Remember what Schultz was being called before going to the Pens? I do. Then he became a key piece to two cup wins.

Is it at all remotely possible that Matheson could be a Shultz 2.0 (1.5 seasons before bad injuries) for the Pens?

EDIT: Schultz's Oiler numbers look eerily similar to Matheson's Panther numbers...and at around same ages too.
- MattStrat

Key piece to 1 Cup, 2016, he only played 15/24 games and 11 min/g

Schultz’s play didn’t change when he came to Pittsburgh. His role did. He went from an overplayed 1D with ridiculous expectations on his shoulders to a sheltered 3D (and sheltered 2D for the second cup) and that’s what led to his brief success here in Pittsbugh before JJ sunk his game.

He didn’t get better, he was always the same player. His mistakes were limited due to deployment.
- j.boyd919

Well actually, he got worse haha, but that was after the big injury and very long layoff.

I think he played with more confidence when he came over, something he admitted himself was a huge issue in Edmonton.

EDIT: sheltered 2nd pair?

Key piece to 1 Cup, 2016, he only played 15/24 games and 11 min/g
- joecool2931

True then became one of the two in top pair next season with Letang out. He handled top pair responsibilities as well as top PP very, very well in 2017 with Cole as his partner. 51 points in 78 games regular season and 13 in 21 for cup winning playoffs.

Well actually, he got worse haha, but that was after the big injury and very long layoff.

I think he played with more confidence when he came over, something he admitted himself was a huge issue in Edmonton.
- MattStrat

For sure. The expectations were lower and he wasn’t getting battered by analysts on a regular basis anymore.

His TOI went from top pair to 3rd pair and then to 2nd pair. But that’s what I am saying. He really wasn’t a different player. His role was different and he excelled more when in a reduced role.

Not saying that Matheson won’t excel, but come on, the Pens aren’t some sort of Dmen whisperers like every says they are. I get being optimistic sometimes but there’s enough NHL data and video on these guys (Schultz, JJ, Hainsey, Matheson, etc.) to know what you’re getting yourself into vs. a more unknown commodity like a Marino lol

For sure. The expectations were lower and he wasn’t getting battered by analysts on a regular basis anymore.

His TOI went from top pair to 3rd pair and then to 2nd pair. But that’s what I am saying. He really wasn’t a different player. His role was different and he excelled more when in a reduced role.

Not saying that Matheson won’t excel, but come on, the Pens aren’t some sort of Dmen whisperers like every says they are. I get being optimistic sometimes but there’s enough NHL data and video on these guys (Schultz, JJ, Hainsey, Matheson, etc.) to know what you’re getting yourself into vs. a more unknown commodity like a Marino lol
- j.boyd919

Well thats why I asked "is it remotely possible that Matheson becomes Schultz 2.0"...I think the answer is yes, but really, I dont want to try and find out at all hahah...and might not have to yet.

True then became one of the two in top pair next season with Letang out. He handled top pair responsibilities as well as top PP very, very well in 2017 with Cole as his partner. 51 points in 78 games regular season and 13 in 21 for cup winning playoffs.
- MattStrat

Yes, very key Piece to the second run.

I have always been pro-shultz, especially on the PP. as much as i love letang, i think he is atrocious as a PP QB. would have liked to see him on the right half wall this year with Shultz at the pt.

But i just don't think matheson is a shultz situation. He has 1rd pedigree, 20-30pts a season, almost 10g a season, so i guess its a possibility, but i just don't feel like it will be.

The trade makes no sense for the Pens.
- Rinosaur

How come? I assume we are getting rid of Jacko so it makes sense. I don't wanna spend $5.3M on a 3rd line player and Matheson could be a $4.8M puck moving Top 4 defenseman. We all know other moves will come and Jacko's days are counted.

Schultz ATOI in 2015/2016 was 14:14 per game with Pens (20:20 with Oil)

Schultz ATOI in 2016/2017 was 20:27 per game
Coles ATOI in 2016/2017 was 19:49 per game
Dumo's ATOI in 2016/2017 was 20:33 per game
Hainsey's ATOI in 2016/2017 was 21:00 per game

Remember what Schultz was being called before going to the Pens? I do. Then he became a key piece to two cup wins.

Is it at all remotely possible that Matheson could be a Shultz 2.0 (1.5 seasons before bad injuries) for the Pens?

EDIT: Schultz's Oiler numbers look eerily similar to Matheson's Panther numbers...and at around same ages too.
- MattStrat

That's my hope.

