None of those 3 guys are improvements over really anything. Sobotka was literally the 2nd worst forward in the league last year. He could have done basically the same on the waiver wire

He was given:

Olofsson-Eichel-Reinhart
Kane-ROR-Blank
Girgs-Larry-Okposo
Blank -Asplund- Erod

Kane and ROR - that's a can of worms - I get it. But the forwards have gone backward. Even on the Scandella trade, we'd be better off having saved that 3rd and kept Foligno. Ennis's contract would have ran out last year. We could sure use Foligno.

This team has gotten worse on the forward ranks, and like I said, there isnt a lot coming
- jcragcrumple

Hey, I’m no Sobotka fan... but he’s better than Nolan, Josefson, Griffith, Criscuolo, MOULSON...
those were guys Botts was forced to go with year1 bc of how terrible GMTM left us

To try & say MoJo, Vesey & Sheary aren’t upgrades over those guys is just nonsense

And u know it’s unfair to bring up Kane & ROR
It’s generally accepted here that Botts was forced to trade those players
And A LOT of ppl here wanted them gone,
and especially liked the ROR trade (which sucked)

How’s this team look in 2years when Mitts & Cozens are good top6 players?

No, that doesn’t help us now. I get that
But do u want Botts building for 8th place now?
Or being legit Cup Contenders for the long haul?


ONE 2C was moved this past summer, ONLY ONE
And the Leafs weren’t gonna trade us Kadri
Stop pretending like Haula & Soderberg were good ideas at the time, they weren’t
Or at the very least,
It’s understandable to see why Botts passed

Payton Manning was probably what, the 2nd or 3rd best QB during the 1st half of Brady's career? So yeah, the 2nd best QB would win a lot too with Belichick. How many Superbowls would Andy Dalton have with Belichick? That's a more fun question
- jcragcrumple

There is no way he doesn't win at least 1

Hey, I’m no Sobotka fan... but he’s better than Nolan, Josefson, Griffith, Criscuolo, MOULSON...
- jdfitz77

All of this is incorrect.

All of this is incorrect.
- U Sir Name

No, it’s not
1 of those guys in an NHL player
Even if he’s “barely” an NHL player,
he’s still better than guys who haven’t played in the league in years

Hey, I’m no Sobotka fan... but he’s better than Nolan, Josefson, Griffith, Criscuolo, MOULSON...
those were guys Botts was forced to go with year1 bc of how terrible GMTM left us

To try & say MoJo, Vesey & Sheary aren’t upgrades over those guys is just nonsense

And u know it’s unfair to bring up Kane & ROR
It’s generally accepted here that Botts was forced to trade those players
And A LOT of ppl here wanted them gone,
and especially liked the ROR trade (which sucked)

How’s this team look in 2years when Mitts & Cozens are good top6 players?

No, that doesn’t help us now. I get that
But do u want Botts building for 8th place now?
Or being legit Cup Contenders for the long haul?


ONE 2C was moved this past summer, ONLY ONE
And the Leafs weren’t gonna trade us Kadri
Stop pretending like Haula & Soderberg were good ideas at the time, they weren’t
Or at the very least,
It’s understandable to see why Botts passed
- jdfitz77

The part that I have to laugh at is the narrative Botts has put together such an awful roster, yet Erik Haula makes us a playoff team.

Isn’t Erik Haula what people thought Rodrigues would be in a 3C role?

Botts whiffed on Mitts this year. And he’s yet to make a deal.

I refuse to believe he “can’t evaluate forwards” because any schmuck with NHL.com can tell you which ones are obviously good.

He needs to get one. We don’t need a management overhaul because of one hole in the roster

Hey, I’m no Sobotka fan... but he’s better than Nolan, Josefson, Griffith, Criscuolo, MOULSON...
those were guys Botts was forced to go with year1 bc of how terrible GMTM left us

To try & say MoJo, Vesey & Sheary aren’t upgrades over those guys is just nonsense

And u know it’s unfair to bring up Kane & ROR
It’s generally accepted here that Botts was forced to trade those players
And A LOT of ppl here wanted them gone,
and especially liked the ROR trade (which sucked)

How’s this team look in 2years when Mitts & Cozens are good top6 players?

No, that doesn’t help us now. I get that
But do u want Botts building for 8th place now?
Or being legit Cup Contenders for the long haul?

ONE 2C was moved this past summer, ONLY ONE
And the Leafs weren’t gonna trade us Kadri
Stop pretending like Haula & Soderberg were good ideas at the time, they weren’t
Or at the very least,
It’s understandable to see why Botts passed
- jdfitz77

Production wise, Nolan and Josefson are probably equivalent to Dalton Smith and Sobotka. The point is, we really haven't gotten far from Griffith and that gang. We've gone backwards in a lot of ways.

As for Mittelstadt being a top-6 player in the future, well that's a mighty big if. And if he and Thompson dont pan out, the high-end forward talent pool is looking as deep as a kiddie pool

There is no way he doesn't win at least 1
- U Sir Name

I think so too

What about as a 2C backup plan?
Bc everyone thought Mitts was gonna take a step forward this year...
It wasn’t JUST Botts
- jdfitz77

it falls on the gm


I am tired of excuses since briere and drury walked

None of those 3 guys are improvements over really anything. Sobotka was literally the 2nd worst forward in the league last year. He could have done basically the same on the waiver wire

He was given:

Olofsson-Eichel-Reinhart
Kane-ROR-Blank
Girgs-Larry-Okposo
Blank -Asplund- Erod

Kane and ROR - that's a can of worms - I get it. But the forwards have gone backward. Even on the Scandella trade, we'd be better off having saved that 3rd and kept Foligno. Ennis's contract would have ran out last year. We could sure use Foligno.

