After watching the Sharks do it last year or even how a team like Nashville has been though, it's a dream I'd like to shoot for. Probably won't happen in a trade, but there are a lot of potential Schultz upgrades on teams that have serious questions about signing them: Pietrangelo, Krug, Barrie, Shattenkirk (still saying this, he's rebounded).

I'd just like to see to see this forward group with a second stud defenseman if possible, buy I'll concede what they have is good enough, and it would be hard to change it up now.
- Tojo.

I just have a hard time believing there will be an abundance of options to replace and/or upgrade Schultz.

While Im a fan of Marino, unless he starts showing more scoring prowess he’s not the guy to usurp Schultz unless they got a guy like that on LD putting Petts to the third pair which isn’t the worst thing the world.

I just have a hard time believing there will be an abundance of options to replace and/or upgrade Schultz.

While Im a fan of Marino, unless he starts showing more scoring prowess he’s not the guy to usurp Schultz unless they got a guy like that on LD putting Petts to the third pair which isn’t the worst thing the world.
- Rinosaur

I think Petts and Marino would be a killer pairing. Schultz is pretty overrated. I wouldn't give him a raise at all at this point. I honestly think he makes too much as it is. I'd be more than ok walking away from him this summer.

I just have a hard time believing there will be an abundance of options to replace and/or upgrade Schultz.

While Im a fan of Marino, unless he starts showing more scoring prowess he’s not the guy to usurp Schultz unless they got a guy like that on LD putting Petts to the third pair which isn’t the worst thing the world.
- Rinosaur

My ideal scenario I’d like to see

I just have a hard time believing there will be an abundance of options to replace and/or upgrade Schultz.

While Im a fan of Marino, unless he starts showing more scoring prowess he’s not the guy to usurp Schultz unless they got a guy like that on LD putting Petts to the third pair which isn’t the worst thing the world.
- Rinosaur

That's where I agree with Boyd Schultz is overrated. Since his big year, he has 31 ES points in 112 games. Pettersson as 27 in 126. Schultz is a little better, and much better on the PP though he doesn't get consistent enough top PP time to take advantage of it.

So far this year, Marino, Schultz, and Pettersson all have 5 ES points. Marino actually is coming on lately. I don't think he's a 2nd pair guy either, although he keeps exceeding expectations so I might change my mind by the end of the year. But maybe the difference is at least small enough to let Schultz go and take a shot at the market.

I actually don't have a firm off-season plan yet, really need to watch this team develop. But I'm not giving Schultz his next deal ATM.

My ideal scenario I’d like to see
- 10inchTerror

I'd been thinking I'd like to get to Pettersson and POJ as my bottom 2, but POJ is missing development time now. Wouldn't be the worst scenario if he developed a little later and they bad a position of depth to deal from. Like I said to you before, I can add on either side. I would probably keep Pettersson for now though and just focus on moving JJ.

I just have a hard time believing there will be an abundance of options to replace and/or upgrade Schultz.

While Im a fan of Marino, unless he starts showing more scoring prowess he’s not the guy to usurp Schultz unless they got a guy like that on LD putting Petts to the third pair which isn’t the worst thing the world.
- Rinosaur

I named 4 guys off the top of my head. Of them I think Pietrangelo stays somehow though they're worried. Boston it's an open secret that think they can replace Krug internally. Toronto and Tampa have possibly the two tightest cap situations so Barrie and Shattenkirk are both likely to hit market. No guarantees, but better chance than most years (Pens also need to clear space, but that's manageable).

I'd been thinking I'd like to get to Pettersson and POJ as my bottom 2, but POJ is missing development time now. Wouldn't be the worst scenario if he developed a little later and they bad a position of depth to deal from. Like I said to you before, I can add on either side. I would probably keep Pettersson for now though and just focus on moving JJ.
- Tojo.

As opposed to moving Pettersson? The guy is about to get a 3 or 4 year deal once the new year starts. He has been pretty damn good too. His production and possession stats are right in line with a 4th defender.

