You keep trying to put words in my mouth. I never said I don't like him. Top 3 sniper in the league, horrible defensively. There is certainly good and bad both in the mix. I love his trade value! But I fear his contract. So to me, a trade is the best option unless he somehow becomes a 200' king in this league. So rather than saying I don't like him, tell me what his next contract should be?

And no, I haven't noticed any decline in Schiefele's game over the years. He has simply been the jets best forward for some time now, and on an unreal contract too boot. So you tell me what you'd be prepared to offer Laine if you were the gm, and I'll tell you if I love or hate Laine after that. But the projections of his upcoming contract would have me running for the hills.
- bikeguy99

people don't understand that you can be critical of a player without hating them. I don't believe Rexy hates Connor even though he loves to rip Connor's D when anyone mentions a negative about Laine.
your main point is absolutely true!!! its Laine's contract demands that are most worrisome. if he wanted to be paid long term like Ehlers and Connor are great, but he does not, he wants 3-4 million more than them per year and that is an issue!!!!

You've made your dislike for Laine pretty clear and again went on with this horrible defensively nonsense so you're making your feelings well known, I've got nothing to do with it.
His trade value probably isn't as high as we (meaning Jets fans) think it is and it'll be very difficult to replace what Laine brings to the Jets so if it was up to me I'd be pushing hard to get him signed long term, something in the $8-9M range over 7 or 8 years I'd do in a heartbeat without question, would maybe go a tad more then $9M but would definitely be wanting a max term for that much AAV. I believe in the kid though, you clearly don't.

Well if you haven't noticed the dropoff in Scheifele's play you must be watching a different team or something cause his lack of effort, giving up on plays and getting out muscled and out hustled by smaller players happened a fair bit last season. I don't dislike Schiefele and know he's the Jets best player or close to it and yes I realize his contract is good value but there's clearly something up with him, the effort just isn't there some games.
- JetFuel

I think Laine's ask in contract demands is more than that, especially talking max term. he will want it to start at 10 IMO. if that is the case, which I have no concrete evidence of then are you in agreement a move is needed?

Benny's Christmas Wish List:

1) One of the other teams takes Perreault off of our hands.
2) Wheeler and Schiefele come back rejuvenated from the break.
3) Laine stops complaining about his usage and his linemates and just becomes the best player that he can be.
4) Stastny is the same player that he was 2-3 years ago.
5) Do something with Niku. Play him or move him.
6) Don't rush Perfetti.
7) Sign Roslovic. He is not Top 6, but a valuable depth forward.
8) Progress from the youngsters and Chevy's promise to stop acquiring veteran fringe players.
9) More goals from Ehlers
10)Another Vezina like season from Helly.
Happy Holidays to all and let's hope for hockey in early 2021 !

Benny's Christmas Wish List:

1) One of the other teams takes Perreault off of our hands.
2) Wheeler and Schiefele come back rejuvenated from the break.
3) Laine stops complaining about his usage and his linemates and just becomes the best player that he can be.
4) Stastny is the same player that he was 2-3 years ago.
5) Do something with Niku. Play him or move him.
6) Don't rush Perfetti.
7) Sign Roslovic. He is not Top 6, but a valuable depth forward.
8) Progress from the youngsters and Chevy's promise to stop acquiring veteran fringe players.
9) More goals from Ehlers
10)Another Vezina like season from Helly.
Happy Holidays to all and let's hope for hockey in early 2021 !
- bennythehat

All good points, although I disagree with #7 - I think Rooslovic can be top six player.

But the best point is your last point - let's hope for some hockey early in 2021 - and preferably in Winnipeg!

people don't understand that you can be critical of a player without hating them. I don't believe Rexy hates Connor even though he loves to rip Connor's D when anyone mentions a negative about Laine.
your main point is absolutely true!!! its Laine's contract demands that are most worrisome. if he wanted to be paid long term like Ehlers and Connor are great, but he does not, he wants 3-4 million more than them per year and that is an issue!!!!
- Ross77

I agree with this.

Also I don't understand the argument about Scheifele being bad to justify Laine being bad. Or the argument that other players are bad so it's okay for Laine to be bad. All that is being said is that Laine is bad. Outside of his amazing shot, I have not seen the player that was promised to us at the draft.