This team has gotten worse on the forward ranks, and like I said, there isnt a lot coming
- jcragcrumple

But we needed Scandella because there wasn't anything in the system, and again half the players Botts has brought in were producers for there prior teams and probably wouldn't have even been needed if there were players in the system to use. How long do you think drafted players take to get here. In the last 3 years most players that would have been taken spots in that time were probably Darcy picks but they were used in the 22 trades Murray made. This isn't the NFL or Basketball were draft picks usually are playing within a year or so, most prospects in hockey take 3 to 5 yrs.

But we needed Scandella because there wasn't anything in the system, and again half the players Botts has brought in were producers for there prior teams .
- Buff36

so it's the gm and the coach

No, it’s not
1 of those guys in an NHL player
Even if he’s “barely” an NHL player,
he’s still better than guys who haven’t played in the league in years
- jdfitz77

Hey Skinner was scoring more this year with Sobotka

But we needed Scandella because there wasn't anything in the system, and again half the players Botts has brought in were producers for there prior teams and probably wouldn't have even been needed if there were players in the system to use. How long do you think drafted players take to get here. In the last 3 years most players that would have been taken spots in that time were probably Darcy picks but they were used in the 22 trades Murray made. This isn't the NFL or Basketball were draft picks usually are playing within a year or so, most prospects in hockey take 3 to 5 yrs.
- Buff36

I was a big fan of Taylor Fedun. He would have been fine in the interim. He was a masterton nominee for the Stars last year.

Look at the f***king difference and edge up Brady has had in comparison to Brees, Manning, and Rodgers. Not to mention he played in the worst division in football the last 17 years. The one year he didn’t play Cassel won the division for crying out loud.

https://www.reddit.com/r/...m=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Brady had a gun at a knife fight. Top 10 QB of all time but not #1. Only two years he did not have a defence ranked in the top 15.

- Wetbandit1

It took me something like 17 minutes to get this but when I did...

Look at the f***king difference and edge up Brady has had in comparison to Brees, Manning, and Rodgers. Not to mention he played in the worst division in football the last 17 years. The one year he didn’t play Cassel won the division for crying out loud.

https://www.reddit.com/r/...m=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Brady had a gun at a knife fight. Top 10 QB of all time but not #1. Only two years he did not have a defence ranked in the top 15.
- Pegullaville

Brady's record against the AFC East was worse than 4 other divisions

https://amp.reddit.com/r/...dy_vs_every_nfl_division/

Next.

The one year he didn’t play Cassel won the division for crying out loud.


- Pegullaville

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_NFL_season

fake news
pats missed playoffs in 2008

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_NFL_season

fake news
pats missed playoffs in 2008
- homiedclown

Sabres 41 points

Sens 37 points.

Let that sink in

it falls on the gm


I am tired of excuses since briere and drury walked
- homiedclown

This. Right. Here.

That is literally where all of us should be unless we are 14 years old and just started watching the Sabres.

I am so sick of people's excuses for sucking at their jobs.

Sabres 41 points

Sens 37 points.

Let that sink in
- SABRES 89

It sunk in 'Twas the night before Christmas...

Sabres 41 points

Sens 37 points.

Let that sink in
- SABRES 89

money is no issue


amateur gm

and a soccer guru for their head coach

money is no issue


amateur gm

and a soccer guru for their head coach
- homiedclown

you can't rush perfection

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_NFL_season

fake news
pats missed playoffs in 2008
- homiedclown

Pats won the AFC in 2017 and had the 5th ranked defence

Pats won another Super Bowl in 2018 and had the 7th ranked defence.

This year they have the #1 defence.

Hey Hatboro who said you can’t continuously field a top defence year after year, Brady can thank Belicheck for 4 of his 6 rings

Look at the f***king difference and edge up Brady has had in comparison to Brees, Manning, and Rodgers. Not to mention he played in the worst division in football the last 17 years. The one year he didn’t play Cassel won the division for crying out loud.

https://www.reddit.com/r/...m=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Brady had a gun at a knife fight. Top 10 QB of all time but not #1. Only two years he did not have a defence ranked in the top 15.
- Pegullaville

The game ended an hour ago and you're still trying to score that game-tying TD.

The part that I have to laugh at is the narrative Botts has put together such an awful roster, yet Erik Haula makes us a playoff team.

Isn’t Erik Haula what people thought Rodrigues would be in a 3C role?

Botts whiffed on Mitts this year. And he’s yet to make a deal.

I refuse to believe he “can’t evaluate forwards” because any schmuck with NHL.com can tell you which ones are obviously good.

He needs to get one. We don’t need a management overhaul because of one hole in the roster
- sbroads24

Agreed
And the thing is, Botts has the fix for that 2C hole
It just isn’t ready NOW

Yes, he massively failed with Berglund
MoJo started out pretty good, but somehow Sobatka getting hurt killed that lines’ productivity

I know you’re a Coyle guy...
but if u just take names out of this...

Do we want short term “decent” placeholder(s) till our super talented top10 picks are ready?
OR
Do we want to put a bad contract 3C quality guy at 2C now, in hopes he’ll solve our secondary scoring issues enough to get us to 8th place?


Sorry to everyone that’s freaking out
But Botts is 100% CORRECT in not making a desperate move here

Do i want him to get a LEGIT 2C?
Sure
Is that possible?
Doesn’t seem so. Bc all reports have had him trying for months now

you can't rush perfection
- SABRES 89

I'd settle for a few meaningful games the last week of the regular season