People make it sound like Ghost is single handedly sinking the team D, but the cold hard fact is the team's only been scored on 1 time when he's been on the ice so far. Based on expected goals #'s, he's been helping effectively limit scoring chance quality too.

The puck gaffes and turnovers stick out in people's minds, but overall he's not the problem defensively. On the other hand, Braun has been peppered with goals and chances, Prov's been on the ice for a lot of GA and Sanheim's been shaky.
- Tomahawk

I agree with what you're saying here but I've read numerous comments stating that Gostisbehere has been fine defensively. It's his play offensively that needs to get better.

Anything relating to Corsi has been dead for 3 years now

I know people have written articles over and over trying to sell every type of Corsi breakdown from adjusted to danger zone attempts, but the at the end of the day it is based off SHOT ATTEMPTS. Others read these articles and think sure that makes so much sense because they wrote lots of numbers so it must be accurate, but it is based off a FORECASTING FORMULA, not a who is good and who is bad formula.

If Corsi was used in baseball then it would be the equivalent to every time a teammate clapped his hands in the dugout the batter's on base percentage went up, but if a fielder scratched his nuts then it goes down. It really is that logically flawed.

If the argument that any player is good or bad starts with Corsi rating then it ended before it began.
- Glak18

Absolutely. It's still widely used by NHL analysts because it makes them feel like they can look at any player in the league and offer an opinion. It is and always has been a badly flawed stat. Any derivative of it is the same. NHL teams stopped using Corsi a long time ago.

Cool hes also bad by the eye test and most other stats. People argue Hagg is good because he limits the other teams time in the offensive zone. There is nothing- not eye, normal stats, or "advanced" stats- to support this glorified ideal of him
- bulet13

He's a #6 NHL defenseman. All players on that level are flawed. He's fine in his role which is why he is in the starting 6.

Cool hes also bad by the eye test and most other stats. People argue Hagg is good because he limits the other teams time in the offensive zone. There is nothing- not eye, normal stats, or "advanced" stats- to support this glorified ideal of him
- bulet13

Yup Hagg is a glorified 6/7 defensive defenseman that fills a role not many on the team does or willing to do, which is why multiple head coaches have had him consistently slotted in the top 6 for years now.

I get it, some fans want the Flyers to have 6 or 7 top 4 Bobby Orr smooth skating new age transitional puck movers, but unfortunately no current NHL team or team from the past has ever had that...EVER. The best of the best defensive cores in the NHL all use these players...Calgary has them, Carolina has them, Tampa has them...umm St. Louis won the cup with them.

But again at the end of the day someone has to be hated and the best place to start is the 6/7 defenseman or some 4th liner.

Yup Hagg is a glorified 6/7 defensive defenseman that fills a role not many on the team does or willing to do, which is why multiple head coaches have had him consistently slotted in the top 6 for years now.

I get it, some fans want the Flyers to have 6 or 7 top 4 Bobby Orr smooth skating new age transitional puck movers, but unfortunately no current NHL team or team from the past has ever had that...EVER. The best of the best defensive cores in the NHL all use these players...Calgary has them, Carolina has them, Tampa has them...umm St. Louis won the cup with them.

But again at the end of the day someone has to be hated and the best place to start is the 6/7 defenseman or some 4th liner.
- Glak18

I'd actually like to blame Jesus, if you don't mind.

Edit: Actually, more God than Jesus. If God didn't give Hagg free will, then he wouldn't be able to make these terrible choices.

Yup Hagg is a glorified 6/7 defensive defenseman that fills a role not many on the team does or willing to do, which is why multiple head coaches have had him consistently slotted in the top 6 for years now.

I get it, some fans want the Flyers to have 6 or 7 top 4 Bobby Orr smooth skating new age transitional puck movers, but unfortunately no current NHL team or team from the past has ever had that...EVER. The best of the best defensive cores in the NHL all use these players...Calgary has them, Carolina has them, Tampa has them...umm St. Louis won the cup with them.

But again at the end of the day someone has to be hated and the best place to start is the 6/7 defenseman or some 4th liner.
- Glak18

Who on carolina is equivalent to Hagg? I have nothing against a player who plays like Hagg. Hagg is bad at his purported job. I dont think it's too much to ask to have 6 defenders who can make a simple pass which he struggles to do regularly

Who on carolina is equivalent to Hagg? I have nothing against a player who plays like Hagg. Hagg is bad at his purported job. I dont think it's too much to ask to have 6 defenders who can make a simple pass which he struggles to do regularly
- bulet13

TvR

Who on carolina is equivalent to Hagg? I have nothing against a player who plays like Hagg. Hagg is bad at his purported job. I dont think it's too much to ask to have 6 defenders who can make a simple pass which he struggles to do regularly
- bulet13

If what you state is true about Haag, then why is he in the lineup?

If what you state is true about Haag, then why is he in the lineup?
- MJL

I think he is on the lineup ahead of Myers because they could have sent myers down without exposing him to waivers

Previously he was on the lineup because they didnt have anyone better

I am not convinced Morin is better than hagg

Who on carolina is equivalent to Hagg? I have nothing against a player who plays like Hagg. Hagg is bad at his purported job. I dont think it's too much to ask to have 6 defenders who can make a simple pass which he struggles to do regularly
- bulet13

edmundson or fluery would be the only ones in the realm of equivalent.

hagg is fine in the 5-6 role.

