Yes , you fire the gm that has eichel and dahlin but finishes 25th. Absolutely.

3 years was plenty to turn the team around
- Boss34

actually he only had 151 games to turn it around, because your tanking for dahlin

I don't always buy Boss' tank rhetoric, but this is a fact. Tim Murray deconstructed that team on purpose to lose, and you don't intentionally lose without your owner knowing about it.
- TheSabresTaco

No disagreement the pegulas knew and agreed, but I would guess that tm went to them before he was hired said “I’m gonna rip it apart to go for mcdavid”, they said “ok sounds good”.
They agreed with it but tm was the one that pulled it off, pegulas had nothing to do with the actual transactions and moves that brought the tank, they just gave tm the green light, semantics I suppose.

I don't always buy Boss' tank rhetoric, but this is a fact. Tim Murray deconstructed that team on purpose to lose, and you don't intentionally lose without your owner knowing about it.
- TheSabresTaco

Darcy initially wanted the tank. He wanted superstar players you get at the top of the draft and who you win with and he even said that when he said in his speech this is going to be painful or hurt.

The Bills blew throughout a lot of the 70's and 80's and they didn't tear the MFer down on purpose they were just inept and now Ralph is revered by some, many. He even threatened to move as leverage to get whatever he wanted with the stadium, holding that fear over the fans' heads. Not every owner is going to be perfect fans have to roll with it, not buy tickets and if you don't even buy tickets it's kind of like people who don't vote, their voices aren't as loud. There are many people here who don't buy tickets and I'll leave that there.

This is a Great Post!!!
- Buff36

Thank you sir.

For the Pegula's, I fully understand why they would be angry, upset, and perhaps even jaded regarding being taken advantage of by some of the people they have hired, but the best approach is not the one they are taking.

The best approach is to understand this is business, and trust that they are hiring the right person or people, and most importantly, let those people do their work with minimal to no interference.

If those people fail due to their own ineptitude, then fire them and find new people, and repeat that until the right people are found.

If they continue to interfere, they will never know if they got the right people as their decisions will always be clouded by ownership mandates.

Let's say they didn't do meddling skinner wouldn't be here and jack would be a RFA this year .. so are you happy they did that ?
- gerbe75pts

Both of those showed how stupid Botterill was, IMO, and was one of the MANY tells indicating he was not fit for the job.

actually he only had 151 games to turn it around, because your tanking for dahlin
- homiedclown

He didn't even deserve 151 games.

He had 2 years to fill the blatantly obvious hole at forward and specifically the Center position, but instead hoarded defensemen like people were hoarding TP early on during the pandemic.

No disagreement the pegulas knew and agreed, but I would guess that tm went to them before he was hired said “I’m gonna rip it apart to go for mcdavid”, they said “ok sounds good”.
They agreed with it but tm was the one that pulled it off, pegulas had nothing to do with the actual transactions and moves that brought the tank, they just gave tm the green light, semantics I suppose.
- Sabres1523

He had to work really hard to pull it off as well, with how well all the goaltenders were playing that year.

He didn't even deserve 151 games.

He had 2 years to fill the blatantly obvious hole at forward and specifically the Center position, but instead hoarded defensemen like people were hoarding TP early on during the pandemic.
- kingcong39

tough call when your told to trade your number #2 center by the owners



honestly if they did an exhausted search for a vet GM, the crap taste in my mouth from the sabres would be easier to tolerate

Not that I agree or disagree with the rest of the post, because I don't want to be involved what so ever. But Imma stop you right there.

There is no achievement in the act of hiring a minority when that minority is your unqualified wife.
- TheSabresTaco

Every, if not most are unqualified, they jump into their own pro teams as toys and learn what they are doing. It's interesting how the chauvinist males on here beat up the female owner and the Sabres and Bills have had some male inept ones.

And thats why pat LaFontaine left he wanted t o sign miller,ott to 6 year deals he didn't like the lidea so they part ways
- gerbe75pts

Look, I'm a reasonable person. I'm able to see both sides of a situation fairly often, even if I disagree with one of the sides. Or both.

