Yes, yes, and nobody has career years with the Jets anywhere unless they are Jets lifers.

We also know that Laine has, thus far, sustainably outscored his possession issues. He is not the only player to do this, nor do we have any evidence to suggest he’s the main issue.
- Rexypoo

You can't prove that last paragraph. What stat are you using to state that Laine out scored his possession issues? The guy was on pace for 30-35 goals just like I predicted he would get prior to the 2019-20 season.

The guy averages 220 shots per year and with a 12.5% that equals to 31 goals a year. He had an abnormally high % during his 44 goal year where he shot 18%. Ovechkin's annual shooting % is always between 9-12%. He's normally at 50 goals. You can calculate the shots.

Based off of your comments, you have a hate on for Laine.

Yes Laine uses his size, he was a physical presence last season throwing his weight around and finishing his checks, he's not a full blown power forward as he shouldn't be cause that'd be a waste of his ability but he does use his size effectively.

Idk how you define havoc but just having him in the offensive zone creates havoc as teams know they can't just leave him uncovered which opens up space for Laine's linemates.

Scheifele and Connor were on pace for career years playing with Laine and Laine was on pace for a career season himself, that was before they were broken up when Eakin was acquired.

Buff was pretty polarizing, I'm sure there wouldn't be nearly as much discussion around Laine if he was Canadian.

Who gives a f*ck what PuckIQ says, analytics mean nothing to me. So PuckIQ says both Lowry and Laine have bad advanced analytic hockey stats while Laine was on pace for another 30 goal season and was just shy of being a point per game player while Lowry was on pace for less then 20 points so what does that say about the value of these analytics, they're not worth the data and electricity they're consuming imo.
- JetFuel

Based on your comments you absolutely hate Scheifele.

Based on your comments you absolutely hate Scheifele.
- TheUltimateJet

I literally laughed out loud at that, no I don't hate Scheifele, his play has been questionable though the last couple seasons.

Benny's Christmas Wish List:

1) One of the other teams takes Perreault off of our hands.
2) Wheeler and Schiefele come back rejuvenated from the break.
3) Laine stops complaining about his usage and his linemates and just becomes the best player that he can be.
4) Stastny is the same player that he was 2-3 years ago.
5) Do something with Niku. Play him or move him.
6) Don't rush Perfetti.
7) Sign Roslovic. He is not Top 6, but a valuable depth forward.
8) Progress from the youngsters and Chevy's promise to stop acquiring veteran fringe players.
9) More goals from Ehlers
10)Another Vezina like season from Helly.
Happy Holidays to all and let's hope for hockey in early 2021 !
- bennythehat

Surprised there isn't a new hat on Benny's Chris Wish List... 😉😃

Seriously though I think you could make #10 something like: No regression in play from Hellebuyck and Pionk.

Cause really with how this D core is constructed it's gonna need another big season from Pionk and Helly to survive and both need to stay healthy.

Some good discussion of Laine. I disagree with the idea that he creates space for linemates because of the shot. Look how much space defenses give him when he doesn’t have the puck, then the swarm when he does.

What has happened in the last year and half is that teams figured out that they don’t have to cover him. They play the puck carrier a little tighter and close the passing lanes. Laine doesn’t change the lanes well yet, less clean passes, easy turnover for the d.

I literally laughed out loud at that, no I don't hate Scheifele, his play has been questionable though the last couple seasons.
- JetFuel

You Should actually be laughing at yourself based on how juvenile that sounds.

I don't hate Laine. I do though believe my criticism of him is valid.

You Should actually be laughing at yourself based on how juvenile that sounds.

I don't hate Laine. I do though believe my criticism of him is valid.
- TheUltimateJet

Not sure how it sounds juvenile but okay.

And I think my criticism of Scheifele is valid,
hell two other commenters on here that rarely agree with me have said the same thing, I don't hate Scheifele but something is up with him.

Not sure how it sounds juvenile but okay.

