The only way this trade lives up to what they gave up is if Kap puts up 30+ goals /60+ points. That's what you give a 1st round pick for you. This is poop asset management.
- Rinosaur

For 30 goals and 60 points? If he does that it's a steal for the Pens. Hollander isn't that good of a prospect.

20-25 goals and 50 points would make it a fair trade IMO.

If he fills the RW hole, and you have to think that's why they gave up so much for him, 3.2M is much better than what you'd get in free agency.
- Tojo.

This. I kind of hated the deal initially, but we're getting an obvious need at a very affordable hit. I had top 6 right handed RW as my top priority. Rutherford got that so I can't complain too much.

I have to admit, I wanted to see Halander develop here.

I never said we didn’t. I’ve said a couple times on this thread that Kap fills a need and have pushed back on people saying he doesn’t. If Hallander didn’t hold value we’re (frank)ed either way I guess, but he was still our most valuable expendable prospect. If we’re giving up our top to futures for a player, you’d hope itd be someone who’s better than Kapanen and can definitely be a high end contributor. Now we’re left with almost nothing to get a 3C and Kapanen could very well not solve our PP issue or elevate much higher than he’s already shown at Toronto.

Also we shouldn’t be spending assets on 3rd pairing D. They are super easy to find and every time we try to trade for one or spend significant cap space on one it ends in disaster. We need to stop the ground hog day farce of trying to acquire this mythical “high end third pairing guy” and just role with effective cheap options.
- Victoro311

45 points playing with Kadri and Johnsson and no PP time

and his 3.2 million dollar cap hit is a factor also, thats real value

Murray, Horn, McCann, all parts that can be moved or free up Cap to get a 3C

From my perspective this is a fair trade.
Kapanen has very very elite speed, plays with a bit of snarl, and seems to be a good team guy. There is no doubt he has top 6 physical skills. The issue with him is hockey sense or lack thereof . Whenever he was elevated to play with Matthews or Tavares he never stuck. Maybe he will figure it out.
No idea if Hallander is more than a 4th line centre but the key is the first rounder. If we draft a future top 6 forward or top 4 d-man it's a good trade for both teams.

For 30 goals and 60 points? If he does that it's a steal for the Pens. Hollander isn't that good of a prospect.

20-25 goals and 50 points would make it a fair trade IMO.
- Tojo.

Kapenen scores 20/44 with Johnsson and Kadri and no PP time

Put him with Jake and Sid and even some small PP and he hits 50/60 points easy

F'in Connor Sheary once scored 23/53 riding shotgun with Sid on the RW

I like it better than the Sheary trade.

I'd like it even more if we still had Kahun.

Lets make things abundantly clear here

When Sid/Geno go in 4-5 years we are BURNING THIS PLACE TO THE GROUND FOR THE FOLLOWING 5 SEASONS

The proven Penguin model is to get 3-4 franchise cornerstones in consecutive years in the draft and build from there

Draft lotto makes it harder, but the plan isn't to have the Hallenders/Addisons carry the team in the post Sid/Geno era

Quite honestly, when Sid/Geno go, I wouldn't be shocked at all to see guys like Jake and anyone else with a sliver of value shipped off for lotto picks

Did Kap live up to his good defensive promise in TO? one of his scouting traits was strong two way play I thought.

The only way this trade lives up to what they gave up is if Kap puts up 30+ goals /60+ points. That's what you give a 1st round pick for you. This is poop asset management.
- Rinosaur

Actually let me put this another way. You're a Toffoli fan. Did you see him getting 30 goals and 60 points? And what would have been his cap hit?

The Canucks gave up a similar package just to rent Toffoli. Madden is probably more valued than 15 overall this year and I think a 2nd is worth more than Hallander. We get 2 years at a low cap hit and then he's still a RFA which factors in.

The only way this trade lives up to what they gave up is if Kap puts up 30+ goals /60+ points. That's what you give a 1st round pick for you. This is poop asset management.
- Rinosaur

He'll never put up 30/60. More like 20-25 and 45-50 while playing both ends of special teams. Let's look at the last 20 15th overall picks to see what kind of player they can get you:

2019 Cole Caufield
2018 Grigori Denisenko
2017 Erik Brannstrom
2016 Luke Kunin
2015 Zachary Senyshyn
2014 Dylan Larkin
2013 Ryan Pulock
2012 Cody Ceci
2011 Jonathan Miller
2010 Derek Forbort
2009 Peter Holland
2008 Erik Karlsson
2007 Alex Plante
2006 Riku Helenius
2005 Ryan O'Marra
2004 Alexander Radulov
2003 Robert Nilsson
2002 Jesse Niinimak
2001 Igor Knyazev
2000 Artem Kryukov

I bolded the players that I feel are (or were) as good or better than Kapanen is right now. I didn't bold Caufield or Branndstrom, who have high upsides, because they haven't played an NHL game yet. So omitting them, that's 4/18, or less than a 1/4 chance.

