The answer is better officiating and harsher punishments. We seem to agree that garbage occurs. Again... you start fining the coach for putting to d bag on the ice.... the gm for signing the d bag... the owner for paying them.... marchand cleans up or is gone. A player can still skate away without the instigator penalty. How’s that for a look for the league? A dude declining to fight and someone jumping him from behind. It’s not a valid solution
- ChrisMS

I think you're missing the point here. It's a far more valid solution than what the league is currently offering. I guarantee that if a player like Marchand would get the snot kicked out of him a few times, he would clean up his act. The league has shown that they're not willing to effectively suspend and punish star players.
I will never endorse staged fights and players who are only in the league to fight. That's archaic and was rightfully removed from the game. Nothing wrong with a spontaneous fight or with players being able to police the ice. If the league would do a better job of it, then hey I'm all for it. No sign of that happening anytime soon. So therefore, I vote to put it back in the players hands.

I think you're missing the point here. It's a far more valid solution than what the league is currently offering. I guarantee that if a player like Marchand would get the snot kicked out of him a few times, he would clean up his act. The league has shown that they're not willing to effectively suspend and punish star players.
I will never endorse staged fights and players who are only in the league to fight. That's archaic and was rightfully removed from the game. Nothing wrong with a spontaneous fight or with players being able to police the ice. If the league would do a better job of it, then hey I'm all for it. No sign of that happening anytime soon. So therefore, I vote to put it back in the players hands.
- MJL

The league ain’t gonna put it back in the players hands either. What makes you think players getting the snot kicked out of em would stop them? These fools step in front of 100 mile per hour pucks to prevent the chance of a shot on net. What’s a couple punches to the face?

I think you're missing the point here. It's a far more valid solution than what the league is currently offering. I guarantee that if a player like Marchand would get the snot kicked out of him a few times, he would clean up his act. The league has shown that they're not willing to effectively suspend and punish star players.
I will never endorse staged fights and players who are only in the league to fight. That's archaic and was rightfully removed from the game. Nothing wrong with a spontaneous fight or with players being able to police the ice. If the league would do a better job of it, then hey I'm all for it. No sign of that happening anytime soon. So therefore, I vote to put it back in the players hands.
- MJL

Marchand is one of the few rats in the league now. I think there were more back when there was no instigating penalty.

Who said anything about bringing enforcers back into the league? Fighting should not be banned.

Your response here has the intelligence level of below 9th grade. More like 3rd grade.
- MJL

Are you really surprised?

The league ain’t gonna put it back in the players hands either. What makes you think players getting the snot kicked out of em would stop them? These fools step in front of 100 mile per hour pucks to prevent the chance of a shot on net. What’s a couple punches to the face?
- ChrisMS

There's no question that if they knew there was going to be immediate repercussions, a lot of stuff on the ice would stop.

Times have changed. Alot of parents would never enroll their kids in anything that involves fighting.
Bare knuckle fighting on skates has to be the most stupid thing still allowed in sports.
- shack67

Not sure if you know this but you can’t fight in hockey unless you play at certain levels, it’s 100% avoidable .

There's no question that if they knew there was going to be immediate repercussions, a lot of stuff on the ice would stop.
- MJL

There is a question. There is no more dirty stuff now than before the instigator rule... in fact there is less. The league has moved in the right direction. It just needs to keep walking the right direction

There's no question that if they knew there was going to be immediate repercussions, a lot of stuff on the ice would stop.
- MJL

Just having a player on your bench who is capable of kicking the snot out of his opponents makes a difference (like Berube). Players are far less brave if they know they'll have to fight that guy. It's essentially a nuclear deterrent. It won't eliminate all the crap. But it'll eliminate alot of it. Unfortunately the wimp rule er Instigator Rule protects the weasels and punishes the protectors. The cowards hide behind the refs and their visors and yap. Like Kirk Maltby used to do on the Red Wings.

There is a question. There is no more dirty stuff now than before the instigator rule... in fact there is less. The league has moved in the right direction. It just needs to keep walking the right direction
- ChrisMS

Can you provide the evidence of this? I guess it all depends on what you're calling dirty stuff. I think it's clear with the Kane statement, which I applaud, that the DOPS is not effective.

Just having a player on your bench who is capable of kicking the snot out of his opponents makes a difference (like Berube). Players are far less brave if they know they'll have to fight that guy. It's essentially a nuclear deterrent. It won't eliminate all the crap. But it'll eliminate alot of it. Unfortunately the wimp rule er Instigator Rule protects the weasels and punishes the protectors. The cowards hide behind the refs and yap.
- gergeswillems

I don't want to ever go back to the enforcer era. Berube was a decent hockey player but not by today's standards.

Not sure if you know this but you can’t fight in hockey unless you play at certain levels, it’s 100% avoidable .
- ClaudeFather

Yeah I know but every kid joins in the hope of making it to that level. It scares the crap out of parents. My oldest grandson is there now and his parents are really nervous.

Can you provide the evidence of this? I guess it all depends on what you're calling dirty stuff. I think it's clear with the Kane statement, which I applaud, that the DOPS is not effective.
- MJL

We can both agree on his statement. Your solution has been proven not to work. Fixxing the dops hasn’t been tried and has a chance to work.

