Having a 1 line team worked for Boston and Edmonton.
- ImThatGuy

Boston did just go to game 7 of the Cup Final last year. And those guys play defense, unlike the guys in Edmonton.

Is points are only evaluation tool in 2020?
- sbroads24

Again, it was a good question.
Feel free to add your opinion
JC...this board can be so friggin antagonistic

Add the fancy stuff, I'm not great at it , and one misstep and it is like one shot the Pope, The President and the Queen at the same time.

Out of curiosity, how do you define a 1RW? There aren't 31 RWs in the NHL that are better than Reinhart. So do most teams just not have a 1RW?
- JetpackJesus

Well, Stepan is the 1C in Arizona. That should answer your question.

Sorry but some of the best answers are the simplest ones, especially on a site like this. Talent tells me who is the first-line talent. I hope you enjoyed your post but data and stats can be manipulated by others so how legit is that? Jack carries Sam very far so how skewed are his rogue stats? Sometimes you have to go with analytics about Sam which we have beaten to death and what we see, the eye test. Thank you for acknowledging my genius and I acknowledge your jealousy and I give you pitty if that what is what you are seeking
- GilPerreault11

I'll ge antagonistic now.
So a lot of self-serving BS that translated from gobbly(frank)inggook means...(frank), I don't know.
Thought so...but carry on impressing yourself.

Jack Quinnoff
- Pegullaville

Most intelligent post of the day.

Your answer was not at all helpful and completely ignored the rest of my post. I know exactly as much after your response as I did before it.

It seems you aren't actually interested in (or able to?) explain your point, so I'm just going to move on.

And to answer your question from your other post: No, I don't think VO is a 1LW in the NHL. He's only the third-best LW on his own team going into this season. But I also wouldn't determine whether or not Sam is a 1RW based on the fact he plays with Jack, so I'm not sure what the point of your question was.
- JetpackJesus

Would you determine his 51 average points with Jack, 51 pts which is not much more than Tyler Ennis without Jack? If he didn't have the benefit of playing with Jack how many points would he perhaps have? Would your view of him as a 1st line winger change from his 51 pt average? Would he have the 65 pts he had with Jack and Skinner when Skinner had a shooting percentage off the charts and above his norm? Since you want to talk stats and analytics? It is good to be a homer, the team needs a lot of those too.

Have you EVER watched hockey... every player, EVER! Has a dopey nickname....
- Gr8daygo

Did u miss where i said “for me”?
Idc care about all the dumb nicknames

And no, not “EVERY PLAYER EVER” has one
U guys are welcome to do what u like,
but MANY times i feel like you’re trying too hard

Again, it was a good question.
Feel free to add your opinion
JC...this board can be so friggin antagonistic

Add the fancy stuff, I'm not great at it , and one misstep and it is like one shot the Pope, The President and the Queen at the same time.
- IonSabres

Calm down there Sally.

I just think we should take on ice impacts into consideration

Mark Stone is usually a 70 point winger and he’s a top 3 winger in hockey because dude shuts down everyone he faces along with being good on offense

Reinhart is better than some wingers who put up more points than him

I'll ge antagonistic now.
So a lot of self-serving BS that translated from gobbly(frank)inggook means...(frank), I don't know.
Thought so...but carry on impressing yourself.
- IonSabres

Man, you are upping each post. Let's go higher!!

Would you determine his 51 average points with Jack, 51 pts which is not much more than Tyler Ennis without Jack? If he didn't have the benefit of playing with Jack how many points would he perhaps have? Would your view of him as a 1st line winger change from his 51 pt average? Would he have the 65 pts he had with Jack and Skinner when Skinner had a shooting percentage off the charts and above his norm? Since you want to talk stats and analytics? It is good to be a homer, the team needs a lot of those too.
- GilPerreault11

I believe as far as putting 1st line RWers into 3 categories:

Elite
Good
Average


Elites are the Patty Kane type (hint there aren't a lot of them)
Good are the Timo Meier type (even though he didn't have a "good" season)
Average are the Tyler Toffoili type

I think Reinhart is a tweener between good and average

There are times he plays in the good category for a stretch and then he goes back down to average

He still is in my opinion a solid top line RWer.

BUT there are better out there for sure

I believe as far as putting 1st line RWers into 3 categories:

Elite
Good
Average


Elites are the Patty Kane type (hint there aren't a lot of them)
Good are the Timo Meier type (even though he didn't have a "good" season)
Average are the Tyler Toffoili type

I think Reinhart is a tweener between good and average

There are times he plays in the good category for a stretch and then he goes back down to average

He still is in my opinion a solid top line RWer.

BUT there are better out there for sure
- Stripes77

I agree with that.

Well, Stepan is the 1C in Arizona. That should answer your question.
- Wetbandit1

I will clarify that, while I picked the number 31 because that's how many teams there are, I did not pick it because those players are spread evenly among the teams. There are multiple teams that have more than one of the top players at any given position. Malkin has been a 2C his entire career and also one of the best players in the NHL.

What I was trying to find out from Gil is if he defines first-liner in a way that you might have only 10-15 (random numbers) first liners at a certain position in the entire league at any given time. I might agree with that depending on the definition. But I have no idea what Gil means, and saying the word "Talent" doesn't help.

