"Only". Were those teams expected to be great? Some thought Florida *could* make the playoffs. Most thought Buffalo and Montreal would not.

You're giving too much credit to those crappy teams.
- RogerRoeper

I'm not giving them credit at all, but they could have done better.

Montreal is having a worse season than last year despite a very similar lineup, Buffalo didn't progress (again) as they should have and Florida is in a perpetual "this is the year we make it".

Bottom line, any of these teams would have known success, the Leafs would be in a very uncomfortable situation right now and people expected much more from them, myself included.

that account I posted has a bunch of different ways to look at it.
Leafs are 8th in points lost to injury. But the thing is it affects every team some way.

Its nothing to harp on, it sucks to lose a good player, but good teams march on and win anyway
- senstroll

Exactly. If a team has the work ethic and attention to details instilled in them as a part of their culture, then they have the ability to lose players and play through it. Your talent can be your talent. Now if you lose Rielly, Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander, your work ethic is probably going to help you lose by only 2 or 3 instead of 7 or 8.

It's sort of what I was alluding to above in my long-winded post to Roger. The Leafs rely too much on their talent and not enough on working. As a culture, you need to always work, and then your talent can push you to the next level.

I'm not giving them credit at all, but they could have done better.

Montreal is having a worse season than last year despite a very similar lineup, Buffalo didn't progress (again) as they should have and Florida is in a perpetual "this is the year we make it".

Bottom line, any of these teams would have known success, the Leafs would be in a very uncomfortable situation right now and people expected much more from them, myself included.
- Scabeh

I agree with this. I thought Toronto should be battling for top spot in the Atlantic but they aren't.

It still isn't as bad as people make it out to be. I find that maybe it's just Toronto and Montreal that look at each game is the only game of the season. It feels that way in here often.

I agree with this. I thought Toronto should be battling for top spot in the Atlantic but they aren't.

It still isn't as bad as people make it out to be. I find that maybe it's just Toronto and Montreal that look at each game is the only game of the season. It feels that way in here often.
- Aaron_85

At least you guys have the Raptors to compensate.

Montreal has no other teams playing during hockey season, so if the Habs suck, it's 100% sports talk panic.

I really hate this city. The Leafs are judged differently than every other team.

They are top 5 in man games lost and have no Rielly. If they had an average backup they'd be one of the top teams in the NHL.
- RogerRoeper

I'm not even worried, I've been enjoying this season.

I'm not giving them credit at all, but they could have done better.

Montreal is having a worse season than last year despite a very similar lineup, Buffalo didn't progress (again) as they should have and Florida is in a perpetual "this is the year we make it".

Bottom line, any of these teams would have known success, the Leafs would be in a very uncomfortable situation right now and people expected much more from them, myself included.
- Scabeh

You're not wrong. Bear in mind that a lot of people in this forum are quick to point fingers at Andersen or Hutchinson for the Leafs' current predicament. Bobrobsky is having a nightmare of a season in Florida. If he was even league average - which is still below par for his expectations - Florida would be ahead of us by a number of points.

The Leafs have underachieved - by anywhere from 8 - 16 points depending on the measure you use.

You're not wrong. Bear in mind that a lot of people in this forum are quick to point fingers at Andersen or Hutchinson for the Leafs' current predicament. Bobrobsky is having a nightmare of a season in Florida. If he was even league average - which is still below par for his expectations - Florida would be ahead of us by a number of points.

The Leafs have underachieved - by anywhere from 8 - 16 points depending on the measure you use.
- Monkeypunk

Good news for them, they can still salvage their whole season by making the playoffs and winning at least a round.

Something they could very do.

It's all about expectations.

Lots of people expected the Leafs to be one of the best teams in the east.

So far, they are getting in the playoffs only because Montreal, Florida and Buffalo are also poopting the bed in even more spectacular fashion.
- Scabeh

Yup, Leafs would be 7th in the Metro

Pretty crazy.

I'm not giving them credit at all, but they could have done better.

Montreal is having a worse season than last year despite a very similar lineup, Buffalo didn't progress (again) as they should have and Florida is in a perpetual "this is the year we make it".

Bottom line, any of these teams would have known success, the Leafs would be in a very uncomfortable situation right now and people expected much more from them, myself included.
- Scabeh

There's also other teams right with the Leafs. Leafs could very well have leap-frogged some of those teams.

Yup, Leafs would be 7th in the Metro

Pretty crazy.
- LeafGuy89

And they'd be 1st in the Pacific

Did freddy steal this game?

