You could be right.

I just am doubting that very much. He is a very talented D.

There were rumors of a bunch of interest in the UFA talking period.

He isn't saying a word.

The rumors suggests he loves being a Leaf.

A lot of points suggest he is waiting on Marner.
- Santo_44

He might feel his value is too low because of the back injury. He may be waiting to see if the leafs get Marner for 8.5 or something short term, and he can sign a 1 yr. 1.5 deal to try to rebuild his value?

I am guessing he simply has been asking too much and teams are scared by the injury history.

Ceci is penciled in for a top-4 role.

You may not like it.

I may not like it.

But you don't give a guy a $4.5 million contract ($200,000 more than you had to) with no money upfront, unless you think he will be a mainstay on your roster.

Don't shoot the messenger here - I'm just listing out the facts.
- Atomic Wedgie

Still the only real big question I have about Dubas' off-season. I don't get that contract at all.

To a certain extent.

If/when Dubas says "we can't sign you to a contact that is compared to Matthews, we are going to look at a trade."

Can Marner use Matthews as a comparable for his new team? No (frank)ing way.
- Santo_44

It's not a matter of "can't."

It's a matter of "won't."

He's simply not as good.

Sorry, Mitchie.

i wish this wasnt true but it likely is. there isnt really another option right now.
- daeth

I wish we had better as well - I just don't see anyone ready to step up unless one of the young studs really breaks out in pre-season and forces the hand. Liljegren/Sandin that is.

This is what Leafs fans are hoping for, but by no means is this for certain.

Do I like Dermott? Sure.

Do I think he's ready for a top 4 role? No real indication this is the case.

Last year, he was 6th on the team in EV TOI/GP (7th if you count Rosen).

Almost no PP time.

6th in SH TOI/GP.

Ceci was 2nd in EV TOI/GP for Ottawa.

Almost no PP time.

#1 for PK TOI/GP

Yes, apples to oranges, but my point remains:

Leafs fans are hoping that Dermott steps up this year. But it's a hope, not a certainty.

For now, pencil in Ceci above him on the depth chart.
- Atomic Wedgie

Yeah, I do agree with this. Last year Dermott looked good, but when he was elevated to tougher competition he did look exposed. He started to acclimate, but missing a couple of months to start the year may set him back.

I expect Ceci to perform poorly, but as a Leaf fan, we've probably seen way worse, so it's possible we'll be pleasantly surprised that he only mostly sucks.

If Ceci can fill his role on a better team that offers better support, then that'll be great.

Your Nylander is a bust
- leafluver27

But....but....but....6 million cap space less!!!!!!

He might feel his value is too low because of the back injury. He may be waiting to see if the leafs get Marner for 8.5 or something short term, and he can sign a 1 yr. 1.5 deal to try to rebuild his value?

I am guessing he simply has been asking too much and teams are scared by the injury history.
- Aetherial

I don't believe it.

It is a possibility but rumors suggest otherwise. His back has apparently progressed well and if it wasn't we would of heard about it by now by other teams.

All we have heard is "handshake deals" and "waiting for the Leafs"

To me he is waiting on the Leafs...Dubas can't sign Gardiner until Marner is signed.

It is simple to me. They will have 0-2.5 million in space after Marner signs...Trade Ceci and you have enough to fit him in.

As for the people who say "yOu CaNt TrAdE CeCi"

Marleau, Zaitzev, Clarkson were all traded...And those were 10x worse contracts.

And it also depends for what Marner signs for... If there is 2 million left on the table then it is pretty simple. Retain salary on Ceci.

It's not a matter of "can't."

It's a matter of "won't."

He's simply not as good.

Sorry, Mitchie.
- Atomic Wedgie

I agree.

If he is still asking for that he is getting very poor advice.

I don't believe it.

It is a possibility but rumors suggest otherwise. His back has apparently progressed well and if it wasn't we would of heard about it by now by other teams.

All we have heard is "handshake deals" and "waiting for the Leafs"

To me he is waiting on the Leafs...Dubas can't sign Gardiner until Marner is signed.

It is simple to me. They will have 0-2.5 million in space after Marner signs...Trade Ceci and you have enough to fit him in.

As for the people who say "yOu CaNt TrAdE CeCi"

Marleau, Zaitzev, Clarkson were all traded...And those were 10x worse contracts.

And it also depends for what Marner signs for... If there is 2 million left on the table then it is pretty simple. Retain salary on Ceci.
- Santo_44

If they had any intention of trading Ceci, I just dont understand why the contract was not mostly signing bonus? I find it hard to believe the Leafs are suddenly cash-conscious.

Lucas Neilson: Superstar Salary Structures: Dubas in control
The new NHL
- Lucas.Neilson

It's not a matter of "can't."

It's a matter of "won't."

He's simply not as good.

Sorry, Mitchie.
- Atomic Wedgie

He won't get as much. I think even he knows that.

But how much less per year should he get? 500k? 1M? 1.5M? 2M?

Who knows?

If they had any intention of trading Ceci, I just dont understand why the contract was not mostly signing bonus? I find it hard to believe the Leafs are suddenly cash-conscious.
- Aetherial

Thats just it.

There is a lot more to contracts that we don't know. It is hard to believe that the Leafs wouldn't flex their financial muscle if it helps them in any way.

Considering their willingness to do so on any occasion, I think we must give them the benefit of the doubt here and realize it was the best call. For some reason.

He won't get as much. I think even he knows that.

