You also don't win with minus defence.

Since Bos won the cup. There has only been 2 defencemen on any team in the top 3 scoring D that have been a minus player. Seabrook was -3 in Chicago last cup win. Doughty was -2 when LA won their first cup.

The only time Erik Karlsson's team has ever made the playoffs is when he's a plus player.
- manvanfan

It's funny, sj traded for him and for Kane. Everyone in media and most fans thought they improved. But they have been worse

There are other teams struggling right now including the canucks and if you watch the other teams games its the same issues.
- Bettmanhatesus

Is your point that it's okay to struggle?

It's funny, sj traded for him and for Kane. Everyone in media and most fans thought they improved. But they have been worse
- SMBDragon

They did make it to a conference final last season. Karlsson was a plus player.

Signing him to that contract this season though made the rest of the roster worse.

I'd like Deboer to get fired so Van could hire him.

They did make it to a conference final last season. Karlsson was a plus player.

Signing him to that contract this season though made the rest of the roster worse.

I'd like Deboer to get fired so Van could hire him.
- manvanfan

I don't want him here

Is your point that it's okay to struggle?
- manvanfan

just stating a fact, when you struggle it becomes a mental issue, every team goes through it.

just stating a fact, when you struggle it becomes a mental issue, every team goes through it.
- Bettmanhatesus

How do you get out of it, what has to change? The same thing happened last season with a lot of the same players. Can't change an entire roster every season.

Team made small improvements with a better roster early on.

I don't want him here
- SMBDragon

I would love him. Conference Championships in both conferences. 551% career win percentage over 3 different teams. Hertl and Meier are absolute beasts.

You also don't win with minus defence.

Since Bos won the cup. There has only been 2 defencemen on any team in the top 3 scoring D that have been a minus player. Seabrook was -3 in Chicago last cup win. Doughty was -2 when LA won their first cup.

The only time Erik Karlsson's team has ever made the playoffs is when he's a plus player.
- manvanfan

True...but I'm talking about one player not three sets of dmen. Barrie would be totally fine as shown on COL over his past two years there is used properly. And he isn't being deployed properly in TO IMO. Is what it is.

True...but I'm talking about one player not three sets of dmen. Barrie would be totally fine as shown on COL over his past two years there is used properly. And he isn't being deployed properly in TO IMO. Is what it is.
- LordHumungous

I guess we are talking about two different things, You are talking about the usage of a single player and i'm talking about a team picture.

im going to get flack for this, but have you ever seen someone with such shltty passing on the first unit powerplay? If Boeser isn't teeing up a shot from the point, i am scared every time he touches it because his passes are awful, and are half the time picked off.
- Codes1087

He looks horrendous on the PP. noticed it as well. My brother in-law coached soccer as well

Stats wise Pettersson is doing better. So is Boeser.

I was looking the other day at Zone starts and had noticed that when Bruce Cassidy took over in Boston, he started playing Bergeron 5-10% more starts in the Ozone than previous coaches.

Bergeron PPG since than has been over a ppg. Was never a ppg before that. Still regarded as one of the best defensive centres.

This year Petey is starting more in the Dzone than any other Canucks Center. Good theory he's your best centre but to me i'd rather him start in the ozone, get more scoring opportunities that don't involve going 200 ft and being able to hem the other team in their own zone.

Horvat is a player that scores off the rush and is taking the most Ozone face-offs. He's got to go back to his own end to come back up the ice to have a "rush". His line mates Virtanen and Pearson are the same, they score off the rush.

This is simply from a specific stand point but also the players look uncomfortable in the way they are being asked to play and it wasn't that way last season.
- manvanfan

🛀 🧂 show your work. As of Nov 5th, Elias only had one D zone start. He is heavily sheltered

🛀 🧂 show your work
- CanuckDon

The rumors are really starting to pick up.

JG Pageau now has 9 goals in November and that ties all other players as the most goals in the NHL in the month. And one amazing note about those numbers is that Pageau has 9 EVEN STRENGTH goals...none of those goals came on power play.

EK

Pageau was a player that I wanted for Bo's wing after they had some chemistry at the world championships that one year.

I thought there was no way this could be true but I looked it up and he does have a majority D zone starts, though Beagle has a higher D zone start %.

What makes that stat even more shocking though is that EP literally didn't start a single shift in the D zone until the 9th game of the season. That's a pretty titanic shift, and it makes no sense to me as to why he's being used that way. Let Horvat and Sutter start there more.
- NorthNuck

The majority of shifts start in the neutral zone/on the fly. Zone starts only start to matter when it starts to get extreme like 60%+ in a specific zone

Pageau was a player that I wanted for Bo's wing after they had some chemistry at the world championships that one year.
- manvanfan

Buying high on him right now doesn’t seem like the wisest decision

Buying high on him right now doesn’t seem like the wisest decision
- Nucker101

It sure doesn't, He wasn't "high" when I thought it would have been an idea.

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Just did the Canucks. 4-5-3 against winning teams.. 6-3-1 against 500 and worse. So they look like gladiators next to the Leafs

Probably not a good sign. Likely puts them outside both playoff chase and good lotto odds if I had to guess

The majority of shifts start in the neutral zone/on the fly. Zone starts only start to matter when it starts to get extreme like 60%+ in a specific zone
- Nucker101

He never starts with a D zone face off. Never

Probably not a good sign. Likely puts them outside playoff chase and good lotto odds if I had to guess
- WhiteLie

I highly doubt it

🛀 🧂 show your work. As of Nov 5th, Elias only had one D zone start. He is heavily sheltered
- CanuckDon

Word count is everything.

He never starts with a D zone face off. Never
- CanuckDon

He did last night at least twice. I remember noticing both times.

It sure doesn't, He wasn't "high" when I thought it would have been an idea.
- manvanfan

True

Probably not a good sign. Likely puts them outside playoff chase and good lotto odds if I had to guess
- WhiteLie

Next 6. It won't be easy.

Preds 9-8
Caps 16-3
Flyers 10-7
Pens 11-7
Oilers 14-6
Oilers 14-6

I highly doubt it
- NorthNuck

Yeah I've since edited, I meant they would be in the middle somewhere. Outside bottom 10 and outside playoffs

Next 6. It won't be easy.

Preds 9-8
Caps 16-3
Flyers 10-7
Pens 11-7
Oilers 14-6
Oilers 14-6
- VanHockeyGuy

Oh man that’s ugly. lol.