And I think my criticism of Scheifele is valid,
hell two other commenters on here that rarely agree with me have said the same thing, I don't hate Scheifele but something is up with him.
- JetFuel

Fair enough. In Scheifele's case, the decline could be based on him playing hard minutes for multiple seasons, or him just being tired of the coach. I would actually like to see this line-up with a different coach.

In my opinion I find it concerning that you don't see the juvenille(ness) in saying that I hate Laine. It's just as dumb as me saying that you hate Scheifele, there is nothing to gain or learn by making that statement.

Also there are posters on this board that I consistently disagree with that also agree with Laine criticisms. At the end of the day they are all just opinion statements.

Fair enough. In Scheifele's case, the decline could be based on him playing hard minutes for multiple seasons, or him just being tired of the coach. I would actually like to see this line-up with a different coach.

In my opinion I find it concerning that you don't see the juvenille(ness) in saying that I hate Laine. It's just as dumb as me saying that you hate Scheifele, there is nothing to gain or learn by making that statement.

Also there are posters on this board that I consistently disagree with that also agree with Laine criticisms. At the end of the day they are all just opinion statements.
- TheUltimateJet

Ugh! More agreement with UJ., but true,. The Jets drafted core from Scheifele on have basically had 1 coach for their careers (Scheifele 2 months of Noel). Lets see what happens to Conner, Laine, etc with a new message in the room before defining the type of player they are, or worse trading them.

You can't prove that last paragraph. What stat are you using to state that Laine out scored his possession issues? The guy was on pace for 30-35 goals just like I predicted he would get prior to the 2019-20 season.

The guy averages 220 shots per year and with a 12.5% that equals to 31 goals a year. He had an abnormally high % during his 44 goal year where he shot 18%. Ovechkin's annual shooting % is always between 9-12%. He's normally at 50 goals. You can calculate the shots.
- TheUltimateJet

I, in fact, can rather easily prove that last paragraph. Largely because Laine typically has more goals for with him on the ice than goals against.

The stuff you wrote is completely unrelated to the point you’re arguing.

Ugh! More agreement with UJ., but true,. The Jets drafted core from Scheifele on have basically had 1 coach for their careers (Scheifele 2 months of Noel). Lets see what happens to Conner, Laine, etc with a new message in the room before defining the type of player they are, or worse trading them.
- BWJumper

We know Maurice has always had a problem getting the most out of his lineup. He’s got all the same issues here he did in Carolina and Toronto. He’s unfortunately just one of those guys who is what he is. He’s gonna do things his way, and only his way, for as long as people are willing to pay him for it.

Scheifele’s decline is likely a combination of 3 factors:
1: Not being at his peak anymore. I’m not saying its a huge drop, but if he went from an A+ to an A, it’s gonna show a bit in the results.
2: He’s fed up. Dude just doesn’t skate as hard these days. He likely gets away with it because he’s still an overwhelming offensive force, and the Jets system encourages flaccid and slow play, but his peak seasons where the ones where he was doing a lot of rush leading and board work below the goal line.
3: The transition game is dead. It wasn’t in 16-18. Scheifele isn’t as effective, and gets murdered on defence, because all he does now is play defence. He was never amazing at it, but it helps when you don’t need to do it much. Best defence is a good offence.

I, in fact, can rather easily prove that last paragraph. Largely because Laine typically has more goals for with him on the ice than goals against.

The stuff you wrote is completely unrelated to the point you’re arguing.
- Rexypoo

Round and around we go, circular arguments with Rexypoo/Jetsnation that don't go anywhere.

What fancy stat are you going to use +/-?

Round and around we go, circular arguments with Rexypoo/Jetsnation that don't go anywhere.

What fancy stat are you going to use +/-?
- TheUltimateJet

No. I’m using actual goals for and against. Plus/minus is dead and buried.

