JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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Pittsburgh and Washington considered defense-first teams? - PatC80
He said as often. That's two teams. There are more teams that did it the other way or at least balanced terms. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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Its the coaches job to get the players to play the way he wants.
I understand that a PP goal counts just the same. Its just that PP/PK in a short series can really swing and coaching is a big part. Maybe he got out coached? - senstroll
His assistants got fired for a reason and they were in charge of the special teams.
He can't put players that he doesn't have. The majority of the team is young, small, skill and speed players. He doesn't have a lot of variety in the types of players he has to put out there. If he had 3 more Hymans, you know he'd put them out there. |
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PatC80
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I would never let my children play hockey. The risk of getting drafted by Edmonton is too high", ON Joined: 08.11.2011
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He said as often. That's two teams. There are more teams that did it the other way or at least balanced terms. - JohnFergusonJr
those are two recent examples.. Look at the Oilers in the 80's and the Penguins in the early 90's, or heck the Red Wings as well, with their forward group in the 90's/early 2000's. It happens sometimes. There is no set formula to winning the Stanley Cup.
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PatC80
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I would never let my children play hockey. The risk of getting drafted by Edmonton is too high", ON Joined: 08.11.2011
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His assistants got fired for a reason and they were in charge of the special teams.
He can't put players that he doesn't have. The majority of the team is young, small, skill and speed players. He doesn't have a lot of variety in the types of players he has to put out there. If he had 3 more Hymans, you know he'd put them out there. - JohnFergusonJr
Or, he can but didn't use them properly.. (ie; Hyman taking faceoffs against Patrice Bergeron) |
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senstroll
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Location: Leafs AAV Champs, ON Joined: 02.22.2008
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His assistants got fired for a reason and they were in charge of the special teams.
He can't put players that he doesn't have. The majority of the team is young, small, skill and speed players. He doesn't have a lot of variety in the types of players he has to put out there. If he had 3 more Hymans, you know he'd put them out there. - JohnFergusonJr
Also a problem, when you have Polak and Martin and Hainsey he tends to play them a lot. I think most coaches have a blind spot for players that are good ol boys and probably super great guys in the room..but have lost a step. GMs are forced to move on from them because they are just not that good anymore. the coach plays them too much (Marleau) |
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The Shrike
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Toronto Joined: 11.17.2007
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That's false. - JohnFergusonJr
In the last 5 years, the team that scored more goals for in the regular season won 41 playoff series, and the team that allowed less goals against won 41 playoff series.
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lumlums
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: ON Joined: 06.25.2011
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those are two recent examples.. Look at the Oilers in the 80's and the Penguins in the early 90's, or heck the Red Wings as well, with their forward group in the 90's/early 2000's. It happens sometimes. There is no set formula to winning the Stanley Cup. - PatC80
Plus it's hard to even look at ten years ago as a reasonable example given how much the game has changed since then. My bet is in 5-10 years the young and fast teams will win more, allowing perception to change... |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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those are two recent examples.. Look at the Oilers in the 80's and the Penguins in the early 90's, or heck the Red Wings as well, with their forward group in the 90's/early 2000's. It happens sometimes. There is no set formula to winning the Stanley Cup. - PatC80
Two recent examples that are outnumbered by the others. St. Louis, Boston, Chicago, Anaheim, New Jersey and Detroit all had outstanding defenses and defenders on their team both up front and on the blueline. Yeah, some of those teams scored a lot of goals too but they didn't rely solely on their offense to win the Cup.
There is definitely a pattern that Cup winning teams have in common. It's not always exactly the same year to year but there's definitely common threads between most winners.
You mentioned the Oilers and Penguins of the 80s and 90s. You mentioned earlier the Penguins of the 2010s and Washington. Those teams had the best player in the league and of the generation on them. That's a common thread right there; the best player in the world usually wins a Cup. |
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RickJames77
Boston Bruins |
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Location: We’re Too Old, Boston Joined: 04.03.2013
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Plus it's hard to even look at ten years ago as a reasonable example given how much the game has changed since then. My bet is in 5-10 years the young and fast teams will win more, allowing perception to change... - lumlums
Even then you'll eventually see the pendulum swing back. This poop is often cyclical IMO. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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Or, he can but didn't use them properly.. (ie; Hyman taking faceoffs against Patrice Bergeron) - PatC80
100% his fault, for sure.
