Are you really complaining that the Leafs no longer have Josh Leivo?

Really?

I mean, really?
- Atomic Wedgie

Leafs lost McElhinney because Dubas was so keen on holding on to Holl and Marincin. (while having Borgman and the other Swede still in AHL).
Then instead of trading Leivo earlier for a decent return, last minute they had to give him away.
bad management.
Yes, I liked and like Josh Leivo - never got a fair shot with the Leafs imo.

Leafs lost McElhinney because Dubas was so keen on holding on to Holl and Marincin. (while having Borgman and the other Swede still in AHL).
Then instead of trading Leivo earlier for a decent return, last minute they had to give him away.
bad management.
Yes, I liked and like Josh Leivo - never got a fair shot with the Leafs imo.
- MaximusAurelius

Your hate for Andreas Johnson makes me laugh.

Your hate for Andreas Johnson makes me laugh.
- mykokes

ha - I don't hate him; I was actually one of the first ones that said a few years ago that Johnsson should get a chance and that he would be a good serviceable mid-6 FW for Leafs.
I'm annoyed now though that people project him as a great scoring player that is not on the top of his development yet... put him on the 3rd line, and he'll get 35points max. He's basically similar to Connor Brown.

Your hate for Andreas Johnson makes me laugh.
- mykokes

The ease, at which he thinks a GM job in NHL is, makes me chuckle.

you mean the leafs management team that gave ceci 4.5mln?
johnsson over 3mln?
didn't sign Nylander until December 2018 ?
hasn't solved the backup goalie issue yet?
the management team holding onto Holl and Marincin in favor of McElhinney and Leivo?
the management team giving up Brown and Zaitsev and giving away 1st round picks as if it were candy..??
- MaximusAurelius

Ahhh theres that feeling again Thank you for being just a boy with a device that connects to the internet!

ha - I don't hate him; I was actually one of the first ones that said a few years ago that Johnsson should get a chance and that he would be a good serviceable mid-6 FW for Leafs.
I'm annoyed now though that people project him as a great scoring player that is not on the top of his development yet... put him on the 3rd line, and he'll get 35points max. He's basically similar to Connor Brown.
- MaximusAurelius

He averaged 13 min of ice time last year and scored 20 plus goals and 40 plus points. That's a full 3 min less than the avg. 3rd liner.
Brown actually played over 100 minutes more than Johnson last year.

He averaged 13 min of ice time last year and scored 20 plus goals and 40 plus points. That's a full 3 min less than the avg. 3rd liner.
- mykokes

got same time as Brown (3rd liner), while Brown was on PK and Johnsson getting almost 2mins on PP (6 points total). The point difference really isn't that big considering that (and Johnsson getting quite a bit of time at end of season with Matthews)..

p.s. I wish Johnson all the best and really hope he'll get 65+ points this year.
He seems like a nice guy.

Blizzards are the best.

Highest amount of "beautiful", with lowest amount of destruction.

And it's a great excuse to stay in, eat chili and drink wine.
- Atomic Wedgie

was used as a ransomware attack

got same time as Brown (3rd liner), while Brown was on PK and Johnsson getting almost 2mins on PP (6 points total). The point difference really isn't that big considering that (and Johnsson getting quite a bit of time at end of season with Matthews)..
- MaximusAurelius

73 20 23 43 13.40 0.59ppg
Is still greater than
82 8 21 29 13.48 0.34ppg.

p.s. I wish Johnson all the best and really hope he'll get 65+ points this year.
He seems like a nice guy.
- MaximusAurelius

50 is a likely number....which is much more than someone you labeled Matt frattin 2.0 should be able to get.

Leafs lost McElhinney because Dubas was so keen on holding on to Holl and Marincin. (while having Borgman and the other Swede still in AHL).
Then instead of trading Leivo earlier for a decent return, last minute they had to give him away.
bad management.
Yes, I liked and like Josh Leivo - never got a fair shot with the Leafs imo.
- MaximusAurelius

Leafs lost McElhinney because it was either him or Sparks being lost on waivers.

They elected to go with the younger guy, who had proved everything he could in the AHL.

With 20/20 hindsight, yes, they should have kept MakeASavey, but at the time, it was a calculated decision.

It had absolutely nothing to do with Leivo.

And speaking of doing nothing, Leivo got elevated minutes on Vancouver last year (2:37 in PPTOI/GP) and still only racked up 10 goals and 8 assists in 49 games.

If you like him so much, the Leafs could always re-sign him next year. He'll be a UFA, and I sincerely doubt there will be much demand from other teams.

Good article here https://www.pensionplanpu...y-ceci-over-jake-gardiner

The ease, at which he thinks a GM job in NHL is, makes me chuckle.
- bixll

Just like a complaining salesman getting in the big chair after a few years finding out how things are 'from the other side' ...

you mean the leafs management team that gave ceci 4.5mln?
johnsson over 3mln?
didn't sign Nylander until December 2018 ?
hasn't solved the backup goalie issue yet?
the management team holding onto Holl and Marincin in favor of McElhinney and Leivo?
the management team giving up Brown and Zaitsev and giving away 1st round picks as if it were candy..??
- MaximusAurelius

Whether you felt Johnsson was good initially or not, your take on him is poor. In the second half of last season, his 5v5 production was in with guys like Larkin, Couturier, Meier, and Gallagher to name a few. Financial models - like the Evolving Wild one - had him projected for a higher cost over the same term.