No. I’m using actual goals for and against. Plus/minus is dead and buried.
- Rexypoo

I checked
http://www.nhl.com/stats/...sMinus&page=0&pageSize=50

It’s very much alive and well, seems one article written a few years back couldn’t kill it.

But for the love all good things time for a new article and topic of discussion

But

I checked
http://www.nhl.com/stats/...sMinus&page=0&pageSize=50

It’s very much alive and well, seems one article written a few years back couldn’t kill it.

But for the love all good things time for a new article and topic of discussion

But
- Ross77

Nobody who wants to be taken seriously mentions plus/minus. There’s better stats that do the same thing, but correctly

Nobody who wants to be taken seriously mentions plus/minus. There’s better stats that do the same thing, but correctly
- Rexypoo

They all have flaws. This is the only truth.

No. I’m using actual goals for and against. Plus/minus is dead and buried.
- Rexypoo

Well if that is what you are using and if you do have critical thinking skills, you will be able to deduce that Scheifele and Connor are on for more goals than Laine due to the simple fact they play the penalty kill.

Now, we will all hear what a great penalty killer Laine is from our main man, Rexypoo!

I will break it down in laymen terms for you Rexypoo. Theoretically if the Jets penalty kill operates at 90% and the Jets average 4 penalty kills a game, that would meet on every tenth penalty kill, the Jets would be scored on. Essentially allowing one power play goal against every three games on average. If we were to break that down over an entire season, players playing on the penalty kill would be on the ice for an additional 27 goals against. Let's say for argument sakes that Scheifele and Connor are on for 50% of power play goals against, that would result in both of them having an additional 13.5 goals against as opposed to players like Laine for example that don't play the penalty kill.

Fair enough. In Scheifele's case, the decline could be based on him playing hard minutes for multiple seasons, or him just being tired of the coach. I would actually like to see this line-up with a different coach.

In my opinion I find it concerning that you don't see the juvenille(ness) in saying that I hate Laine. It's just as dumb as me saying that you hate Scheifele, there is nothing to gain or learn by making that statement.

Also there are posters on this board that I consistently disagree with that also agree with Laine criticisms. At the end of the day they are all just opinion statements.
- TheUltimateJet

Idk, just seems like there is a ton of nitpicking from you (and others) when it comes to Laine,
when I read things of what they want him to do but they'd actually make him less effective I sense it just doesn't matter what he does, it won't be enough and saying he doesn't do certain things when he clearly did most of them this past season then what else could it be then just a flat out dislike for him.

I too would like to see what a different coach would/could do with this core, I wonder how long the rope is for this coach and wonder how long it is for Chevy as well.

*Please Chevy and Maurice fans/believers please recognize I'm NOT calling for them to be fired, just wonder how much longer they've got if we see the same results going forward.

Idk, just seems like there is a ton of nitpicking from you (and others) when it comes to Laine,
when I read things of what they want him to do but they'd actually make him less effective I sense it just doesn't matter what he does, it won't be enough and saying he doesn't do certain things when he clearly did most of them this past season then what else could it be then just a flat out dislike for him.

I too would like to see what a different coach would/could do with this core, I wonder how long the rope is for this coach and wonder how long it is for Chevy as well.

*Please Chevy and Maurice fans/believers please recognize I'm NOT calling for them to be fired, just wonder how much longer they've got if we see the same results going forward.
- JetFuel

I think the coach and GM kind of got a ‘bye’ last season because of the buff and little situation. Missing the playoffs this season would be unacceptable from my perspective.

I am a supporter of both coach and GM but recognize they have had enough opportunity to make this their organization from top to bottom. The results have to progress.

Idk, just seems like there is a ton of nitpicking from you (and others) when it comes to Laine,
when I read things of what they want him to do but they'd actually make him less effective I sense it just doesn't matter what he does, it won't be enough and saying he doesn't do certain things when he clearly did most of them this past season then what else could it be then just a flat out dislike for him.