But you are defending the Pegulas much more than they deserve. I've met them too, on a few occasions. They are nice people, and they are dedicated to winning. That is a fact. They are also bullheaded, stubborn and naive. That is also a fact. They've done some wonderful things for this city. They've brought in revenue and outfitted both teams with prize player facilities.

They lucked into McDermott and Beane. This is a fact.

They have not lucked into a similar combo for Buffalo. This is a fact.

I have seen no proof of claimed over reaching, but the evidence stacks against them. Is OJ a murderer? He's as guilty as the Pegulas are in meddling, whether that be occasionally positive or mostly negative.

They try consulting with "NHL officials", do their homework (they always do their homework) and their hirings still fail. The people they hired, regardless of them being rookies to the position (not Disco), have been qualified and deserving of their promotions. They flopped. They simply didn't luck into the hires like they did with the Bills.

They injected truck loads of cash into both organizations. The wrong people hired the wrong people hired the wrong people. Not all problems go away by throwing money at it.

The hiring of Kevyn Adams tells me a few things.
1. They've lost trust in the outside hiring process. They shouldn't, but they did.
2. They've known him for nine years, he's exceeded all of his roles. If he laid out an intelligent game plan, they know him enough to trust that he will carry out his plan as laid out.
3. He may be a yes man, but even the Pegulas know that a yes man does not equal a winning franchise. Their dedication to winning, as noted above, will allow him to hopefully make the decisions in the best interest of the team.
4. They know Kevyn Adams is a highly intelligent man. They need to let him fill out the hockey staff as he sees fit, and they should do whatever possible to ensure that he's hiring the best available people. Keep in mind, it's a two way street, and these people also must be willing to fill the roles Adams is asking of them.

All in all, they need to get the (frank) out of the way. Forcing the GM to sign Eichel to a long term contract is in the best interest of the team, and if Botterill wasn't willing to do that, he should have been fired on the spot. Not to mention the rest of his personnel blunders.

tough call when your told to trade your number #2 center by the owners

honestly if they did an exhausted search for a vet GM, the crap taste in my mouth from the sabres would be easier to tolerate
- homiedclown

He still had two years after that mandated trade to address the issue, and instead he did the total opposite.

His reaction is entirely on him.

Having the first female president of any team in NHL history and one who is Asian that is a success, no deep thnking Gr8?
- GilPerreault11

9 straight years w/o the playoffs


next closest team is 4 years



congrats, she is doing a bang up job

No disagreement the pegulas knew and agreed, but I would guess that tm went to them before he was hired said “I’m gonna rip it apart to go for mcdavid”, they said “ok sounds good”.
They agreed with it but tm was the one that pulled it off, pegulas had nothing to do with the actual transactions and moves that brought the tank, they just gave tm the green light, semantics I suppose.
- Sabres1523

Well yeah. The point being, TM made the moves, the Pegulas ok'd the process.

Look, I'm a reasonable person. I'm able to see both sides of a situation fairly often, even if I disagree with one of the sides. Or both.

But you are defending the Pegulas much more than they deserve. I've met them too, on a few occasions. They are nice people, and they are dedicated to winning. That is a fact. They are also bullheaded, stubborn and naive. That is also a fact. They've done some wonderful things for this city. They've brought in revenue and outfitted both teams with prize player facilities.

They lucked into McDermott and Beane. This is a fact.

They have not lucked into a similar combo for Buffalo. This is a fact.

I have seen no proof of claimed over reaching, but the evidence stacks against them. Is OJ a murderer? He's as guilty as the Pegulas are in meddling, whether that be occasionally positive or mostly negative.

They try consulting with "NHL officials", do their homework (they always do their homework) and their hirings still fail. The people they hired, regardless of them being rookies to the position (not Disco), have been qualified and deserving of their promotions. They flopped. They simply didn't luck into the hires like they did with the Bills.

They injected truck loads of cash into both organizations. The wrong people hired the wrong people hired the wrong people. Not all problems go away by throwing money at it.

