They are both true to different degrees, but saying they traded for O'Reilly because Sam stunk is beyond nonsensical.
- kingcong39

It’s just not reality.

The root of the Sabres problems goes back to Murray attempting to speed up the rebuild. And both GM’s rarely have made a good move since

If you want to say Reinhart isnt a good enough 2OA pick, go for it. But there are plenty worse picks at 1 or 2 in the past 10 years.

The fact that people are scapegoating a player taken six (frank)ing years ago for being a good winger instead of a good center is not the place to start in my opinion.

This problem that we have now - no 2C - is 20 months old. It's learning to walk and talk. Blaming Reinhart is completely irrational in my opinion. It's irrelevant and erroneous. They've had years to do so.

Fix the problem
- jcragcrumple

I'm saying what the root is

I'm saying what the root is
- GilPerreault11

Then it must be true.

Why can’t both be right ?

Whiffing on Reinhart franked us

Our managements ineptitude to over pay for ROR, then get minimal in return franked us.

Our ability to replace ROR is franking us.

It’s all one big frank up that goes right up to the top of the organization.
- Pegullaville

This, many things lead to another

I'm saying what the root is
- GilPerreault11

That's not the root. The root was we had Eichel and ROR down the middle. It made sense to move Reinhart to wing.

In any case, it's been 6 (frank)ing years. 3 full years of this GM alone. 2 years without a 2C. And you're going to lay that blame at the foot of a productive winger?

That's a cop out

Why can’t both be right ?

Whiffing on Reinhart franked us

Our managements ineptitude to over pay for ROR, then get minimal in return franked us.

Our ability to replace ROR is franking us.

It’s all one big frank up that goes right up to the top of the organization.
- Pegullaville

Has the GM even tried once to actually replace him? The answer is absolutely not.

I'm saying what the root is
- GilPerreault11

Well, actually the root is GMTM who drafted Reinhart, well if you really want to want to go to the root it's Pat LaFontaine hiring GMTM but Reinhart plays a major role.

So, how much and how long do you want to pay The Root?

Has the GM even tried once to actually replace him? The answer is absolutely not.
- kingcong39

Listen, my opinion on Botterill has certainly changed over the past 3 years. But things like this are said frequently that are just not true

He’s drafted two centers in the top 10, another with a high 2nd rounder. He’s also attempted to trade for guys like Trocheck.

He hasn’t actually made a big trade for a top 6 center. That’s it

If Casey Mittelstadt was good then the problem would be considered fixed

WHO SAYS WE WHIFFED???

FFS
- Der Kaiser

Does anyone outside of Buffalo even know who Sam Reinhart is ?

We had one of the most lucrative assets in the NHL in a top 2 draft selection and we selected a player whom gives you the same production you can get off the street in free agency this year.

Someone will sign Hoffman or Dadonov for nothing but cap space and get a top 6 RW and we used one a top 2 pick to get one.

To make matters worse, Draisatil was there for the taking.

Would ROR still be here if Draisatil was the pick ?

Would Leon have pushed the needle in the Babs and Stammer negotiations ?

Who really knows.

Let’s except mediocrity then, sorry for being honest.

Listen, my opinion on Botterill has certainly changed over the past 3 years. But things like this are said frequently that are just not true

He’s drafted two centers in the top 10, another with a high 2nd rounder. He’s also attempted to trade for guys like Trocheck.

He hasn’t actually made a big trade for a top 6 center. That’s it

If Casey Mittelstadt was good then the problem would be considered fixed
- sbroads24

And that will be Botts’ downfall. Can’t whiff on picks.

Does anyone outside of Buffalo even know who Sam Reinhart is ?

We had one of the most lucrative assets in the NHL in a top 2 draft selection and we selected a player whom gives you the same production you can get off the street in free agency this year.

Someone will sign Hoffman or Dadonov for nothing but cap space and get a top 6 RW and we used one a top 2 pick to get one.

To make matters worse, Draisatil was there for the taking.

Would ROR still be here if Draisatil was the pick ?

Would Leon have pushed the needle in the Babs and Stammer negotiations ?

Who really knows.

Let’s except mediocrity then, sorry for being honest.
- Pegullaville

3 years later and all Botterill supporters have to hang their hat on is that Tim Murray was worse

Why can’t both be right ?