How come? I assume we are getting rid of Jacko so it makes sense. I don't wanna spend $5.3M on a 3rd line player and Matheson could be a $4.8M puck moving Top 4 defenseman. We all know other moves will come and Jacko's days are counted.
- Barnaby36

I just dont see how anyone could assume this given all the factors involved.

Crosby and Malkin don’t really increase players statistics anymore. There was a study year or ago about that.
- j.boyd919

I'd be curious how that broke down ES v PP.

When those guys are on I think there is a little bump, but for most skill guys it tends to balance out with the fact they don't get any PP time here since our top unit extends there shift more than most. The guys who I think see a bump are guys like Dupuis who don't get PP anyways. Or Jake a year ago, doubt he's a point a game player with mostly ES scoring with most centers.

How come? I assume we are getting rid of Jacko so it makes sense. I don't wanna spend $5.3M on a 3rd line player and Matheson could be a $4.8M puck moving Top 4 defenseman. We all know other moves will come and Jacko's days are counted.
- Barnaby36

I wouldn’t assume that JJ is going anywhere lol

I'd be curious how that broke down ES v PP.

When those guys are on I think there is a little bump, but for most skill guys it tends to balance out with the fact they don't get any PP time here since our top unit extends there shift more than most. The guys who I think see a bump are guys like Dupuis who don't get PP anyways. Or Jake a year ago, doubt he's a point a game player with mostly ES scoring with most centers.
- Tojo.

I’ll see if I can find the article

I just dont see how anyone could assume this given all the factors involved.
- MattStrat

Getting Rid = most likely buying him out or buring him in the minors lol Trading him would be very unlikely unless we eat some salary and attach him to Murray in a trade (to Ottawa).lol

I wouldn’t assume that JJ is going anywhere lol
- j.boyd919

Yea, i don't have much faith it will happen. Maybe next year, with 1 less year on the albatross contract??

He did trade Scuds...so its a possibility, but JJ is much worse.

Getting Rid = most likely buying him out or buring him in the minors lol Trading him would be very unlikely unless we eat some salary and attach him to Murray in a trade (to Ottawa).lol
- Barnaby36

Well one of the factors, that I aforementioned, is that I'm pretty sure JR is on record saying he doesn't believe in or doesn't do buy outs...

Schultz’s play didn’t change when he came to Pittsburgh. His role did. He went from an overplayed 1D with ridiculous expectations on his shoulders to a sheltered 3D (and sheltered 2D for the second cup) and that’s what led to his brief success here in Pittsbugh before JJ sunk his game.

He didn’t get better, he was always the same player. His mistakes were limited due to deployment.
- j.boyd919

That might be a good sign for Matheson actually because his SKATR said he was in the 86% of TOI against elites over the past 2 years. Because other than that one outlier year in 16-17, I agree that's what happened with Schultz.

And before anyone jumps on me, no I wouldn't take that chance on Matheson.

Yes, very key Piece to the second run.

I have always been pro-shultz, especially on the PP. as much as i love letang, i think he is atrocious as a PP QB. would have liked to see him on the right half wall this year with Shultz at the pt.

But i just don't think matheson is a shultz situation. He has 1rd pedigree, 20-30pts a season, almost 10g a season, so i guess its a possibility, but i just don't feel like it will be.
- joecool2931

Schultz moved the puck very well on the PP and had a better shot than Letang. It's a fact.

That might be a good sign for Matheson actually because his SKATR said he was in the 86% of TOI against elites over the past 2 years. Because other than that one outlier year in 16-17, I agree that's what happened with Schultz.

And before anyone jumps on me, no I wouldn't take that chance on Matheson.
- Tojo.

You agree he was on a sheltered 2nd pair?

Getting Rid = most likely buying him out or buring him in the minors lol Trading him would be very unlikely unless we eat some salary and attach him to Murray in a trade (to Ottawa).lol
- Barnaby36

PIT is a budget team with an internal salary cap of $75m they are not buying out or burying any contracts.

I’ll see if I can find the article
- j.boyd919

I want to say it was PensBlog or Pensburgh but I’m having trouble figuring out what terms to search haha

I wouldn’t assume that JJ is going anywhere lol
- j.boyd919

Bury the f**er

Bury the f**er
- Barnaby36

Not gonna happen.

True then became one of the two in top pair next season with Letang out. He handled top pair responsibilities as well as top PP very, very well in 2017 with Cole as his partner. 51 points in 78 games regular season and 13 in 21 for cup winning playoffs.
- MattStrat

That second year for Schultz was pretty much a career year. He didn't play like that the rest of his time here, but he was a legit #3 that ran the PP for one season. I won't say #1 because he didn't take the tough defensive matchups like Letang does.

Not gonna happen.
- Feds91Stammer

F off One can dream