There is a question. There is no more dirty stuff now than before the instigator rule... in fact there is less. The league has moved in the right direction. It just needs to keep walking the right direction
- ChrisMS

I disagree. There's more hitting from behind and slashing. I don't believe the league is heading in the right direction at all. In fact it's getting worse.

The reason fighting is down has a lot to do with the instigator rule in the first place, it's made the role of the enforcer irrelevant. The only fighters who are able to play in the league are the ones who can actually play. Guys like Clifford or Martin. Getting rid of the instigator rule would open the door for enforcers to be brought back, which nobody wants. Gretzky had to play with Semenko just to be able to play the game, going back to that would be insane.

I don't want to ever go back to the enforcer era. Berube was a decent hockey player but not by today's standards.
- MJL

There's players today who aren't enforcers who can still fight if they need to. So long as the rats rule this league then nothing will change.

The reason fighting is down has a lot to do with the instigator rule in the first place, it's made the role of the enforcer irrelevant. The only fighters who are able to play in the league are the ones who can actually play. Guys like Clifford or Martin. Getting rid of the instigator rule would open the door for enforcers to be brought back, which nobody wants. Gretzky had to play with Semenko just to be able to play the game, going back to that would be insane.
- 13sundin13

So it's better to watch Marchand and Tom Wilson running around hitting guys from behind and cheap shotting opponents with no accountability? They just pay their fine and sit out a few games only to return to being the spot picking, knuckle dragging cheap shot artists they've always been.

Yeah I know but every kid joins in the hope of making it to that level. It scares the crap out of parents. My oldest grandson is there now and his parents are really nervous.
- shack67

It's the trade off. A kid gets the opportunity to pursue his dream of playing in the NHL making millions of dollars while acknowledging that his career could end at any time with a freak injury. Even before he gets anywhere close to making it to the NHL.

I disagree. There's more hitting from behind and slashing. I don't believe the league is heading in the right direction at all. In fact it's getting worse.
- gergeswillems

You seriously think the game is dirtier today than the 80’s and 90’s. Isn’t that Malkin in your picture? As a pens fan you do remember a dude named ulf don’t you? I’m sure cam neely does.

You seriously think the game is dirtier today than the 80’s and 90’s. Isn’t that Malkin in your picture? As a pens fan you do remember a dude named ulf don’t you? I’m sure cam neely does.
- ChrisMS

I'm seriously not a Pens Fan. I do remember Ulf Samuelsson ending Cam Neely's career. Do you remember Todd Bertuzzi ending Steve Moore's career? I do. Pretty sure the Instigator Rule was in effect. What's your point?

I see where you're coming from here, but I don't see how you can't have a zero tolerance on kicking people with the razor blades strapped to your feet.

Fighting should probably be banned, due to what we now know about CTE, but the fact is, it has nothing to do with the fact that kicking a guy with skates on should get you banned for more than seven games.
- James_Tanner

I guess I didn't make it clear that I agree that kicking someone with a skate, which like punching someone in the face repeatedly, is obviously and intent to injure.

The result of either action however is beside the point, until the league admits that all of these actions are an intent to injure; and not just a physical attempt to remove a player from possession of the puck.

The game at the moment is screwed up at the moment imo. Most people would like to see more hitting but if you throw a good clean hard hit you have to fight someone.

So if you’re a good hitter but not a good fighter do you throw that hit? Probably not.

The game at the moment is a screwed up at the moment imo. Most people would like to see more hitting but if you throw a good clean hard hit you have to fight someone.

So if you’re a good hitter but not a good fighter do you throw that hit? Probably not.
- shack67

What bothers me is that when a player legally body checks an opponent, the opposing bench wants to kill him. Like the player committed murder. But apparently it's perfectly okay to drill a defenseless opponent from behind into the glass? That's tough hard nosed hockey?

We can both agree on his statement. Your solution has been proven not to work. Fixxing the dops hasn’t been tried and has a chance to work.
- ChrisMS

That's where the disconnect is. I'm not suggesting that my "solution" is ideal or the best way to clean it up. I'm saying it's better than the current "solution". There have been numerous people in charge of player discipline. Plenty has been tried.

Yeah I know but every kid joins in the hope of making it to that level. It scares the crap out of parents. My oldest grandson is there now and his parents are really nervous.
- shack67

Nervous about what? That he might have to fight? So they watch every game saying oh god hopefully he doesn’t fight tonight ? Sounds a little far fetched

The reason fighting is down has a lot to do with the instigator rule in the first place, it's made the role of the enforcer irrelevant. The only fighters who are able to play in the league are the ones who can actually play. Guys like Clifford or Martin. Getting rid of the instigator rule would open the door for enforcers to be brought back, which nobody wants. Gretzky had to play with Semenko just to be able to play the game, going back to that would be insane.
- 13sundin13

I disagree that getting rid of the enforcer rule would open the door for enforcers to be brought back. They don't skate well nor are they skilled enough. It's a different league now where teams stress having 4 good lines to play at ES.