Oh those new age millennial Hurricanes are at it again!

What would Don Cherry think of this? Jk...I dont really want to start that discussion.


https://www.bardown.com/h...Sv2_JLCHX9RfUy1DcbzOmzB0Q

I'd been thinking I'd like to get to Pettersson and POJ as my bottom 2, but POJ is missing development time now. Wouldn't be the worst scenario if he developed a little later and they bad a position of depth to deal from. Like I said to you before, I can add on either side. I would probably keep Pettersson for now though and just focus on moving JJ.
- Tojo.

I do agree fully, Muzzin was just one of the dmen i coveted for awhile, his durability being one thing this team really needs. And in his case I’d trade either for him. Obviously jj is the weak links where’s the others all have plenty of time to develop still. Id be happy to see any 2nd line dman who can carry the line though. I’d take any of those guys you listed off if they make it to FA

What’s the timeline on poj? I know he’s out but not any details.

I do agree fully, Muzzin was just one of the dmen i coveted for awhile, his durability being one thing this team really needs. And in his case I’d trade either for him. Obviously jj is the weak links where’s the others all have plenty of time to develop still. Id be happy to see any 2nd line dman who can carry the line though. I’d take any of those guys you listed off if they make it to FA

What’s the timeline on poj? I know he’s out but not any details.
- 10inchTerror

Is your hypothetical contingent on a new deal for Muzzin? Because if you’re trading Pettersson (cost controlled RFA) for Muzzin (UFA rental) that’s just bad asset management.

Throughout his career, Schultz has averaged .46 points per game (~38 for 82 game season). Going on last season, that's equal or greater than Shayne Goesth(whatever), TJ Brodie, Aaron Ekblad, and Heiskanen. It's just below Dougie Hamilton, Darnell Nurse, and Dan Ellis. I'm not saying that he's as good as them, but he'd probably average more if he were playing first pairing and PP1 minutes all the time, instead of just when Letang is injured. His consistent production is something that shouldn't be ignored. His partners haven't been as good as a Dumoulin would do in making him look good/covering his mistakes, and the only reason Dumo and him aren't the top pairing with Letang being out is to spread out the talent on the back end (how it looks to me).

Which is probably the best thing about him; he has helped the team a lot when Letang has gone down, which has been frequently. I think his confidence is streaky, and he'll catch a stride at some point over the season. You know he's capable of playing on a 2nd pairing through two Cups so the only good reason I can see to move him is (as some here have pointed out) cap compliance.

Also, the most Letang has gotten since Schultz got 51 points is 42 in a season. If you're not going to factor in that Schultz has had some injury issues, then the same logic would suggest that he's more productive than Letang. I just hope they find a way to keep him.

I named 4 guys off the top of my head. Of them I think Pietrangelo stays somehow though they're worried. Boston it's an open secret that think they can replace Krug internally. Toronto and Tampa have possibly the two tightest cap situations so Barrie and Shattenkirk are both likely to hit market. No guarantees, but better chance than most years (Pens also need to clear space, but that's manageable).
- Tojo.

No thanks on Shatty. He’s beyond terrible in his own end.

Open to Barrie, but he doesn’t blow my skirt up.

I don’t think Krug makes it to free agency.

That's where I agree with Boyd Schultz is overrated. Since his big year, he has 31 ES points in 112 games. Pettersson as 27 in 126. Schultz is a little better, and much better on the PP though he doesn't get consistent enough top PP time to take advantage of it.

So far this year, Marino, Schultz, and Pettersson all have 5 ES points. Marino actually is coming on lately. I don't think he's a 2nd pair guy either, although he keeps exceeding expectations so I might change my mind by the end of the year. But maybe the difference is at least small enough to let Schultz go and take a shot at the market.

I actually don't have a firm off-season plan yet, really need to watch this team develop. But I'm not giving Schultz his next deal ATM.
- Tojo.

I’m open to Marino on the second pair as long as he’s not the main guy on that pair.