Nylander was asking for $8.5m and didn't get it. He ended up coming down to $7.3m on a prorated caphit of $6.9m. That's a win. This retroactive idea that all Nylander ever wanted was $7m is revisionist bunk.

Keeping 3 goalies doesn't work. They made a decision. Everyone basically agreed that you need to show faith in your development system to reward the players, and reward the system. For the record, if you look at my old posts, I _hated_ Sparks. He didn't (and doesn't) look like a goalie. Again, it was a good organizational decision that didn't work out. It may have cost them 2 wins.

It wasn't just this management team that didn't give Leivo a shot. Maybe at 26 years old, what you see is what you get? A 6'2 kid who's an okay passer with an above average shot, and an okay nose for the net, who's okay at checking on the boards, and a below average skater? So you, know. Leivo's okay.

GIVING UP Zaitsev? Getting rid of Zaitsev is good. 1 year of Ceci may suck. It may not. But 1 year of Ceci for 5 years of Zaitsev is a win.

1 1st rd pick buys you at least 2 years of a top-4 D-Man that everyone so desperately claimed we needed but when we get one everyone female doges about it.

1 1st rd pick buys you the ability to keep Mitch Marner. It also bought out a mistake by the previous management group that let's us get rid of a guy who no one is willing to sign for the league minimum right now.

If you want to stand on the mountaintop and yell about Dubas, sure McElhinney turned out poorly, but it wasn't really costly. Trading a couple of 21-30 draft picks may hurt us, but if they score on the later picks, it may not hurt so bad.

he's been GM for CSKA in KHL for 6 years now..
he knows the NHL due to his player experience - and all NHL knows and respects him as well.
He'll be a very good GM in NHL soon.
- MaximusAurelius

Dubas was a GM of an OHL team where most NHL players come from. If you arent an NHL GM, you are a rookie GM...

- RickJames77

He just told me: "kill yourself, it's midday you should be worried."

73 20 23 43 13.40 0.59ppg
Is still greater than
82 8 21 29 13.48 0.34ppg.
- mykokes

Careful, brining up PPG stats kills his argument about Marner being higher scoring that Matthews

He just told me: "kill yourself, it's midday you should be worried."


- 21peter

I am disappointed he wasn't thinking of me at 3am.

I could just imagine Dildo singing

"And she says baby
It's three a.m. I must be lonely
When she says baby
Well I can't help but be scared of it all sometimes
And the rain's gonna wash away I believe it"

Leafs lost McElhinney because Dubas was so keen on holding on to Holl and Marincin. (while having Borgman and the other Swede still in AHL).
Then instead of trading Leivo earlier for a decent return, last minute they had to give him away.
bad management.
Yes, I liked and like Josh Leivo - never got a fair shot with the Leafs imo.
- MaximusAurelius

McElhinney and leivo?

if these are your complaints, that should tell you he is doing a decent job

McElhinney and leivo?

if these are your complaints, that should tell you he is doing a decent job
- senstroll

Federov would have found a way to get Bobrovsky to backup Anderson as he is respected in the KHL

McElhinney and leivo?

if these are your complaints, that should tell you he is doing a decent job
- senstroll

I know Garret Sparks sucked last year, but it's not like that's the reason you lost a 7 game series to the Bruins. The McBackup thing is blown out of proportion IMO.

Whether you felt Johnsson was good initially or not, your take on him is poor. In the second half of last season, his 5v5 production was in with guys like Larkin, Couturier, Meier, and Gallagher to name a few. Financial models - like the Evolving Wild one - had him projected for a higher cost over the same term.

Nylander was asking for $8.5m and didn't get it. He ended up coming down to $7.3m on a prorated caphit of $6.9m. That's a win. This retroactive idea that all Nylander ever wanted was $7m is revisionist bunk.

Keeping 3 goalies doesn't work. They made a decision. Everyone basically agreed that you need to show faith in your development system to reward the players, and reward the system. For the record, if you look at my old posts, I _hated_ Sparks. He didn't (and doesn't) look like a goalie. Again, it was a good organizational decision that didn't work out. It may have cost them 2 wins.

It wasn't just this management team that didn't give Leivo a shot. Maybe at 26 years old, what you see is what you get? A 6'2 kid who's an okay passer with an above average shot, and an okay nose for the net, who's okay at checking on the boards, and a below average skater? So you, know. Leivo's okay.

GIVING UP Zaitsev? Getting rid of Zaitsev is good. 1 year of Ceci may suck. It may not. But 1 year of Ceci for 5 years of Zaitsev is a win.

1 1st rd pick buys you at least 2 years of a top-4 D-Man that everyone so desperately claimed we needed but when we get one everyone female doges about it.

1 1st rd pick buys you the ability to keep Mitch Marner. It also bought out a mistake by the previous management group that let's us get rid of a guy who no one is willing to sign for the league minimum right now.

If you want to stand on the mountaintop and yell about Dubas, sure McElhinney turned out poorly, but it wasn't really costly. Trading a couple of 21-30 draft picks may hurt us, but if they score on the later picks, it may not hurt so bad.
- Monkeypunk

Well this pretty accurately sums it up.

Federov would have found a way to get Bobrovsky to backup Anderson as he is respected in the KHL
- Archaic

Nevermind that, Shanahan made a big mistake not easily getting Poile out of perennial underachievers Nashville Predators