads24

To me, his plan was always to slowly turn over the team, which was going to take 3 years to let some of the deals expire. The more important piece was to develop drafted players, euro UFA's, and college UFA's. Until they get stronger contributions internally, they can't really contend.

There's a little bit of a push by younger players to make the team this year, but it's still pretty mild. If they were confident in Smith, Olofsson, and Ruotsalainen, they wouldn't need to grab Vesey. Joker and Pilut are pushing, but the rest of the D is a year or more away.

It would take a complete embarrassment on the ice to pull the plug.