Things I would love to see from Laine are:
1. Consistency (if it were not for that one hot streak in 2017-18, he would have been a 30 goal man)
2. Hunger for the puck (Tired of seeing him as a passenger on his lines as the advanced stats indicate)
3. Drive to the net (Rarely see him do this)
4. Shot volume (based on his career shooting percentage and shots, he's safely slated to be a 30 goal man and nothing more)
5. Elevate his line mates (based on advanced stats and the eye test, he drags them down)

I keep waiting for this 50/50 player or at least 40/40 to show up, however based on what I have seen so far, I will be waiting for a long time.

I agree with this.

Also I don't understand the argument about Scheifele being bad to justify Laine being bad. Or the argument that other players are bad so it's okay for Laine to be bad. All that is being said is that Laine is bad. Outside of his amazing shot, I have not seen the player that was promised to us at the draft.

Things I would love to see from Laine are:
1. Consistency (if it were not for that one hot streak in 2017-18, he would have been a 30 goal man)
2. Hunger for the puck (Tired of seeing him as a passenger on his lines as the advanced stats indicate)
3. Drive to the net (Rarely see him do this)
4. Shot volume (based on his career shooting percentage and shots, he's safely slated to be a 30 goal man and nothing more)
5. Elevate his line mates (based on advanced stats and the eye test, he drags them down)

I keep waiting for this 50/50 player or at least 40/40 to show up, however based on what I have seen so far, I will be waiting for a long time.
- TheUltimateJet

i'm not sure I follow your train of thought about what was promised at the draft? I only recall talk of his shot and goal scoring, nothing else.

for what its worth and not to redirect shade, I actually though Laine absolutely improved his overall work ethic last year. not to point fingers but the player who refuses to back check and was consistently the last man back in our zone was 55. I hope 55 works to improve this next year.

but he does have to shoot more and drive the net harder. I also expect more strength and use of that next year.


edit. I found this prior to Laine being drafted.

Talent Analysis

Laine is an imposing forward with a lethal right-hand shot that he likes to use on the off-wing, especially on the power play. A dominant offensive player in junior hockey, he has worked to become more aware of his defensive responsibilities. Like fellow countrymen Jesse Puljujarvi he played in Liiga as 17-year-old. More of a sniper than a playmaker, Laine nonetheless has stick handling and passing skills that are extremely advanced for a player his age. His offensive decision making, particularly when to hold the puck, when to shoot, and when to make a play and what type of pass to use, separate him from other young prospects.

All good points, although I disagree with #7 - I think Rooslovic can be top six player.

But the best point is your last point - let's hope for some hockey early in 2021 - and preferably in Winnipeg!
- grahamzky

[img]

To clarify # 7 - he won't be top 6 on this team, with the current lineup (Schiefele/Wheeler/Connor/Stastny/Laine/Ehlers)[/img]

Benny's Christmas Wish List:

1) One of the other teams takes Perreault off of our hands.
2) Wheeler and Schiefele come back rejuvenated from the break.
3) Laine stops complaining about his usage and his linemates and just becomes the best player that he can be.
4) Stastny is the same player that he was 2-3 years ago.
5) Do something with Niku. Play him or move him.
6) Don't rush Perfetti.
7) Sign Roslovic. He is not Top 6, but a valuable depth forward.
8) Progress from the youngsters and Chevy's promise to stop acquiring veteran fringe players.
9) More goals from Ehlers
10)Another Vezina like season from Helly.
Happy Holidays to all and let's hope for hockey in early 2021 !
- bennythehat

You have my sword!

Benny's Christmas Wish List:

1) One of the other teams takes Perreault off of our hands.
2) Wheeler and Schiefele come back rejuvenated from the break.
3) Laine stops complaining about his usage and his linemates and just becomes the best player that he can be.
4) Stastny is the same player that he was 2-3 years ago.
5) Do something with Niku. Play him or move him.
6) Don't rush Perfetti.
7) Sign Roslovic. He is not Top 6, but a valuable depth forward.
8) Progress from the youngsters and Chevy's promise to stop acquiring veteran fringe players.
9) More goals from Ehlers
10)Another Vezina like season from Helly.
Happy Holidays to all and let's hope for hockey in early 2021 !
- bennythehat

This list is like kids circling everything in the toy book. You are way too greedy.

I'm asking for one thing, a new coach for the 2021-22 season.

[img]

To clarify # 7 - he won't be top 6 on this team, with the current lineup (Schiefele/Wheeler/Connor/Stastny/Laine/Ehlers)
- bennythehat[/img]

Yea agreed, but if one goes, I think he has top six ability. Potential! If opportunity knocks, look out! 25 goal scorer if he gets the chance, maybe more.

And I'm not his agent.