Whiffing on Reinhart franked us

Our managements ineptitude to over pay for ROR, then get minimal in return franked us.

Our ability to replace ROR is franking us.

It’s all one big frank up that goes right up to the top of the organization.
- Pegullaville

Don’t think we whiffed on Sam. He is good
.

Prob is we paid skinner too much and it’s tough to pay another winger a huge contract. Especially if they both need Jack to be good.

Jack elevates play like olofssson. There should be a value contract on his line. Not 16 million in salary

That's not the root. The root was we had Eichel and ROR down the middle. It made sense to move Reinhart to wing.

In any case, it's been 6 (frank)ing years. 3 full years of this GM alone. 2 years without a 2C. And you're going to lay that blame at the foot of a productive winger?

That's a cop out
- jcragcrumple

It's because Reinhart couldn't play productive center, he didn't light it up his first year like many 1st forwards taken in the draft who are known for cerebral strength, same as ROR, do. How many cerebral centers did we need? Didn't we need skilled ones too besides Jack?

Listen, my opinion on Botterill has certainly changed over the past 3 years. But things like this are said frequently that are just not true

He’s drafted two centers in the top 10, another with a high 2nd rounder. He’s also attempted to trade for guys like Trocheck.

He hasn’t actually made a big trade for a top 6 center. That’s it

If Casey Mittelstadt was good then the problem would be considered fixed
- sbroads24

If my grandmother had wheels, shed be a bicycle

Botterill has had 2 years to fix the center problem and hasn't

If my grandmother had wheels, shed be a bicycle

Botterill has had 2 years to fix the center problem and hasn't
- jcragcrumple

You’re right he hasn’t fixed it.

Saying he hasn’t tried or used assets at the center position isn’t reality

If Reinhart could carry his own load on the second line the Sabres would be a different team. The truth hurts. Anyway, he is one of the Sabres disasters. The tank crashed largely because of him. He was the start and he didn't guide it in a straight and steady manner.
- GilPerreault11

Welcome to the world of 3er/beady
Enjoy the company!

You’re right he hasn’t fixed it.

Saying he hasn’t tried or used assets at the center position isn’t reality
- sbroads24

"Tried"

Yes, Darren Dreger has carried the mail for Botterill's trying very well.

He's the rip-roaringest, rootin'-tootenist, hardest trying GM in the league

3 years later and all Botterill supporters have to hang their hat on is that Tim Murray was worse
- jcragcrumple

I support tanking and picking top 10 and building through the draft.

At the end of the day you need to hit on the picks

"Tried"

Yes, Darren Dreger has carried the mail for Botterill's trying very well.

He's the rip-roaringest, rootin'-tootenist, hardest trying GM in the league
- jcragcrumple

He’s literally drafted two centers in the top 10 in three drafts.

Again, those things actually happened. That’s reality

He didn’t fix the center position for 2019 and 2020 seasons.

I’d be willing to bet that ends up being a position of strength soon

N
O
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A
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P
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I
C
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FFS STOP BLAMING ONE OF OUR SIX GOOD PLAYERS


- jcragcrumple

What's wrong with Patrick

Don’t think we whiffed on Sam. He is good
.

Prob is we paid skinner too much and it’s tough to pay another winger a huge contract. Especially if they both need Jack to be good.

Jack elevates play like olofssson. There should be a value contract on his line. Not 16 million in salary
- Fattony1187

Sabres fans are loyal in some respects but they whiffed. When they haven't made the playoffs and Reinhart is pretty much an afterthought player they whiffed.

When there is a debate about Jack and Marner on Ek's blog and everyone says Marner has talent to play with but Jack has squat and Reinhart is part of that squat they whiffed in the eyes of people outside Buffalo.

3 years later and all Botterill supporters have to hang their hat on is that Tim Murray was worse
- jcragcrumple

Are there any Botterill supporters anymore?

I support tanking and picking top 10 and building through the draft.

At the end of the day you need to hit on the picks
- Pegullaville

Tanking has proven to be much more devastating to the organization than anyone thought.

Are there any Botterill supporters anymore?
- IonSabres

No when he didn't draft out of the CHL I was done

Tanking has proven to be much more devastating to the organization than anyone thought.
- Michael Pachla

No, rushing the tank and poor asset management did.

If Pegula told Murray to speed it up and trade for ROR instead of gunning for Matthews the following the year then there is your problem.