I mean, there are more NFL teams than quality starting QBs, but there are still 32 starting QBs every week. There are fewer quality starting pitchers in MLB than there are rotation spots. I could buy the idea that there are fewer top-line caliber players in the NHL than there are top-line positions available, but I also think it's much harder to quantify or define a "top-liner" than those other examples I mentioned.

Calm down there Sally.

I just think we should take on ice impacts into consideration

Mark Stone is usually a 70 point winger and he’s a top 3 winger in hockey because dude shuts down everyone he faces along with being good on offense

Reinhart is better than some wingers who put up more points than him
- sbroads24

Although they are different stylistically speaking.

I have Reinhart and Nylander with similar impacts.

Both are definitely top 6 RW’s but I wouldn’t go as far as to say either of them are “top line” talents.

Sam is also 24 and maybe during his peak (ages 26-30) he tops out as a poor mans Mark Stone.

I'll ge antagonistic now.
So a lot of self-serving BS that translated from gobbly(frank)inggook means...(frank), I don't know.
Thought so...but carry on impressing yourself.
- IonSabres

Good to see you out from under the couch ion s.

Relax and stay calm 🐕🐩

What is this talk about being a top line or top 6 winger with Rhino, because on the Sabres he is a 1st line RW, unless Hall makes the switch to RW.

Would you determine his 51 average points with Jack, 51 pts which is not much more than Tyler Ennis without Jack? If he didn't have the benefit of playing with Jack how many points would he perhaps have? Would your view of him as a 1st line winger change from his 51 pt average? Would he have the 65 pts he had with Jack and Skinner when Skinner had a shooting percentage off the charts and above his norm? Since you want to talk stats and analytics? It is good to be a homer, the team needs a lot of those too.
- GilPerreault11

I am not even disagreeing with you. I literally just want to know how you define a first-liner, so I can understand your position and figure out if I agree with it with respect to Sam.

Even if I end up not agreeing with how you qualify a player as a top-liner, I might actually agree with your assessment of Sam as a player.

At least several other people have described how they view top-liners and their assessment of Sam, so this hasn't been a complete waste of time.

What’s all this trade for Kane talk anyways?

Is Chicago shopping him?

Did u miss where i said “for me”?
Idc care about all the dumb nicknames

And no, not “EVERY PLAYER EVER” has one
U guys are welcome to do what u like,
but MANY times i feel like you’re trying too hard
- jdfitz77

go away

What’s all this trade for Kane talk anyways?

Is Chicago shopping him?
- jdfitz77

it's a rumor site.

go away

go away
- TheHank

Look who’s trolling... AGAIN
What a shocker

What’s all this trade for Kane talk anyways?

Is Chicago shopping him?
- jdfitz77

Showtime

Look who’s trolling... AGAIN
What a shocker
- jdfitz77

that's not trolling.

What’s all this trade for Kane talk anyways?

Is Chicago shopping him?
- jdfitz77

With Toews coming out saying he doesn't understand the direction of the team there are people who think Chicago is considering a complete rebuild.

Even Hawks fans on Capfriendly have been putting together rosters without both Kane and Toews. Some of the packages I have seen are intriguing others are either not enough going from Buffalo (even some Hawks fans posters) or not enough.

Kane is elite, but I don't see how Buffalo could bring him on with Hall (still weird that he is a Sabre) and keeping the cap reasonable to be able to re-sign Dahlin next off-season.

If I am Chicago I would want Cozens and next years first included in a trade plus a roster player or two who are younger. Buffalo is NOT in a position to move BOTH Cozens and next years first. I would move next years first in a heartbeat but I don't see Buffalo putting up the best package for him. Kane does have the ultimate say though since he has a full NMC. He could say if you're trading me, I am only going here sort of like what Hasek did, and if that's the case I would imagine Chicago just keeps him.

Edit: How about Skinner next years first Mitts and Pekar? Not enough most likely but it gives Chicago youth. The only way I could see Kane coming here and being flexible with the cap is if Skinner goes the other way.

With Toews coming out saying he doesn't understand the direction of the team there are people who think Chicago is considering a complete rebuild.

Even Hawks fans on Capfriendly have been putting together rosters without both Kane and Toews. Some of the packages I have seen are intriguing others are either not enough going from Buffalo (even some Hawks fans posters) or not enough.

Kane is elite, but I don't see how Buffalo could bring him on with Hall (still weird that he is a Sabre) and keeping the cap reasonable to be able to re-sign Dahlin next off-season.

If I am Chicago I would want Cozens and next years first included in a trade plus a roster player or two who are younger. Buffalo is NOT in a position to move BOTH Cozens and next years first. I would move next years first in a heartbeat but I don't see Buffalo putting up the best package for him. Kane does have the ultimate say though since he has a full NMC. He could say if you're trading me, I am only going here sort of like what Hasek did, and if that's the case I would imagine Chicago just keeps him.
- Stripes77

Apparently there was a letter that was sent by the Blackhawks to STHs and implied a rebuild. I didn't see it, heard about in on XM's hockey station.

Bolts, Ray's, Bucs...
1 Down, 1 in the works, the other trying to get there.
Would be cool to see