Yea agreed, but if one goes, I think he has top six ability. Potential! If opportunity knocks, look out! 25 goal scorer if he gets the chance, maybe more.

And I'm not his agent.
- grahamzky

He’ll never be a sniper, he just doesn’t have that kind of shot, but he’s already a high end 3rd liner.
He defends well, he drives possession, and he’s fast and shifty. Could be a very good second line winger if he’s with, say, Copp and Connor

i'm not sure I follow your train of thought about what was promised at the draft? I only recall talk of his shot and goal scoring, nothing else.

for what its worth and not to redirect shade, I actually though Laine absolutely improved his overall work ethic last year. not to point fingers but the player who refuses to back check and was consistently the last man back in our zone was 55. I hope 55 works to improve this next year.

but he does have to shoot more and drive the net harder. I also expect more strength and use of that next year.


edit. I found this prior to Laine being drafted.

Talent Analysis

Laine is an imposing forward with a lethal right-hand shot that he likes to use on the off-wing, especially on the power play. A dominant offensive player in junior hockey, he has worked to become more aware of his defensive responsibilities. Like fellow countrymen Jesse Puljujarvi he played in Liiga as 17-year-old. More of a sniper than a playmaker, Laine nonetheless has stick handling and passing skills that are extremely advanced for a player his age. His offensive decision making, particularly when to hold the puck, when to shoot, and when to make a play and what type of pass to use, separate him from other young prospects.
- Ross77

I specifically remember at the 2016 draft that one of the analysts spoke of how hard Laine was to shake off of the puck and that with his imposing size that he is amazing at puck protection.

This amazing puck protection and him knowing how to use his body is something that I have not yet witnessed. The advanced stats agree with my eye test.

i'm not sure I follow your train of thought about what was promised at the draft? I only recall talk of his shot and goal scoring, nothing else.

for what its worth and not to redirect shade, I actually though Laine absolutely improved his overall work ethic last year. not to point fingers but the player who refuses to back check and was consistently the last man back in our zone was 55. I hope 55 works to improve this next year.

but he does have to shoot more and drive the net harder. I also expect more strength and use of that next year.


edit. I found this prior to Laine being drafted.

Talent Analysis

Laine is an imposing forward with a lethal right-hand shot that he likes to use on the off-wing, especially on the power play. A dominant offensive player in junior hockey, he has worked to become more aware of his defensive responsibilities. Like fellow countrymen Jesse Puljujarvi he played in Liiga as 17-year-old. More of a sniper than a playmaker, Laine nonetheless has stick handling and passing skills that are extremely advanced for a player his age. His offensive decision making, particularly when to hold the puck, when to shoot, and when to make a play and what type of pass to use, separate him from other young prospects.
- Ross77

I agree with pretty much all of this, one thing though is Laine is a selective shooter and that's exactly what you should want him to be, no point in taking low percentage shots that are never going to go in.

Also that talent analysis was spot on about Laine, his passing is especially underrated.

Arvid Holm has performed very well and is a decent prospect as well in the system
- Ross77

Is your name Ross Holm?... 😉😃

I agree with this.

Also I don't understand the argument about Scheifele being bad to justify Laine being bad. Or the argument that other players are bad so it's okay for Laine to be bad. All that is being said is that Laine is bad. Outside of his amazing shot, I have not seen the player that was promised to us at the draft.

Things I would love to see from Laine are:
1. Consistency (if it were not for that one hot streak in 2017-18, he would have been a 30 goal man)
2. Hunger for the puck (Tired of seeing him as a passenger on his lines as the advanced stats indicate)
3. Drive to the net (Rarely see him do this)
4. Shot volume (based on his career shooting percentage and shots, he's safely slated to be a 30 goal man and nothing more)
5. Elevate his line mates (based on advanced stats and the eye test, he drags them down)

I keep waiting for this 50/50 player or at least 40/40 to show up, however based on what I have seen so far, I will be waiting for a long time.
- TheUltimateJet

You clearly hate the kid.

I think Laine's ask in contract demands is more than that, especially talking max term. he will want it to start at 10 IMO. if that is the case, which I have no concrete evidence of then are you in agreement a move is needed?
- Ross77

Idk, depends on what kind of season he has, he's not worth $10M as of now but he is a star and stars want to get paid.
Also it really depends on the return, Sanheim, Farabee and a draft pick really bores me, think I'd rather have a slightly overpaid Laine then a bunch of meh pieces.
I'm a pretty firm believer in paying your high end talent over your bottom end plugs, if you've gotta overpay a top player by a million then find that savings somewhere else in the lineup.

