They play 14+ minutes a night, they're overrated 4th line plugs!
- JetFuel

I couldn't agree more. Now if you could convince Maurice of this.

Nothing in either Copp and especially Lowry's game indicate they are great passers. Putting a "shooter" on their line would do nothing but bring the shooters stats down.

You are inaccurately assuming that just because Copp is good at zone enteries that somehow he and to a lesser extent Lowry have a high enough of a hockey IQ to make players that play with them better. And, you being the biggest Laine fan would never for a second consider putting him on with these plugs.
- TheUltimateJet

Copp also generates a lot of scoring chances for his linemates. Otherwise known as being a good playmaker

I couldn't agree more. Now if you could convince Maurice of this.
- islansjet

Calling Copp a 4th line plug is so overtly unintelligent, I honestly can’t believe either one of you are serious.
We are so far past that being a possible opinion, with all the games watched and information available, that I’m writing it off as poor trolling.

While he had his fair share of struggles last year, Copp has the track record of uniquely dominant 3rd liner. In the 3 years prior to last year, he pasted the "lesser competition" he faced to the tune of 100-66 (60.2% GF). His outscoring breakdown by level of competition was as follows:

Top comp (28.5% of his TOI): 32GF to 20GA
Middle comp (36.9% of his TOI): 33GF to 18GA
Bottom comp (34.6% of his TOI): 35GF to 28GA

Many teams deploy their bottom-6 forwards in the (often vain) hope that they can pull even- let alone outscore. Say whatever you will about the level of competition or his lack of abilities, but that's 32 goals that your top-6 doesn't have to make up for.

Even if he didn't do so last year, I wouldn't be as dismissive of his value to the team as some of what I'm reading here ("overrated 4th line plug", for example). He's earned a longer rope than one down year the results of which are mostly a by-product of being forced up the line-up (Copp and Lowry were still 11 to 9 when on-ice together).

Calling Copp a 4th line plug is so overtly unintelligent, I honestly can’t believe either one of you are serious.
We are so far past that being a possible opinion, with all the games watched and information available, that I’m writing it off as poor trolling.
- Rexypoo

Sorry that was a little harsh, Copp's a little better then 4th line plug, that corpse Maurice forces him to carry around definitely is though.

If he gets stuck on 3rd line LW again I wonder if he's going to want to stick around or move on, I think he'd prefer to center his own line.

While he had his fair share of struggles last year, Copp has the track record of uniquely dominant 3rd liner. In the 3 years prior to last year, he pasted the "lesser competition" he faced to the tune of 100-66 (60.2% GF). His outscoring breakdown by level of competition was as follows:

Top comp (28.5% of his TOI): 32GF to 20GA
Middle comp (36.9% of his TOI): 33GF to 18GA
Bottom comp (34.6% of his TOI): 35GF to 28GA

Many teams deploy their bottom-6 forwards in the (often vain) hope that they can pull even- let alone outscore. Say whatever you will about the level of competition or his lack of abilities, but that's 32 goals that your top-6 doesn't have to make up for.

Even if he didn't do so last year, I wouldn't be as dismissive of his value to the team as some of what I'm reading here ("overrated 4th line plug", for example). He's earned a longer rope than one down year the results of which are mostly a by-product of being forced up the line-up (Copp and Lowry were still 11 to 9 when on-ice together).
- MaximumBone

Nice to have you post on a Jets blog MaximumBone. Could you please forward me the website you are using for QoC? I used to have a good one to go to and then a paywall went up.

Sorry that was a little harsh, Copp's a little better then 4th line plug, that corpse Maurice forces him to carry around definitely is though.

If he gets stuck on 3rd line LW again I wonder if he's going to want to stick around or move on, I think he'd prefer to center his own line.
- JetFuel

This I can get behind. I do think Copp has more to give, however based on the ‘corpse’ he’s dragging around, I am afraid he might have hit his ceiling as a Jet. I can see him wanting to move on after his current contract is done. I would not blame him either based on his poor usage.

Copp also generates a lot of scoring chances for his linemates. Otherwise known as being a good playmaker
- Rexypoo

His career high 19 assists agree with you! But then again I am sure I will hear about how points don’t matter.

Nice to have you post on a Jets blog MaximumBone. Could you please forward me the website you are using for QoC? I used to have a good one to go to and then a paywall went up.
- TheUltimateJet

Glad to engage in hockey talk and spread the good word about our messiah, Andrew Copp (praise be upon his name)

I use a site called Puck IQ (http://www.puckiq.com/). I don't know the precise methodology they use to define their categories, but I trust that the guys that came up with it (regulars I know from another hockey forum I frequent) know what they're doing enough for it to act as a solid proxy measurement.

Sorry that was a little harsh, Copp's a little better then 4th line plug, that corpse Maurice forces him to carry around definitely is though.

If he gets stuck on 3rd line LW again I wonder if he's going to want to stick around or move on, I think he'd prefer to center his own line.
- JetFuel

Agree JetFuel. The smart play for the Jets is to trade Lowry or let him walk as a ufa, to show Copp he will be given the 3c job. But i'm sure they won't do that and Copp will sign a 1 year deal and leave instead.

Both facts are true. It was Tkachuk's big contract that caused the Phoenix group to want to get rid of Selanne. Tkachuk being American is something that the Phoenix group was hoping to market when the team eventually got there.
- TheUltimateJet

It was a way for agents to drive up contract offers and the dumb-ass owners (at the time) went along with it. It does not mean that anyone wanted out from their teams at the time. Sort of like buying a house these days....

That’s not the part I’m rolling my eyes at
- Rexypoo

Must be rolling your eyes because I could not find any anal lytics to back up my post.