I think he is on the lineup ahead of Myers because they could have sent myers down without exposing him to waivers

Previously he was on the lineup because they didnt have anyone better

I am not convinced Morin is better than hagg
- bulet13

Think about what you're saying here. You claim that Haag is not good at his job. You're insinuating that Myers is better? I don't want to mischaracterize anything you state. So based on that, you're telling me that the Flyers sent the better player to the minors because they don't want to risk losing a player who is not good at his job on waivers? Am I reading that correctly?

I'd actually like to blame Jesus, if you don't mind.

Edit: Actually, more God than Jesus. If God didn't give Hagg free will, then he wouldn't be able to make these terrible choices.
- jmatchett383

Dont let God off the hook with tricking us into thinking getting the #2 pick was a blessing just to have him hav out indefinately due to migraine disorder. We could have had a later pick that would be healthy right now.

Dont let God off the hook with tricking us into thinking getting the #2 pick was a blessing just to have him hav out indefinately due to migraine disorder. We could have had a later pick that would be healthy right now.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

We shouldn't have tanked the season to get the #2 pick.

Wait, what...

Who on carolina is equivalent to Hagg? I have nothing against a player who plays like Hagg. Hagg is bad at his purported job. I dont think it's too much to ask to have 6 defenders who can make a simple pass which he struggles to do regularly
- bulet13

You should watch more of Brett Pesce and his style of game, but the biggest difference is he is super awesome and Hagg is super sucky.

It all comes down to bias, the same complaints of Hagg chucking ducks along the boards or missing a pass for an icing can be said about Ghost or Provorov and Sanheim. Then again the struggles that Sanheim has had over the last couple years is because he is still young, but how old do you think Hagg is? People act like Hagg is some 35 year old vet.

The amount of times I have heard Hagg mentioned on a TSN broadcasts or by fans of other teams asking if he would be available, yet Flyer fans call him the worst player in the NHL. I mean his teammates must hate him because they were stepping over each other on the bench to congratulate him on that PK a few games ago.

We may have to entertain the idea of trading Ghost. If he isnt improving he may need a change in scenery. Maybe the pressure of this fan base is getting to him. I mean we are fickle as f***. Ghost was the best one year and know he is wanted dead, and mutilated.

You should watch more of Brett Pesce and his style of game, but the biggest difference is he is super awesome and Hagg is super sucky.

It all comes down to bias, the same complaints of Hagg chucking ducks along the boards or missing a pass for an icing can be said about Ghost or Provorov and Sanheim. Then again the struggles that Sanheim has had over the last couple years is because he is still young, but how old do you think Hagg is? People act like Hagg is some 35 year old vet.

The amount of times I have heard Hagg mentioned on a TSN broadcasts or by fans of other teams asking if he would be available, yet Flyer fans call him the worst player in the NHL. I mean his teammates must hate him because they were stepping over each other on the bench to congratulate him on that PK a few games ago.
- Glak18

You lost all credibility when you compared Pesce to Hagg

We may have to entertain the idea of trading Ghost. If he isnt improving he may need a change in scenery. Maybe the pressure of this fan base is getting to him. I mean we are fickle as f***. Ghost was the best one year and know he is wanted dead, and mutilated.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

If the pressure of the fan base is getting to him then yes, we should immediately trade him. Or any other player who is that weak mentally.

You lost all credibility when you compared Pesce to Hagg
- bulet13

Really, with the reasoning you just gave for why Haag is in the lineup?

Really, with the reasoning you just gave for why Haag is in the lineup?
- MJL

Your reasoning is that coaches play him so he must be good and you laugh at my reasoning?

Pretty sure bill and others have mentioned the fact that Myers can pass through waivers as a reason the team dropped him to Lehigh Valley

Also, fletcher made the decision to keep Hagg over Myers, not AV. AV can only play the players he has available so he plays Hagg

You lost all credibility when you compared Pesce to Hagg
- bulet13

Let me guess....Pesce is head and shoulders above because he is a great skating puck moving boom shooter?

If the pressure of the fan base is getting to him then yes, we should immediately trade him. Or any other player who is that weak mentally.
- MJL

It happens. There are players that dont succeed on big market teams. How many guys in the past have left a big market like Toronto or Philly and succeeded? We have seen many leave us and succeed elsewhere.

Luongo is an example of one. Was great in Florida, left for Vancouver and he died, went back to Florida and was great again until his age caught up to him. It has nothing to do with being weak mentally. Every fanbase has a whipping boy and as much as players pretend they ignore it, the cant.

It happens. There are players that dont succeed on big market teams. How many guys in the past have left a big market like Toronto or Philly and succeeded? We have seen many leave us and succeed elsewhere.

Luongo is an example of one. Was great in Florida, left for Vancouver and he died, went back to Florida and was great again until his age caught up to him. It has nothing to do with being weak mentally. Every fanbase has a whipping boy and as much as players pretend they ignore it, the cant.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Luongo was really good in vancouver? His save percentage was the exact same in Vancouver as in Florida and his GAA was lower in vancouver...

Let me guess....Pesce is head and shoulders above because he is a great skating puck moving boom shooter?


- Glak18

Pesce and Hagg are quite different. Pesce produces more, isnt a physical and is Carolina's 2nd pair Dman compared to Hagg as 3rd pair. If you offered Carolina Hagg for Pesce they would laugh and hang up on you.

Luongo was really good in vancouver? His save percentage was the exact same in Vancouver as in Florida and his GAA was lower in vancouver...
- bulet13

OK poor example. Thought he did worse than that.

Per Ek Jamie Benn is in Play,
Ghot, Jake, #1 round pick for Jamie Benn and Cogliano?
edit : Maybe adding the first is too much?