The hiring of Kevyn Adams tells me a few things.
1. They've lost trust in the outside hiring process. They shouldn't, but they did.
2. They've known him for nine years, he's exceeded all of his roles. If he laid out an intelligent game plan, they know him enough to trust that he will carry out his plan as laid out.
3. He may be a yes man, but even the Pegulas know that a yes man does not equal a winning franchise. Their dedication to winning, as noted above, will allow him to hopefully make the decisions in the best interest of the team.
4. They know Kevyn Adams is a highly intelligent man. They need to let him fill out the hockey staff as he sees fit, and they should do whatever possible to ensure that he's hiring the best available people. Keep in mind, it's a two way street, and these people also must be willing to fill the roles Adams is asking of them.

All in all, they need to get the (frank) out of the way. Forcing the GM to sign Eichel to a long term contract is in the best interest of the team, and if Botterill wasn't willing to do that, he should have been fired on the spot. Not to mention the rest of his personnel blunders.
- TheSabresTaco

This is pretty much what I tried to convey, only in a lot more words

He still had two years after that mandated trade to address the issue, and instead he did the total opposite.

His reaction is entirely on him.
- kingcong39

agreed, his plan A was casey
his plan B was johansson
his plan C was e-rod or sobotka


the plan A should have been a trade
the plan B should have been Reinhart

tough call when your told to trade your number #2 center by the owners



honestly if they did an exhausted search for a vet GM, the crap taste in my mouth from the sabres would be easier to tolerate
- homiedclown

I wonder what the percentage was of fans who wanted him traded because it was very high and if we go back to the archives many. many on here wanted ROR gone. I didn't

Darcy initially wanted the tank. He wanted superstar players you get at the top of the draft and who you win with and he even said that when he said in his speech this is going to be painful or hurt.

The Bills blew throughout a lot of the 70's and 80's and they didn't tear the MFer down on purpose they were just inept and now Ralph is revered by some, many. He even threatened to move as leverage to get whatever he wanted with the stadium, holding that fear over the fans' heads. Not every owner is going to be perfect fans have to roll with it, not buy tickets and if you don't even buy tickets it's kind of like people who don't vote, their voices aren't as loud. There are many people here who don't buy tickets and I'll leave that there.
- GilPerreault11

I feel like you went on a tangent here and threw several topics into a paragraph. But my point in the quoted post was, TM tanked on purpose and Terry let him.

He didn't even deserve 151 games.

He had 2 years to fill the blatantly obvious hole at forward and specifically the Center position, but instead hoarded defensemen like people were hoarding TP early on during the pandemic.
- kingcong39

(frank)ing guy had it filled and threw it away.

I wonder what the percentage was of fans who wanted him traded because it was very high and if we go back to the archives many. many on here wanted ROR gone. I didn't

- GilPerreault11

I wanted him gone


I changed


never hurts to be open minded and admit when you make a mistake


I will own it, as I have over the last 12 or so months

I feel like you went on a tangent here and threw several topics into a paragraph. But my point in the quoted post was, TM tanked on purpose and Terry let him.
- TheSabresTaco

No, it's not a tangent it's just a little uncomfortable to deal with, the truth.

Every, if not most are unqualified, they jump into their own pro teams as toys and learn what they are doing. It's interesting how the chauvinist males on here beat up the female owner and the Sabres and Bills have had some male inept ones.
- GilPerreault11

I certainly hope you don't assume that about me. I couldn't be more progressive when it comes to hires.

But I will never, ever endorse a minority (or any) hire of an unqualified person.

I feel like you went on a tangent here and threw several topics into a paragraph. But my point in the quoted post was, TM tanked on purpose and Terry let him.
- TheSabresTaco

the bills in the late 70's and the years after Knox left was a total joke and Ralph was the biggest reason why


I can honestly say the last 4 months of this season and last season for the sabres was harder for me to watch then those bills teams in the 80's

This is pretty much what I tried to convey, only in a lot more words
- kingcong39

Sometimes posts take a lot of words to convey the entire point, when the same conversation is going on for hours. I guess.

No, it's not a tangent it's just a little uncomfortable to deal with, the truth.
- GilPerreault11

what truth?


that we have the worst president of all the nhl teams?

9 straight years w/o the playoffs


next closest team is 4 years



congrats, she is doing a bang up job
- homiedclown

Ralph Wilson was no real HOFer as an owner, especially through the 70- and 80's but there he is in the HOF