But how much less per year should he get? 500k? 1M? 1.5M? 2M?

Who knows?
- Scabeh

PM wants his damn yacht.

Real poop though, PM probably gets roasted by 10 year olds at the grocery store.

I don't believe it.

It is a possibility but rumors suggest otherwise. His back has apparently progressed well and if it wasn't we would of heard about it by now by other teams.

All we have heard is "handshake deals" and "waiting for the Leafs"

To me he is waiting on the Leafs...Dubas can't sign Gardiner until Marner is signed.

It is simple to me. They will have 0-2.5 million in space after Marner signs...Trade Ceci and you have enough to fit him in.

As for the people who say "yOu CaNt TrAdE CeCi"

Marleau, Zaitzev, Clarkson were all traded...And those were 10x worse contracts.

And it also depends for what Marner signs for... If there is 2 million left on the table then it is pretty simple. Retain salary on Ceci.
- Santo_44

You're not wrong, but I think it would be a mismanagement of assets. We're not moving Ceci without giving up something else that we don't want to lose. Which would circle back to the first question we all asked six weeks ago - why sign him when we could have gone to arbitration with him and walked away. The worst case is the arbitrator gives him less than $4.4m, which is less than he signed for, but we'd have to keep him.

All evidence suggests that simply put: he's an RHD and they intend to use him.

PM wants his damn yacht.

Real poop though, PM probably gets roasted by 10 year olds at the grocery store.
- Santo_44

Can't we just get PM an endorsement deal with Canadian Tire?

"Hi, I'm Paul Marner, and I know what it's like to have a kid in hockey. Buy stuff at Canadian Tire."

$4 million X 6 years.

Boom.

You're not wrong, but I think it would be a mismanagement of assets. We're not moving Ceci without giving up something else that we don't want to lose. Which would circle back to the first question we all asked six weeks ago - why sign him when we could have gone to arbitration with him and walked away. The worst case is the arbitrator gives him less than $4.4m, which is less than he signed for, but we'd have to keep him.

All evidence suggests that simply put: he's an RHD and they intend to use him.
- Monkeypunk

I think there was more to this negotiation than we actually know...

I am pretty sure Ceci could sign his QO at any point. He didn't have to go to Arbitration.

But then also, maybe Ceci holds some real value to some GMs...I mean there were strong rumours of him being traded at the TDL and Dorian wanting a 1st.

It is likely Dubas went around the league and asked GM's if they'd be willing to trade for Ceci at some point..

I say this because I highly doubt Dubas signed him to 4.5 million with no signing bonus for poops and giggles.

If they had any intention of trading Ceci, I just dont understand why the contract was not mostly signing bonus? I find it hard to believe the Leafs are suddenly cash-conscious.
- Aetherial

they had somewhere close to $60M in bonuses to pay ~July 1 this year.

that doesn't include marner.

maybe dubas hit his budget for jul 1 bonuses?

PM wants his damn yacht.

Real poop though, PM probably gets roasted by 10 year olds at the grocery store.
- Santo_44

I could just picture Mitch and Auston on PM's yacht.

"Nachos, lemonheads, and my dad's boat!"

Can't we just get PM an endorsement deal with Canadian Tire?

"Hi, I'm Paul Marner, and I know what it's like to have a kid in hockey. Buy stuff at Canadian Tire."

$4 million X 6 years.

Boom.
- Atomic Wedgie

Think of the outrage by opposing fans.

I could just picture Mitch and Auston on PM's yacht.

"Nachos, lemonheads, my dad's boat!"
- RickJames77

I could just picture Mitch and Auston on PM's yacht.

"Nachos, lemonheads, and my dad's boat!"
- RickJames77

"No Mitch! You are only allowed one beer per month, we need you in tip top shape for that next contract in 2025. I have already been spending 8 hours a day working your value up on twitter with my 17 burner accounts."

- Scabeh

Harold Ballard says hello.
- Atomic Wedgie

No kidding ... what an idiot

Think of the outrage by opposing fans.
- Santo_44

Canuckleheads would lose their minds again..


Leafs cheating...
😁

I think there was more to this negotiation than we actually know...

I am pretty sure Ceci could sign his QO at any point. He didn't have to go to Arbitration.

But then also, maybe Ceci holds some real value to some GMs...I mean there were strong rumours of him being traded at the TDL and Dorian wanting a 1st.

It is likely Dubas went around the league and asked GM's if they'd be willing to trade for Ceci at some point..

I say this because I highly doubt Dubas signed him to 4.5 million with no signing bonus for poops and giggles.
- Santo_44

I have to wonder as well. But here is how I understand the scenario, and am open to being corrected:

Ceci was issued a $4.3m QO. So he can make no less than this.

The QO had not yet been rejected, however signs were that Ceci was intending to reject the QO and go to arbitration (I believe you need to reject the QO in order to qualify for arbitration). Dreger had speculated that Ceci could garner as much as $5m in arbitration.

If Ceci was awarded more than $4.39m in arbitration the Leafs could have opted to walk-away.

So pretty much if Ceci didn't want to sign for the QO, we could have just let him go to arbitration and walk-away or be saddled with a contract of $4.4m or less.

So they think he has value in some capacity or they wouldn't have paid him the extra $100k. Whether to the team or as trade-bait, but I think Dorion couldn't find a trade partner. If he could have, he wouldn't have traded Ceci for Zaitsev's albatross contract.

Meh. Summer discussions. We'll have to see what he does on the ice.