we all know Dubas would have picked a 5'7" pipsqueak
- senstroll

well... there's definitely a strong possibility Dubas would have pick the pipsqueak...

or some other guy who was 5'5"

If Korshkov was drafted in 2014 when originally available, nobody would bat a (frank)ing eye that he's closer to bust than prospect. *cough* Tikhonov

One day I'm going to write a book that destroys the 100 most prevalent myths about the Toronto Maple Leafs.

My favourite of course was that MLSEL doesn't care about winning - they only care about money. This was true while Ballard was owner, but he died in 1991. Since then, the problem with MLSEL is that they want to win too much, not too little.

But my second favourite is that the Leafs could never undertake a proper "burn it to the foundations and rebuild properly" because the fan base would never stand for it.

Like, WTF?

The team was franking horrible - like, absolutely franking horrible - through the entire 1970s and 80s. Yet the building sold out each and every night. The waiting list for season tickets was literally over 100 years long.

We went through 8 franking years without making the playoffs. We haven't won a playoff series since 2004.

But the fan base wouldn't tolerate a rebuilding process?

Jeepers, Mary and Joseph.
- Atomic Wedgie

I'll offer to help write such a book...

but you are wrong about the 70s... they were a very good team with a very good young core for a chunk of the 70s... but Ballard was too cheap and Imlach to stubborn to keep them together - rather they torn it down.

and if anyone of the current younger Leafs fans believes that the team was "bad" in the post Sundin era... then they need to watch a few games from the mid-late 80s...
that was a whole other level of terrible.

If Korshkov was drafted in 2014 when originally available, nobody would bat a (frank)ing eye that he's closer to bust than prospect. *cough* Tikhonov
- AdamFrench

Ok so....we have another year before we label him a bust.

Noice!

i'm starting to think you're going to win our bet..
do you have your charity picked yet?
- MaximusAurelius

oh i almost forgot about that, I do have one in mind yes

Ok so....we have another year before we label him a bust.

Noice!
- Fakepartofme

And here I was, thinking every Leafs pick was a bust the moment their name was announced

oh i almost forgot about that, I do have one in mind yes
- senstroll

Ahjay's snow angels?

What's the bet anyways?

I'll offer to help write such a book...

but you are wrong about the 70s... they were a very good team with a very good young core for a chunk of the 70s... but Ballard was too cheap and Imlach to stubborn to keep them together - rather they torn it down.

and if anyone of the current younger Leafs fans believes that the team was "bad" in the post Sundin era... then they need to watch a few games from the mid-late 80s...
that was a whole other level of terrible.



- BorjeFan4Ever

I'll give you they were good in 1977-78.

Other than that?

1st round victories against LA, Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh, Atlanta.

That's pretty franking sad for a decade worth of work.

Ahjay's snow angels?

What's the bet anyways?
- RickJames77

might go with The Center For Hockeybuzz posters Who Can't Read Good And Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too charity

There have been some good comments that allude to the way the Leaf fanbase is. I think many of them can be attributed to Shanahan. This is a massive paraphrase, here, but in my recollection he has talked about the passion of the base, but he also talked about it as a habit, and how lockouts can make people change habits, and when you're a team like Toronto who wasn't good, it's an easy habit to break.

He also went on to talk about how there were fewer younger fans because the team had been so bad.

When put all of that together, it reinforces exactly what everyone knows. There used to be familial traditions, and you'd sit down and watch things as a family, and it just was what it was. It bred the passion.

I mean, when I was a kid, there was hockey only on Saturdays, and it wasn't always the Leafs. Then we got regional broadcasting and got Leaf games on Saturday. Then there were 2 games / week on some good weeks (but the Leafs were awful; you could see Kordic get kicked out of a game twice in one week!).

Now you can get all the games from all the teams. Why would someone willfully watch a sad sack team when there is good hockey out there?

Being a bad team for a prolonged period in this day and age is a recipe for disaster not something that anyone is going to celebrate.
- Monkeypunk

I think that was Dryden's words, not Shanny's.

Lemme do some digging.

might go with The Center For Hockeybuzz posters Who Can't Read Good And Wanna Learn To Do Other Stuff Good Too charity
- senstroll

And here I was, thinking every Leafs pick was a bust the moment their name was announced
- RickJames77

there are definitely some fanbases which believe this to be true...

but that is most notably the fans from the Wet Coast and the "nations capital"... for some reason, they seem to be particularly sensitive to anyone believing that any Leaf prospect might be okay.

definitely odd behavior

I think that was Dryden's words, not Shanny's.

