If Murray showed the same patience Botts has, instead of debating about who is better between Eichel and Matthews we could very well be talking about how lucky we are to have both.
- Pegullaville

Possible
How would the defense look though
Bc we definitely wouldn’t have gotten Dahlin

pretty sure my source either doesn't know what hockeybuzz is, or doesn't care


he's 20 plus years older then me and I am not young like most of you f@ckers



- homiedclown

True, used to know a few guys with in the organizations at a golf course who after a few pops would give away all the information.
Harry Neale was very loose with the tongue on how he felt.

I feel like i never get a straight answer from you when u bring this up

You’ve said,
we should tank until we get enough talent in place to be able to contend with the upper end teams
Tampa, Boston, the Caps, etc

Are we there now?
Or should we tank again?
- jdfitz77

I don’t think the team should tank again. I think Botts just has to make the hockey trade and move out of a defenceman for a top 6 forward and we can complete for the playoffs.

We do need another “top end” forward though and having some Hurricanes type luck and winning a top 2 pick after finishing close to a playoff spot would also be nice.

Byfield or Lafreniere would solve one of our top 6 forward dilemma’s though.

if darcy paid peca a few more dollars, hasek probably would have remained and retired a sabre
- homiedclown

Kick me when I'm down, clown!

I feel like i never get a straight answer from you when u bring this up

You’ve said,
we should tank until we get enough talent in place to be able to contend with the upper end teams
Tampa, Boston, the Caps, etc

Are we there now?
Or should we tank again?
- jdfitz77

IMO they are close as far as having young players with top end talent...will take Dahlin a couple more years until he is dominant, same for Mitts and Cozens to develop into a stronger player.
So time is required more than more core players...although I'd certainly take another.

Now, they need to find additional complimentary players.

True, used to know a few guys with in the organizations at a golf course who after a few pops would give away all the information.
Harry Neale was very loose with the tongue on how he felt.
- hubie

my source got a lot of info when uncle harry worked


very loose tongue was an understatement

if darcy paid peca a few more dollars, hasek probably would have remained and retired a sabre
- homiedclown

Or he would have been traded in a fire sale two years later after Rigas went to jail.

Skinner at 48 points for 9 million is a disaster.
- ImThatGuy

And yet not WAY out of line for where he historically ends up. I'd still expect him to break 50 points, but he's averaged a 55~ point pace for his career so 48 is just as far a departure from his average as 63 is.

my source got a lot of info when uncle harry worked


very loose tongue was an understatement
- homiedclown

IM no angel when it comes to this... but how did he never get a dui? Drank like a fish all summer.

I don’t think the team should tank again. I think Botts just has to make the hockey trade and move out of a defenceman for a top 6 forward and we can complete for the playoffs.

We do need another “top end” forward though and having some Hurricanes type luck and winning a top 2 pick after finishing close to a playoff spot would also be nice.

Byfield or Lafreniere would solve one of our top 6 forward dilemma’s though.
- Pegullaville

So (example) Risto for a top6 forward,
+ Cozens next year,
puts us in the class of Cup Contenders?


Bc your “tank argument” was that we need to acquire the talent to be a Cup Contender,
not just a playoff contender

I don’t think the team should tank again. I think Botts just has to make the hockey trade and move out of a defenceman for a top 6 forward and we can complete for the playoffs.

We do need another “top end” forward though and having some Hurricanes type luck and winning a top 2 pick after finishing close to a playoff spot would also be nice.

Byfield or Lafreniere would solve one of our top 6 forward dilemma’s though.
- Pegullaville

I know this is incredibly superficial, but if one of my team's key players had the first name "Alexis" I would be more than a little embarrassed.

IMO they are close as far as having young players with top end talent...will take Dahlin a couple more years until he is dominant, same for Mitts and Cozens to develop into a stronger player.
So time is required more than more core players...although I'd certainly take another.

Now, they need to find additional complimentary players.
- IonSabres

So then why are u constantly on here saying Botts needs to make moves?

Or he would have been traded in a fire sale two years later after Rigas went to jail.
- buffalofan19

Plus if they werent bad they could have become more valuable and thus sold to another market.

And yet not WAY out of line for where he historically ends up. I'd still expect him to break 50 points, but he's averaged a 55~ point pace for his career so 48 is just as far a departure from his average as 63 is.
- BINGO!

As long as the vast majority remain goals (and especially 5v5) I won't complain. He's very good at one of the hardest parts of the game and is being rewarded for it.

So (example) Risto for a top6 forward,
+ Cozens next year,
puts us in the class of Cup Contenders?


Bc your “tank argument” was that we need to acquire the talent to be a Cup Contender,
not just a playoff contender
- jdfitz77

I'd be surprised if Risto alone would drive that type of high-end talent, so would need to add to that. Probably a decent player and maybe a pick.

I don't think it is next season as a contender either, as Cozens, Dahlin, Mitts, VO and others will need further development time.
But those additions should move them close.

What isn't discussed here, but is important as well is the replacement of other players through FA signings and internal promotions in Tage, Asplund, Davidsson, 6K.