It was a way for agents to drive up contract offers and the dumb-ass owners (at the time) went along with it. It does not mean that anyone wanted out from their teams at the time. Sort of like buying a house these days....
- bennythehat

Another fact not discussed in the Selanne trade was that the previous two season he had missed significant time due to injuries. In 93-94, he tore his ACL and then in 94-95, he had a concussion based on the infamous Mike Peca hit. This could have also contributed to Phoenix not wanting him.

Another fact not discussed in the Selanne trade was that the previous two season he had missed significant time due to injuries. In 93-94, he tore his ACL and then in 94-95, he had a concussion based on the infamous Mike Peca hit. This could have also contributed to Phoenix not wanting him.
- TheUltimateJet

And he was older than Tkachuk.

And he was older than Tkachuk.
- bennythehat

100%

So the idea of the Jets trading Selanne being similar to the Laine situation is so off base. Both situations could not be more different.

Agree JetFuel. The smart play for the Jets is to trade Lowry or let him walk as a ufa, to show Copp he will be given the 3c job. But i'm sure they won't do that and Copp will sign a 1 year deal and leave instead.
- BWJumper

Harkins, Roslovic and Gustafson may all also be 3rd line Centers in the NHL.
Copp and Lowry both may not be long for Winnipeg? Contract demands and the three I mentioned continued development will play into these decisions.

Agree JetFuel. The smart play for the Jets is to trade Lowry or let him walk as a ufa, to show Copp he will be given the 3c job. But i'm sure they won't do that and Copp will sign a 1 year deal and leave instead.
- BWJumper

My bet is on Lowry extending for
$3-3.4M×4-6 years with the Jets,
I won't be surprised if it happens sometime
in this upcoming season.

I'm not sure about Copp and I'm guessing he'd prefer to explore his options but considering a flat cap if the Jets offered him something similar to what I'm thinking Lowry is going to sign for I could see Copp signing it just for the security.

Also think part of the reason for trading Laine is to open up cap space to sign Lowry, Copp and Pionk to their new deals.

My bet is on Lowry extending for
$3-3.4M×4-6 years with the Jets,
I won't be surprised if it happens sometime
in this upcoming season.

I'm not sure about Copp and I'm guessing he'd prefer to explore his options but considering a flat cap if the Jets offered him something similar to what I'm thinking Lowry is going to sign for I could see Copp signing it just for the security.

Also think part of the reason for trading Laine is to open up cap space to sign Lowry, Copp and Pionk to their new deals.
- JetFuel

Jets have 10.5 million in cap space with Stastny and Perreault contracts up. Though unlike most posters here I doubt the Jets are going to slot in Perfetti as a 2c next year and will re-sign Stastny for 2 years which will lower the cap space.

Must be rolling your eyes because I could not find any anal lytics to back up my post.
- bennythehat

I’m rolling my eyes at the Jack and sh*t you have to back up your post

Jets have 10.5 million in cap space with Stastny and Perreault contracts up. Though unlike most posters here I doubt the Jets are going to slot in Perfetti as a 2c next year and will re-sign Stastny for 2 years which will lower the cap space.
- BWJumper

There’s no way in hell Lowry ends up in the 3 range. If he re-signs, which I doubt, he’ll likely be at or under 2.

Stastny is not a player you re-sign. He has his role, he will fill it for a year, and then Perfetti takes over.

I can totally see Copp leaving, if he doesn’t get an opportunity in the top 6 soon.

There’s no way in hell Lowry ends up in the 3 range. If he re-signs, which I doubt, he’ll likely be at or under 2.

Stastny is not a player you re-sign. He has his role, he will fill it for a year, and then Perfetti takes over.

I can totally see Copp leaving, if he doesn’t get an opportunity in the top 6 soon.
- Rexypoo

If Tanev is averaging 3, you better believe that Lowry is getting that too.

If Tanev is averaging 3, you better believe that Lowry is getting that too.
- TheUltimateJet

Tanev though was very lucky to sign that prior to Covid and the flat cap that will not being going up any time soon.

There’s no way in hell Lowry ends up in the 3 range. If he re-signs, which I doubt, he’ll likely be at or under 2.

Stastny is not a player you re-sign. He has his role, he will fill it for a year, and then Perfetti takes over.

I can totally see Copp leaving, if he doesn’t get an opportunity in the top 6 soon.
- Rexypoo

So what's plan B if Perfetti shows he can't compete at center at the NHL level. Move Wheeler to C again.
The Jets should be able to get Stastny signed for under 4 a year. Give Perfetti a fair shot at 2c* and if he performs well then great you have Stastny playing 3c. If not you at least have a back-up plan.

*Yes I know Maurice will never give him a shot if he has a veteran at his disposal, I can dream though

I’m rolling my eyes at the Jack and sh*t you have to back up your post
- Rexypoo

The post did not require any backup, so you can roll your eyes up your Patrik Elias.

So what's plan B if Perfetti shows he can't compete at center at the NHL level. Move Wheeler to C again.
The Jets should be able to get Stastny signed for under 4 a year. Give Perfetti a fair shot at 2c* and if he performs well then great you have Stastny playing 3c. If not you at least have a back-up plan.

*Yes I know Maurice will never give him a shot if he has a veteran at his disposal, I can dream though
- BWJumper

What they SHOULD be doing is developing Roslovic at center on the 3rd line and it should be centering the 2015 line and before any fancy statters tell me Roslovic has been bad at center don't bother cause he had two stints at center last season and he was doing pretty damn good but of course Maurice just couldn't leave it alone and just go with it!

If they did that and it worked out it'd give them another center option that doesn't require moving 34 year old Wheeler to the middle if Perfetti isnt ready, Stastny moves or an injury happens.

The best and most obvious plan B is developing the centers you draft by actually playing them at center.