Also, with very few exceptions, a 15th overall pick won't make an impact at the NHL level for at least 3 years, and the Penguins window is a 2-3 year window. Kapanen can come in and play right now in the middle 6. But if he puts up about 20-25G and 45-50P for the next 3 seasons, I'd take it.

You didn’t need proven NHLers. You needed an impact player or cap space to sign an impact player. This is piss poor asset management no matter how you try to spin it.
- Feds91Stammer

I cant really argue that...but I dont feel its piss poor, maybe just poor haha. Kap could be in the top 6 at RW, which was a need. ALL of the pieces the Pens traded could be bust. Kap is not a bust.

Actually let me put this another way. You're a Toffoli fan. Did you see him getting 30 goals and 60 points? And what would have been his cap hit?

The Canucks gave up a similar package just to rent Toffoli. Madden is probably more valued than 15 overall this year and I think a 2nd is worth more than Hallander. We get 2 years at a low cap hit and then he's still a RFA which factors in.
- Tojo.

This isn't a very good analogy. I wouldn't give up a 1st for Toffoli.

Did Kap live up to his good defensive promise in TO? one of his scouting traits was strong two way play I thought.
- MattStrat

He killed penalties at least. He was kind of neutral at driving play which is why heavy analytically leaning people won't like him. Not a drag just average. Bur if you put a guy with good scoring ability with play drivers, they convert points.

This isn't a very good analogy. I wouldn't give up a 1st for Toffoli.
- Rinosaur

You would of at deadline though, no?

Maybe that was others.

He killed penalties at least. He was kind of neutral at driving play which is why heavy analytically leaning people won't like him. Not a drag just average. Bur if you put a guy with good scoring ability with play drivers, they convert points.
- Tojo.

They usually do, yeah.

This isn't a very good analogy. I wouldn't give up a 1st for Toffoli.
- Rinosaur

I was arguing the Canucks did give that type of value. And that a mid 1st doesn't get a 30 goal and 60 point scorer.

I was arguing the Canucks did give that type of value. And that a mid 1st doesn't get a 30 goal and 60 point scorer.
- Tojo.

This. Unless a team is doing a firesale of their veterans, like Detroit should.

I hope he can be as effective as Rust. Then we should have the top 6 set for the next couple years.

An article wrote in TO a few days ago...

https://editorinleaf.com/...aple-leafs-kapanen-trade/

This. Unless a team is doing a firesale of their veterans, like Detroit should.
- jmatchett383

Detroit doesn’t have any 30-30-60 guys.

...your attempt at trolling is pretty weak. Plenty of others you could watch on this board to get better.

Not sure why a Buffalo fan is here trolling.

i gueess it's a pretty good reflection on your team when you're here talking smack about a trade at the deadline where you traded us 2 useless UFA/RFAs and we traded you one useless RFA.

Or are you suggesting without Rodrigues, this deal wouldnt have happened and we'd still hav Kahun and the 15th pick?
- SuperHenderson13

not trolling


you however are a d!ck

The kid has major wheels hahaha....he spent alot of time (effectively) in top 6 in 2018/2019.

So. Many. Breakaway. Goals.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AqcStNzQcBU

Detroit doesn’t have any 30-30-60 guys.
- Feds91Stammer

Larkin did once. He and Mantha could be if they played for a decent team.

...but they're probably 2 of the guys that are hardest to pry away.

New Blog

The more time I have to digest this, do not hate it as much as my initial gut reaction. Still an overpay, but not as much as I originally thought.

This signals the team is all in for the next two years, which after that, they probably won't be legitimate contenders no matter how well they played this offseason. Will be very interested to see the next moves to be made. At the very least this means Sheary will not sniff Crosby's wing ever again and that there is likely to be 5+ new faces on the ice the next time the Pens play, which was desperately needed.