In the East,
3 teams are a lock for the playoffs imo:
Washington, Boston, Tampa

With 8 teams fighting for the final 5 spots:
Buffalo, Toronto, Montreal, Florida
Pittsburgh, Carolina, Ny Isles, Philly

Out of it, or at least very unlikely:
Detroit, Ottawa, NyRangers, Jersey, Columbus

In the East,
3 teams are a lock for the playoffs imo
Washington, Boston, Tampa

With 8 teams fighting for the final 5 spots
Buffalo, Toronto, Montreal, Florida
Pittsburgh, Carolina, Ny Isles, Philly
- jdfitz77

Yup. Tonight's actually a pretty big game. Either stay in the picture or start falling out of it. Bolt down the nacho bar

So then why are u constantly on here saying Botts needs to make moves?
- jdfitz77

Because your statement was about high-end players, which I interpret to be of the Eichel, Sam, Dahlin level. And I hope Cozens develops there along with Mitts getting there eventually.
Guys with ~70 pts thereabouts. Keep in mind you premise was for another high-end player to be added via Risto (example trade). So Eichel, Sam, Skinner, Mitts, Cozens, Dahlin, "plus-one" is 7 (Edit - hopefully VO finds himself on the cusp as well..in that 55 pt range)

I'm talking about complimentary players as well for line 3 primarily..in the 35 -45 pt range. Or a 2nd pairing type..but I think they are pretty solid there on D. Again, the need is Forward.

This is EXACTLY consistent to what I have been saying...upgrading Vesey, Sobotka, Sheary.
The internal promotions may fill 1 or 2 of those, and upgrade the 4th line.

In the East,
3 teams are a lock for the playoffs imo:
Washington, Boston, Tampa

With 8 teams fighting for the final 5 spots:
Buffalo, Toronto, Montreal, Florida
Pittsburgh, Carolina, Ny Isles, Philly

Out of it, or at least very unlikely:
Detroit, Ottawa, NyRangers, Jersey, Columbus
- jdfitz77

Bos TOr TB
Was NY Tight for 3rd

WC- Buf,MTL ,FLA,Phi,Pitt,Car (of these last 3 1 makes in as the top 3)

I'd be surprised if Risto alone would drive that type of high-end talent, so would need to add to that. Probably a decent player and maybe a pick.

I don't think it is next season as a contender either, as Cozens, Dahlin, Mitts, VO and others will need further development time.
But those additions should move them close.

What isn't discussed here, but is important as well is the replacement of other players through FA signings and internal promotions in Tage, Asplund, Davidsson, 6K.
- IonSabres

We mostly agree

Even though u blast me for not being in the “Botts do something” category

Bc here’s the thing...
since he hasn’t made a trade yet, i don’t think that he can do something NOW that helps us become Cup Contenders for the long haul



To your upgrade Sheary, Vesey, etc point...
Maybe he can get a Toffoli that would help now?
(or maybe that player would be another bust like Vesey, Berglund, Miller?, Sheary?, Sobotka)



So the point i keep trying to hammer home is that I’d MUCH rather Botts wait, and end getting an “Ehlers” instead of pulling the trigger NOW to get another “Tage” or even a “Roslovic”

If someone like Toffoli is available for a mid round pick, or Cj Smith type prospects, then cool
But there’s still the Cap to work out with that kind of move too

I just don’t think it’s nearly as clear cut,
or easy,
as many on here are screaming for it to be


I do want us to go for the playoffs this year

But i don’t want it to be at the expense of making a lesser trade out of desperation instead of making a good one that can help us for years to come

Bos TOr TB
Was NY Tight for 3rd

WC- Buf,MTL ,FLA,Phi,Pitt,Car (of these last 3 1 makes in as the top 3)
- hubie

I’m not sold on the Leafs as a playoff team anymore
Still could be, just not a lock

And i probably should write in the Isles,
but i wonder how long the magic of Trotz really can last?
Bc their talent looks more like a team that’s competing for a spot, not a lock

I’m not sold on the Leafs as a playoff team anymore
Still could be, just not a lock

And i probably should write in the Isles,
but i wonder how long the magic of Trotz really can last?
Bc their talent looks more like a team that’s competing for a spot, not a lock
- jdfitz77

For me its match them up against everyone else (after saying Bos and TB) and the talent isnt close. So if they even miss the top 3 thats too much talent to not get a wild card.

NYI, have games in hand on others so unless they Sabres esk run of losing thats another team who started off so well it will be hard to fall out.

For me its match them up against everyone else (after saying Bos and TB) and the talent isnt close. So if they even miss the top 3 thats too much talent to not get a wild card.

NYI, have games in hand on others so unless they Sabres esk run of losing thats another team who started off so well it will be hard to fall out.
- hubie

You’re probably right about both
But I’m just not sold on them being a sure thing

We mostly agree

Even though u blast me for not being in the “Botts do something” category

Bc here’s the thing...
since he hasn’t made a trade yet, i don’t think that he can do something NOW that helps us become Cup Contenders for the long haul

Maybe he can get a Toffoli that would help now?
(or maybe that player would be another bust like Vesey, Berglund, Miller?, Sheary?, Sobotka)

So the point i keep trying to hammer home is that I’d MUCH rather Botts wait, and end getting an “Ehlers” instead of pulling the trigger NOW to get another “Tage” or even a “Roslovic”

If someone like Toffoli is available for a mid round pick, or Cj Smith type prospects, then cool
But there’s still the Cap to work out with that kind of move

I just don’t think it’s nearly as clear cut,
or easy,
as many on here are screaming for it to be

I do want us to go for the playoffs this year

But i don’t want it to be at the expense of making a lesser trade out of desperation instead of making a good one that can help us for years to come
- jdfitz77

And to be clear, I am not in the Trade Now, nor Trade for Anybody category. NEVER have said it, nor inferred it. In fact I have said that I'm looking closer to the Xmas break...that will be about 48 games in.

Now, with that clear, I also don't want a player who will be outside of their prime when our window opens. A guy like Hall would be fun, but will also be 30 or 31 at that time...and carrying g a crazy CAP hit.
That is the challenge for Botts. It isn't easy..nor was it a shock just being revealed now...it has been a need for a year, through a TDL, through the Offseason, and now into this season. He needs to find it this season...for the team's sake AND because the numbers at D are forcing his hand soon enough.

100 level tickets, Center ice. $34.

#theseguysaregood