Good question, and it is complicated, not just either or.
It seems guys who come to the Sabres fall-off a cliff production wise.
Yes, players play better with better players, no doubt, and they need more better players.
Yet, I would expect more out of the additions than what we have seen. Seems they all need someone else to be the driver from which they benefit.
When do they acquire actual drivers to uplift those around them?
Difficult to do when always shopping in the bargain basement rack in the basement of businesses going out of business
- IonSabres

this has been an expectation for years now but here we are

Ray, stop. Give me a break. He's a 19 year old dman who might have some bad shifts or even bad game but to say he sucks might be the dumbest (frank)ing thing I have ever read here. He needs to be better defensively but the kid is a (frank)ing stud. The dude is gonna be a star. What's wrong with thinking that he has a great future. I don't.
- mhp

MH.. All I said last night is that if he is perceived as a future star then they may have to give him up in a trade in order to improve up front where they really need it. If he turns out to be a bust in 3 or 4 years then trading him is no longer an option...

I wouldn't trust Botts making a deal at my kids lunch table even if he had a Bag full of candy and an endless supply of chicken nuggets
- hubie

But that Frolik trade? Terrific. That's a season saver.

I like to play the top 6 game.
Other than Jack
How many players could play on the top line on a playoff team in the league? maybe 1
How many can play 2nd line - 2 people
How many can ply 3rd line
- hubie

Reinhart and Skinner are the other two that I believe would be in the top on a playoff team.

You'd be surprised how many playoff teams have 4 top 6 players and the other 2 are just a good fit for the top 2 lines, but by themselves aren't talented enough to be in the top 6 normally.

I like to play the top 6 game.
Other than Jack
How many players could play on the top line on a playoff team in the league? maybe 1
How many can play 2nd line - 2 people
How many can ply 3rd line
- hubie

In essence, you are saying what has been the problem for 10 years now...
They have a sizable portion of their roster playing a line/pairing higher than their capabilities.
They need an infusion of talent WITH heart who refuse to lose.
Too many accept the status quo.

But that Frolik trade? Terrific. That's a season saver.
- jcragcrumple

Start roping off Washington for the Parade

MH.. All I said last night is that if he is perceived as a future star then they may have to give him up in a trade in order to improve up front where they really need it. If he turns out to be a bust in 3 or 4 years then trading him is no longer an option...
- rapperray

Every player not named Eichel or Dahlin is available for the right price. You do not move Dahlin.

Reinhart and Skinner are the other two that I believe would be in the top on a playoff team.

You'd be surprised how many playoff teams have 4 top 6 players and the other 2 are just a good fit for the top 2 lines, but by themselves aren't talented enough to be in the top 6 normally.
- kingcong39

I bet those 4-6 players are more talented then what we have

In essence, you are saying what has been the problem for 10 years now...
They have a sizable portion of their roster playing a line/pairing higher than their capabilities.
They need an infusion of talent WITH heart who refuse to lose.
Too many accept the status quo.
- IonSabres

Many just aren't talented enough to do anything about it. Example was Sheary last night, who was skating fast and playing hard last night. He just isn't good enough to have a consistent impact game to game.

I bet those 4-6 players are more talented then what we have
- hubie

You mean 3 of the 4, Eichel aside?

Not many teams have a line full of amazing players. It's usually 2/3 and the 3rd is a good fit while not being a great player.

In essence, you are saying what has been the problem for 10 years now...
They have a sizable portion of their roster playing a line/pairing higher than their capabilities.
They need an infusion of talent WITH heart who refuse to lose.
Too many accept the status quo.
- IonSabres

This organization has been able to accumulate role players

One thing that drives me crazy as it did last night is all these other teams have multiple guys come in from the ahl and produce and we just keep running out the same also rans that produce nothing but we cant move

You mean 3 of the 4, Eichel aside?

Not many teams have a line full of amazing players. It's usually 2/3 and the 3rd is a good fit while not being a great player.
- kingcong39

What im saying what that 3rd player is is still better than what we have

MH.. All I said last night is that if he is perceived as a future star then they may have to give him up in a trade in order to improve up front where they really need it. If he turns out to be a bust in 3 or 4 years then trading him is no longer an option...
- rapperray

In my view I would never do that. The future foundation of the Sabres core is Eichel and Dahlin imo. He is on pace for a better year than his rookie year. Dmen sometimes take a little longer and he is only 19. I love the kid.