I too would like to see what a different coach would/could do with this core, I wonder how long the rope is for this coach and wonder how long it is for Chevy as well.

*Please Chevy and Maurice fans/believers please recognize I'm NOT calling for them to be fired, just wonder how much longer they've got if we see the same results going forward.
- JetFuel

I only nitpick on him when comparisons to Ovechkin are made. Outside of a comparable shot, both players have nothing in common. I said last offseason, a friend of mine made the accurate comparison of comparing Laine to Rick Nash. I was okay with that, but when posters like Rexypoo make these absurd statements that Laine is a 50-60 goal guy, those statements need to be checked.

i said last offseason that Laine is a 25-35 goal scorer that can add 25-35 assists. I said that makes him good, only to be put on blast by some posters saying I was undervaluing him (not sure calling someone a 35/35 guy is undervaluing but whatever). Accurately Laine is a 35/35 guy, that may periodically be a 80 point player. He might also be able to score 50 if he hits lightning in a bottle like he did two years ago and have an insane shooting percentage around 25%.

Otherwise keep expectations for him realistic.

Well if that is what you are using and if you do have critical thinking skills, you will be able to deduce that Scheifele and Connor are on for more goals than Laine due to the simple fact they play the penalty kill.

Now, we will all hear what a great penalty killer Laine is from our main man, Rexypoo!

I will break it down in laymen terms for you Rexypoo. Theoretically if the Jets penalty kill operates at 90% and the Jets average 4 penalty kills a game, that would meet on every tenth penalty kill, the Jets would be scored on. Essentially allowing one power play goal against every three games on average. If we were to break that down over an entire season, players playing on the penalty kill would be on the ice for an additional 27 goals against. Let's say for argument sakes that Scheifele and Connor are on for 50% of power play goals against, that would result in both of them having an additional 13.5 goals against as opposed to players like Laine for example that don't play the penalty kill.
- TheUltimateJet

I was actually talking about even strength. 5v5. Didn’t read that, because we already know Connor and Scheifele suck at killing penalties, and Copp does the majority of the work there.

I only nitpick on him when comparisons to Ovechkin are made. Outside of a comparable shot, both players have nothing in common. I said last offseason, a friend of mine made the accurate comparison of comparing Laine to Rick Nash. I was okay with that, but when posters like Rexypoo make these absurd statements that Laine is a 50-60 goal guy, those statements need to be checked.

i said last offseason that Laine is a 25-35 goal scorer that can add 25-35 assists. I said that makes him good, only to be put on blast by some posters saying I was undervaluing him (not sure calling someone a 35/35 guy is undervaluing but whatever). Accurately Laine is a 35/35 guy, that may periodically be a 80 point player. He might also be able to score 50 if he hits lightning in a bottle like he did two years ago and have an insane shooting percentage around 25%.

Otherwise keep expectations for him realistic.
- TheUltimateJet

Rick Nash was a phenomenal player in his time. We should be so lucky to have one of those.

I was actually talking about even strength. 5v5. Didn’t read that, because we already know Connor and Scheifele suck at killing penalties, and Copp does the majority of the work there.
- Rexypoo

This is too easy. Plus/minus only measures goals for and against during even strength. Scheifele has never been a negative player. Laine on the other hand was on the ice for an astonishing 24 more goals against than for in 2018-19, where he went -24.

+/- is your advanced stat 🤣and that is too funny

Edit: Wheeler has only been negative once since he's been a Jet and that was in 2012-13.

Rick Nash was a phenomenal player in his time. We should be so lucky to have one of those.
- Rexypoo

We do, his name is Patrik Laine!

Apparently Liiga tracks player speed, and Henri Nikkanen was clocked at 39.3km/h.
This in and of itself wouldn’t do much for me, as a common dumbass who doesn’t know how fast things usually move, but we know McDavid’s top speed is 40.9km/h... so now I’m excited about Nikkanen’s potential all over again.

Training camp is gonna be my favourite part of this season.