But then again, maybe that's his message to the team. Maybe he was telling them, I'd rather lose with the guy who plays the way I tell him to than put someone else out there who doesn't. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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Also a problem, when you have Polak and Martin and Hainsey he tends to play them a lot. I think most coaches have a blind spot for players that are good ol boys and probably super great guys in the room..but have lost a step. GMs are forced to move on from them because they are just not that good anymore. the coach plays them too much (Marleau) - senstroll
Yeah, I don't think anybody, including Babcock wants poop players. Everybody wants good players who make smart plays. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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In the last 5 years, the team that scored more goals for in the regular season won 41 playoff series, and the team that allowed less goals against won 41 playoff series. - The Shrike
That's incredibly simplistic and doesn't even come close to proving your point. |
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bobbyisno1
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'm excited to see that Joined: 08.28.2010
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In the last 5 years, the team that scored more goals for in the regular season won 41 playoff series, and the team that allowed less goals against won 41 playoff series. - The Shrike
but there were only 75 playoff series.... |
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aminnes
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Mrs. Buzzkill, AB Joined: 12.17.2008
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those are two recent examples.. Look at the Oilers in the 80's and the Penguins in the early 90's, or heck the Red Wings as well, with their forward group in the 90's/early 2000's. It happens sometimes. There is no set formula to winning the Stanley Cup. - PatC80
Those Detroit teams had good defensemen though, hall of famers. And the Oilers had Huddy, Lowe and Smith, good homers. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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but there were only 75 playoff series.... - bobbyisno1
8 in the 1st round, 4 in the 2nd round, 2 in the 3rd round and 1 final.
15 per year over 5 years is 75.
Math checks out. |
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JohnFergusonJr
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I'd be happy with Che Guevara; hero of the Cuban revolution. - Canada Cup aka AOCC Joined: 01.14.2011
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Those Detroit teams had good defensemen though, hall of famers. And the Oilers had Huddy, Lowe and Smith, good homers. - aminnes
Even Montreal dynasties had the best defenses.
Everybody has to score goals to win and everybody has to defend to hold leads. It's obvious any winning team needs to do both. Teams that only defend end up losing eventually just like teams that only attack lose eventually. The point being made here is the Leafs pay too much attention to one and not the other. They need more balance. |
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aminnes
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Mrs. Buzzkill, AB Joined: 12.17.2008
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Even Montreal dynasties had the best defenses.
Everybody has to score goals to win and everybody has to defend to hold leads. It's obvious any winning team needs to do both. Teams that only defend end up losing eventually just like teams that only attack lose eventually. The point being made here is the Leafs pay too much attention to one and not the other. They need more balance. - JohnFergusonJr
They have been that way for a very long time. Closest thing they had to a balanced team was 93 and 94. (frank)ing Kerry Fraser. |
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Steven_Seagull
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Mitch Marner sucks Joined: 03.03.2016
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Leafs will never win because reasons. |
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The Shrike
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Toronto Joined: 11.17.2007
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That's incredibly simplistic and doesn't even come close to proving your point. - JohnFergusonJr
It certainly doesn't disprove it.
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PatC80
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I would never let my children play hockey. The risk of getting drafted by Edmonton is too high", ON Joined: 08.11.2011
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Plus it's hard to even look at ten years ago as a reasonable example given how much the game has changed since then. My bet is in 5-10 years the young and fast teams will win more, allowing perception to change... - lumlums
Exactly... JFJ's memory doesn't extend beyond the Blues winnig the Cup last season |
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Steven_Seagull
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Mitch Marner sucks Joined: 03.03.2016
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Four games into the season and the Leafs have already been eliminated from the playoffs for the next 5 years...typical Laffs. |
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The Shrike
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Toronto Joined: 11.17.2007
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but there were only 75 playoff series.... - bobbyisno1
Sometimes teams are better in both categories.
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PatC80
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: I would never let my children play hockey. The risk of getting drafted by Edmonton is too high", ON Joined: 08.11.2011
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Four games into the season and the Leafs have already been eliminated from the playoffs for the next 5 years...typical Laffs. - Steven_Seagull
I hate when that happens..
I had a feeling that this was going to be our year and then we lost to the Habs in a shootout. Everything changed. Now, we're done. |
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Steven_Seagull
Toronto Maple Leafs |
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Location: Mitch Marner sucks Joined: 03.03.2016
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I hate when that happens..
I had a feeling that this was going to be our year and then we lost to the Habs in a shootout. Everything changed. Now, we're done. - PatC80
Yep, sucks. Blow it up, but don’t try to build properly. Won’t matter anyway. |
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BINGO!
Carolina Hurricanes |
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Location: I'll always remember the last words my grandfather ever told me. He said, "A Truck!", SK Joined: 09.21.2009
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those are two recent examples.. Look at the Oilers in the 80's and the Penguins in the early 90's, or heck the Red Wings as well, with their forward group in the 90's/early 2000's. It happens sometimes. There is no set formula to winning the Stanley Cup. - PatC80
It's more about luck and staying healthy than anything else. |
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