Throughout his career, Schultz has averaged .46 points per game (~38 for 82 game season). Going on last season, that's equal or greater than Shayne Goesth(whatever), TJ Brodie, Aaron Ekblad, and Heiskanen. It's just below Dougie Hamilton, Darnell Nurse, and Dan Ellis. I'm not saying that he's as good as them, but he'd probably average more if he were playing first pairing and PP1 minutes all the time, instead of just when Letang is injured. His consistent production is something that shouldn't be ignored. His partners haven't been as good as a Dumoulin would do in making him look good/covering his mistakes, and the only reason Dumo and him aren't the top pairing with Letang being out is to spread out the talent on the back end (how it looks to me).

Which is probably the best thing about him; he has helped the team a lot when Letang has gone down, which has been frequently. I think his confidence is streaky, and he'll catch a stride at some point over the season. You know he's capable of playing on a 2nd pairing through two Cups so the only good reason I can see to move him is (as some here have pointed out) cap compliance.
- pens_4ever

One cup. He was sheltered on the third pairing in the first cup run. Maatta and Daley were the 2nd pairing.

Technically he was 5th on ice time at 5v5 in the second cup run as well. Maatta and Cole both averaged more ice time than him at 5v5. But I’ll say that he was 2nd pairing on that team.

I don’t dislike Schultz as a player and there is a big difference in saying he sucks vs saying he is overrated. They’re not the same thing. Schultz is decent in a sheltered role. Expand that role and he’s so-so.

Throughout his career, Schultz has averaged .46 points per game (~38 for 82 game season). Going on last season, that's equal or greater than Shayne Goesth(whatever), TJ Brodie, Aaron Ekblad, and Heiskanen. It's just below Dougie Hamilton, Darnell Nurse, and Dan Ellis. I'm not saying that he's as good as them, but he'd probably average more if he were playing first pairing and PP1 minutes all the time, instead of just when Letang is injured. His consistent production is something that shouldn't be ignored. His partners haven't been as good as a Dumoulin would do in making him look good/covering his mistakes, and the only reason Dumo and him aren't the top pairing with Letang being out is to spread out the talent on the back end (how it looks to me).

Which is probably the best thing about him; he has helped the team a lot when Letang has gone down, which has been frequently. I think his confidence is streaky, and he'll catch a stride at some point over the season. You know he's capable of playing on a 2nd pairing through two Cups so the only good reason I can see to move him is (as some here have pointed out) cap compliance.

Also, the most Letang has gotten since Schultz got 51 points is 42 in a season. If you're not going to factor in that Schultz has had some injury issues, then the same logic would suggest that he's more productive than Letang. I just hope they find a way to keep him.
- pens_4ever

Do you want to pay Shultz $7+mm next year? My guess is JR says no but thats what Shultz can demand on the market. He already has a cup so no reason to take a cut and play in Pitt. If hes smart he will go to the highest bidder.

Do you want to pay Shultz $7+mm next year? My guess is JR says no but thats what Shultz can demand on the market. He already has a cup so no reason to take a cut and play in Pitt. If hes smart he will go to the highest bidder.
- sammy87

That would be the cap compliance issue. I'm not sure he's going to command $7mil on the market. That seems steep, but I haven't looked at what RHD of his caliber, albeit with injury issues, goes for these days.

Throughout his career, Schultz has averaged .46 points per game (~38 for 82 game season). Going on last season, that's equal or greater than Shayne Goesth(whatever), TJ Brodie, Aaron Ekblad, and Heiskanen. It's just below Dougie Hamilton, Darnell Nurse, and Dan Ellis. I'm not saying that he's as good as them, but he'd probably average more if he were playing first pairing and PP1 minutes all the time, instead of just when Letang is injured. His consistent production is something that shouldn't be ignored. His partners haven't been as good as a Dumoulin would do in making him look good/covering his mistakes, and the only reason Dumo and him aren't the top pairing with Letang being out is to spread out the talent on the back end (how it looks to me).