I agree with pretty much all of this, one thing though is Laine is a selective shooter and that's exactly what you should want him to be, no point in taking low percentage shots that are never going to go in.

Also that talent analysis was spot on about Laine, his passing is especially underrated.
- JetFuel

Tell that to Ovechkin who takes over 300 shots a year! Shoots from everywhere. Low percentage shots also create rebounds, and could create opportunities for linemate a to bank them in or tip them.

You clearly hate the kid.
- JetFuel

Based on what? Outside of his shot, name me something that he does that is so invaluable for the team. Just one thing, does he use his size? Does he create havoc in the offensive zone? Do players have career seasons playing with him?

Normally players that are superstars on teams are never this polarizing.

Funny thing is that when I visited PuckIQ, I went there looking for Lowry's advanced stats to only discover that Laine's were worse. You can't bash Lowry and praise Laine. You can't be a fan of advanced analytics and support Laine.

Tell that to Ovechkin who takes over 300 shots a year! Shoots from everywhere. Low percentage shots also create rebounds, and could create opportunities for linemate a to bank them in or tip them.
- TheUltimateJet

Agree with UJ there. Laine can be a selective shooter if he's scoring on 18% of his shots, but for the past 2 years he's at 12%.

You clearly hate the kid.
- JetFuel

No kidding. A lot of his points are just not based in reality. Laine was leading the charge in both directions last season the entire time he was on the top line. Scheifele was the one lagging

Tell that to Ovechkin who takes over 300 shots a year! Shoots from everywhere. Low percentage shots also create rebounds, and could create opportunities for linemate a to bank them in or tip them.
- TheUltimateJet

Not everyone does this, and it isn’t as effective as you’d think. Ovechkin doesn’t generate a lot of rebounds.
It’s the ability to draw coverage to him that usually helps his linemates, not the results of his shooting practice.

Based on what? Outside of his shot, name me something that he does that is so invaluable for the team. Just one thing, does he use his size? Does he create havoc in the offensive zone? Do players have career seasons playing with him?

Normally players that are superstars on teams are never this polarizing.

Funny thing is that when I visited PuckIQ, I went there looking for Lowry's advanced stats to only discover that Laine's were worse. You can't bash Lowry and praise Laine. You can't be a fan of advanced analytics and support Laine.
- TheUltimateJet

Yes, yes, and nobody has career years with the Jets anywhere unless they are Jets lifers.

We also know that Laine has, thus far, sustainably outscored his possession issues. He is not the only player to do this, nor do we have any evidence to suggest he’s the main issue.

Based on what? Outside of his shot, name me something that he does that is so invaluable for the team. Just one thing, does he use his size? Does he create havoc in the offensive zone? Do players have career seasons playing with him?

Normally players that are superstars on teams are never this polarizing.

Funny thing is that when I visited PuckIQ, I went there looking for Lowry's advanced stats to only discover that Laine's were worse. You can't bash Lowry and praise Laine. You can't be a fan of advanced analytics and support Laine.
- TheUltimateJet

Based off of your comments, you have a hate on for Laine.

Yes Laine uses his size, he was a physical presence last season throwing his weight around and finishing his checks, he's not a full blown power forward as he shouldn't be cause that'd be a waste of his ability but he does use his size effectively.

Idk how you define havoc but just having him in the offensive zone creates havoc as teams know they can't just leave him uncovered which opens up space for Laine's linemates.

Scheifele and Connor were on pace for career years playing with Laine and Laine was on pace for a career season himself, that was before they were broken up when Eakin was acquired.

Buff was pretty polarizing, I'm sure there wouldn't be nearly as much discussion around Laine if he was Canadian.

Who gives a f*ck what PuckIQ says, analytics mean nothing to me. So PuckIQ says both Lowry and Laine have bad advanced analytic hockey stats while Laine was on pace for another 30 goal season and was just shy of being a point per game player while Lowry was on pace for less then 20 points so what does that say about the value of these analytics, they're not worth the data and electricity they're consuming imo.

Tell that to Ovechkin who takes over 300 shots a year! Shoots from everywhere. Low percentage shots also create rebounds, and could create opportunities for linemate a to bank them in or tip them.
- TheUltimateJet

Bobby Hull would sometimes fire away just for intimidation purposes.

Not everyone does this, and it isn’t as effective as you’d think. Ovechkin doesn’t generate a lot of rebounds.
It’s the ability to draw coverage to him that usually helps his linemates, not the results of his shooting practice.
- Rexypoo

No you don't generate many rebounds when the puck is in the cage.