And they'd be 1st in the Pacific
- TheMussel

Didn't even bother looking at that lmao!

*mind blown*

I would think so. I don't know much about their private lives, but Spezza, Muzzin, Hyman, Clifford and Tavares may be the only ones who are actually married.

I think guys like Kapanen and Nylander have girlfriends who live in their home countries, and I also believe Marner and Matthews are single. That makes for a lot of freedom for young guys with a lot of money.
- Monkeypunk

Marner has been GF’d up since high school

My cousin is friends with her she went to school with her at Western.

Kind of funny Montreal seems to be still "Going for it" and in Toronto it's all a big disaster.

Nashville's season looks like a disaster (But we don't criticize a team like that!) 21 million for those 3 centres. Christ. And I have to hear about 40 million for our stars?

Toronto media is just weird. I know it's about getting attention, but at some point look like you actually follow the NHL.

Florida's season also looks like a disaster. a 32 year-old goalie in the 1st year of a 7 year deal for 10 million per having a sub 900 save %. HAHAHA. THAT'S a disaster. And trust me if Dubas signed that deal he'd be run out of town and everyone would be talking about it.
- RogerRoeper

Dale Tallon (frank)ing sucks.

Exactly. If a team has the work ethic and attention to details instilled in them as a part of their culture, then they have the ability to lose players and play through it. Your talent can be your talent. Now if you lose Rielly, Matthews, Marner, Tavares and Nylander, your work ethic is probably going to help you lose by only 2 or 3 instead of 7 or 8.

It's sort of what I was alluding to above in my long-winded post to Roger. The Leafs rely too much on their talent and not enough on working. As a culture, you need to always work, and then your talent can push you to the next level.
- Monkeypunk

We're told it's work-ethic but the truth is goaltending has been our biggest issue. You guys just repeat that media nonsense like sheep. That's how Freddy gets too much credit.

Mitch Marner has broke The Leafs franchise record for points before the age of 23, passing Vincent Damphousse with his 285th tonight!

Dale Tallon (frank)ing sucks.
- Santo_44

Our Gm gets destroyed for giving a 22 year-old who's never scored less than 61 points ina full season 6.9 per through only his prime years.

Marner has been GF’d up since high school

My cousin is friends with her she went to school with her at Western.
- Santo_44

Based on the other feedback I've received, I clearly know even less about their private lives than I thought - although I've been sufficiently educated in the last hour.

We're told it's work-ethic but the truth is goaltending has been our biggest issue. You guys just repeat that media nonsense like sheep. That's how Freddy gets too much credit.
- RogerRoeper

Well not giving an effort results in other teams getting better scoring chances and leaving our goalie out to dry.

So the players are just as guilty as the "bad goaltending".

The team actually played a solid game in front of Freddy for once and look what happened.

Freddy does still need to be better though there is no denying that.

Kind of funny Montreal seems to be still "Going for it" and in Toronto it's all a big disaster.
- RogerRoeper

The coach and the players keep saying they haven't given up. Kudos to them keeping a positive spirit.

But even die hard fans knows it's over at this point and getting the best pick possible is what matters now.

Mitch Marner has broke The Leafs franchise record for points before the age of 23, passing Vincent Damphousse with his 285th tonight!
- LeafGuy89

Well not giving an effort results in other teams getting better scoring chances and leaving our goalie out to dry.

So the players are just as guilty as the "bad goaltending".

The team actually played a solid game in front of Freddy for once and look what happened.

Freddy does still need to be better though there is no denying that.
- LeafGuy89

So I'm told all yesterday after the loss Toronto needs to be like Pittsburgh is every game. That effort was pure poop last night.

We're told it's work-ethic but the truth is goaltending has been our biggest issue. You guys just repeat that media nonsense like sheep. That's how Freddy gets too much credit.
- RogerRoeper

Are you blind and watching the game with some type of descriptive video?

I don't want to rail on you if you're blind, because then I'd feel bad.

Did you WATCH the game yesterday and did not see the difference between it and most of the other 61 games we've played this year?

They closed gaps, they worked in corners, they won board battles, they covered their guys, and played in the lanes.

Yes, if Freddy allows a goal on the Power Play, they're perhaps fragile enough to let that deflate them and lose the game - but they also didn't allow any cross crease wide open net chances either. Frankly, that penalty kill was still a positional disaster and we're lucky we didn't get scored on.

5 on 5, however, they were as sound and smart and attentive to details as I've seen them be consistently for an entire game all season.