Which is probably the best thing about him; he has helped the team a lot when Letang has gone down, which has been frequently. I think his confidence is streaky, and he'll catch a stride at some point over the season. You know he's capable of playing on a 2nd pairing through two Cups so the only good reason I can see to move him is (as some here have pointed out) cap compliance.

Also, the most Letang has gotten since Schultz got 51 points is 42 in a season. If you're not going to factor in that Schultz has had some injury issues, then the same logic would suggest that he's more productive than Letang. I just hope they find a way to keep him.
- pens_4ever

Kris Letang scored 56 points in 65 games last year... and 51 the year before that...

Is your hypothetical contingent on a new deal for Muzzin? Because if you’re trading Pettersson (cost controlled RFA) for Muzzin (UFA rental) that’s just bad asset management.
- j.boyd919

No different as if there was a trade for Jarry/Barrie. It would obviously be a poor decision to acquire anything without resigning. I’m also not advocating trading Pettersson unless that was what it took to get a deal for muzzin. If it was Jarry and schultz for muzzin, as was mentioned for Barrie that just creates a logjam at left and someone playing on their offside so someone in the left has to go and jj ain’t getting it done.

All I’m trying to get at is I’d like to get muzzin over Barrie and I wouldn’t make what I want to happen or RW without a Resigning.

No different as if there was a trade for Jarry/Barrie. It would obviously be a poor decision to acquire anything without resigning. I’m also not advocating trading Pettersson unless that was what it took to get a deal for muzzin. If it was Jarry and schultz for muzzin, as was mentioned for Barrie that just creates a logjam at left and someone playing on their offside so someone in the left has to go and jj ain’t getting it done.

All I’m trying to get at is I’d like to get muzzin over Barrie and I wouldn’t make what I want to happen or RW without a Resigning.
- 10inchTerror

It’s much different than trading Jarry for Barrie lol Pens still have DeSmith locked up for 2 more years to backup Murray if Jarry is traded. If Muzzin walks, then JJ becomes his replacement and... woof.

All this talk about random ass defenders when Johnny Gaudreau is the rumor of the day. I wonder what his price would be? Has to be high, he is a very reasonable contract for his production.

All this talk about random ass defenders when Johnny Gaudreau is the rumor of the day. I wonder what his price would be? Has to be high, he is a very reasonable contract for his production.
- burgh4life87

Johnny Ham and Cheese?

I wonder if he’s has Ham BBQ yet.

All this talk about random ass defenders when Johnny Gaudreau is the rumor of the day. I wonder what his price would be? Has to be high, he is a very reasonable contract for his production.
- burgh4life87

Why would they get rid of him?

As opposed to moving Pettersson? The guy is about to get a 3 or 4 year deal once the new year starts. He has been pretty damn good too. His production and possession stats are right in line with a 4th defender.
- burgh4life87

It was part of a larger conversation about what if we added a better top 4 defenseman. He said we'd need to move Pettersson or JJ to make room, I said I'd keep Pettersson.

I do agree fully, Muzzin was just one of the dmen i coveted for awhile, his durability being one thing this team really needs. And in his case I’d trade either for him. Obviously jj is the weak links where’s the others all have plenty of time to develop still. Id be happy to see any 2nd line dman who can carry the line though. I’d take any of those guys you listed off if they make it to FA

What’s the timeline on poj? I know he’s out but not any details.
- 10inchTerror

No idea with POJ, thought it was mono. I guestimated if he had a good year in WBS he could challenge for a spot in camp or maybe during next year, but he's barely played.

I’m open to Marino on the second pair as long as he’s not the main guy on that pair.
- Rinosaur

I think we agree. I can see going with Marino and Pettersson as the 4-5 guys potentially and base who pays 2nd pair on what side you get in free agency.

That said, I prefer a righty because I feel better about the left side (Pettersson, POJ, Riikola) than the right (Marino, Addison, Ruhwedel) though it's close.