I understand the frustration watching the games but they weren't a playoff team this year and they might not be next year. They still have some of the garbage to take out and we'll see what happens. As opposed to Dahlin you could look at other players that could be moved. Heck, we might have a new GM next year and the clock starts over again.

Cheers!

You better watch it MH.. Dahlin is the best player in the NHL..... In 4 years that is.... A lot of people on here that know what the future holds....
- rapperray

And you and a couple others are ready to run the 1st overall pick out of town after a year and a half?

That's ludicrous.

And you and a couple others are ready to run the 1st overall pick out of town after a year and a half?

That's ludicrous.
- Powerslave

This.

Every player not named Eichel or Dahlin is available for the right price. You do not move Dahlin.
- kingcong39

And there is the problem then. How do you improve this team? Other than Eihel and Dahlin who do they have to trade for some REAL talent up front. The draft with the exception of those 2 has been useless for 10 years now. How do they manage to bring in 2 or 3 players with REAL talent without giving something of value up? The Sabres ability to develop their own talent may be the worst in the NHL...

And there is the problem then. How do you improve this team? Other than Eihel and Dahlin who do they have to trade for some REAL talent up front. The draft with the exception of those 2 has been useless for 10 years now. How do they manage to bring in 2 or 3 players with REAL talent without giving something of value up? The Sabres ability to develop their own talent may be the worst in the NHL...
- rapperray

But if Dahlin sucks, who's going to want him?

And you and a couple others are ready to run the 1st overall pick out of town after a year and a half?

That's ludicrous.
- Powerslave

36 games 2-21 24 -1
not the problem

Now
32 games 1-5 6 -5
41 games 2-5 7 -3

maybe these guys should sit a min, but oh now we cant lose them they are sooo important

And you and a couple others are ready to run the 1st overall pick out of town after a year and a half?

That's ludicrous.
- Powerslave

Not accurate... Please explain what else the Sabres have to offer other teams in order to improve up front? They simply have no ability to develop their own players in the AHL... Been that way for 10 years....

And there is the problem then. How do you improve this team? Other than Eihel and Dahlin who do they have to trade for some REAL talent up front. The draft with the exception of those 2 has been useless for 10 years now. How do they manage to bring in 2 or 3 players with REAL talent without giving something of value up? The Sabres ability to develop their own talent may be the worst in the NHL...
- rapperray

They have plenty of players that have value. There's also FA.

Not accurate... Please explain what else the Sabres have to offer other teams in order to improve up front? They simply have no ability to develop their own players in the AHL... Been that way for 10 years....
- rapperray

Sam Reinhart and Rasmus Ristolainen, for example.

But if Dahlin sucks, who's going to want him?
- Powerslave

Again that is not what I said.... I said IF he does not pan out within 3 or 4 years he becomes useless as trade bait... I will give him the sophmore slump thing this year but IF he does not develop further next year or beyond his value is crap...

In my view I would never do that. The future foundation of the Sabres core is Eichel and Dahlin imo. He is on pace for a better year than his rookie year. Dmen sometimes take a little longer and he is only 19. I love the kid.

I understand the frustration watching the games but they weren't a playoff team this year and they might not be next year. They still have some of the garbage to take out and we'll see what happens. As opposed to Dahlin you could look at other players that could be moved. Heck, we might have a new GM next year and the clock starts over again.

Cheers!
- mhp

The people demand blood atonement in the form of firings

36 games 2-21 24 -1
not the problem

Now
32 games 1-5 6 -5
41 games 2-5 7 -3

maybe these guys should sit a min, but oh now we cant lose them they are sooo important
- hubie

I'm guessing McCabe and Miller?

I'm ready for McCabe to move on.

All this stopping and starting with Miller, though? If he was good enough to play in VGK's top 6, then he should be good enough here.

Again that is not what I said.... I said IF he does not pan out within 3 or 4 years he becomes useless as trade bait... I will give him the sophmore slump thing this year but IF he does not develop further next year or beyond his value is crap...
- rapperray

He has 23 points in 36 games and is -1

That's a nice slump!