Lemme do some digging.
- Atomic Wedgie

Dryden:

https://www.cbc.ca/sports...s-a-habit-dryden-1.565708

If Korshkov was drafted in 2014 when originally available, nobody would bat a (frank)ing eye that he's closer to bust than prospect. *cough* Tikhonov
- AdamFrench

It's not that he was drafted - it's that he was drafted with the 31st pick.

They easily could have taken him in the 4th round.

Dryden:

https://www.cbc.ca/sports...s-a-habit-dryden-1.565708
- Atomic Wedgie

I'll give you they were good in 1977-78.

Other than that?

1st round victories against LA, Pittsburgh, Pittsburgh, Atlanta.

That's pretty franking sad for a decade worth of work.
- Atomic Wedgie

they took the Flyers deep in their series with them two consecutive years in the years that the Flyers won the cup... even with them being hugely impacted by the WHA player vacuum.

not saying they were great...

and if anyone of the current younger Leafs fans believes that the team was "bad" in the post Sundin era... then they need to watch a few games from the mid-late 80s...
that was a whole other level of terrible.



- BorjeFan4Ever

Oh boy will I ever agree with this.

It's a discussion I've had several times with both non-Leafs fans and younger Leafs fans who don't quite understand why Wendel was held in such high regard here in Toronto.

The passion was dead in Toronto. Nobody gave a poop. Not the players, not the fans. Sure, we still showed up for the games, but I remember in high school buying greys from scalpers for $7.

But from the moment Wendel stepped on the ice for the first time, he gave a poop. He gave two poops. The teams may have been franking horrible (they were - oh Lordy Lordy Lordy they were), but he was the first guy who wanted to make them good again.

Good times.

OK, let's just go with your bizarre statement here.

Let's just pretend that watching a losing team is just as entertaining as watching a winning team.

Let's quantify that enjoyment. Let's give each game watched an arbitrary unit of one Ballard.

So according to your system, at the end of the year, a Leafs fan would have experienced 80-84 Ballard units of pleasure (as the number games per season has changed over the years).

Whether the team was good or bad, 80-84 Ballards. Winning doesn't matter.

But wait! A winning team would also play playoff games, extending the number of Ballards from anywhere between 4 and 28.

Fans of winning teams would always experience more Ballards, Max.

QED
- Atomic Wedgie

Lmfao Ballard unit

It's not that he was drafted - it's that he was drafted with the 31st pick.

They easily could have taken him in the 4th round.
- Atomic Wedgie

if he was a Hunter pick... then its likely the kid was photographed wearing a Knights jersey....

done deal...

and he almost certainly couldn't be a DoogieHowser pick... far too tall... and recent reports have him nearing 200lbs

no way Dubas takes a guy like that...

Oh boy will I ever agree with this.

It's a discussion I've had several times with both non-Leafs fans and younger Leafs fans who don't quite understand why Wendel was held in such high regard here in Toronto.

The passion was dead in Toronto. Nobody gave a poop. Not the players, not the fans. Sure, we still showed up for the games, but I remember in high school buying greys from scalpers for $7.

But from the moment Wendel stepped on the ice for the first time, he gave a poop. He gave two poops. The teams may have been franking horrible (they were - oh Lordy Lordy Lordy they were), but he was the first guy who wanted to make them good again.

Good times.
- Atomic Wedgie

100% Wendel dragged his teammates and the franchise back from the brink quite frankly... all those guys were so focused on cocaine, screwing each others wives/girl friends... the were fundamentally a group of pretty dumb guys...

the only people dumber than the players in that era... were Ballard and the management group

Lmfao Ballard unit
- Zezel

seriously devalued currency...

like Penny stock

I think that was Dryden's words, not Shanny's.

Lemme do some digging.
- Atomic Wedgie

Yes. That's right. But it resonated because it made so much sense. Unfortunately his time was very ineffective.

seriously devalued currency...

like Penny stock
- BorjeFan4Ever

Steve Penny? Habs fans remember him. 😉

100% Wendel dragged his teammates and the franchise back from the brink quite frankly... all those guys were so focused on cocaine, screwing each others wives/girl friends... the were fundamentally a group of pretty dumb guys...

the only people dumber than the players in that era... were Ballard and the management group
- BorjeFan4Ever

I still recall seeing old George Armstrong coaching the Leafs wondering if he'd fall asleep on the bench. Remember the Demers/Brophy rivalry? 😂

Steve Penny? Habs fans remember him. 😉
- gergeswillems

Unfortunately.