There was a time when we believed on this board that Giroux was all but making the team right out of camp. Well this didn’t happen. Giroux has a bad camp. I know he had something to do with his teeth or whatever but we had a young rookie one year older by the name of Steve Downie. Love of hate Downie, he took advantage of an opportunity Giroux didn’t.

The point....there is zero reason Morgan Frost can’t prove he’s better than Joel Farabee right now and make Farabee sit taxi. Yes Farabee made the team last season but that’s last year and this is now. There is always space.
- SuperSchennBros

I have a feeling Farabee is going to have a good year. I think he has a better chance of trying to stick if/when JVR gets scratched or if there's an injury in the top 9.

I will agree with most of this, it’s certainly taking quite a long time for a “top prospect”, when is it going to happen for this kid. How many years in a row has it been, maybe Frost will make the lineup.
- ClaudeFather

It's not taking quite a long time. He has played 1 year of pro hockey which consisted of 61 games with 20 of those games played at the NHL level.

I compare Frost to players taken right before and all those after him. That is how I slot what kind of success he has had so far.

It is the only FAIR way to do so.

I have a feeling Farabee is going to have a good year. I think he has a better chance of trying to stick if/when JVR gets scratched or if there's an injury in the top 9.
- Ftown19125

I hope you’re right.

I compare Frost to players taken right before and all those after him. That is how I slot what kind of success he has had so far.

It is the only FAIR way to do so.
- MBFlyerfan

Again, I looked at drafts from 14 15 16 17 and 18. For the most part hes right on points with "most guys" in the 25-35 range. Hes 20th in games played for his entire draft class. However. Most players from 16 had their breakout in 20. 15 in 19. 14 in 18. For whatever reason outside the few studs year 4 after draft year seems to be the year they put it together. I become more concerned if he's not in the NHL by season end and going into next year. Especially if he gets passed by guys like lacynski allison sandin

Is that how it works? Appreciate the education. So normal training camp is what 6/7 weeks? Numerous games against other NHL teams. This roster was set from day 1 and there was nothing any player who wasn’t full time last year was going to do to unseat anyone in this format of training camp. Now I am sure you feel differently.

Also didn’t Giroux spend time in the AHL or is that a figment of my imagination?

You probably thought Laughton and NAK were bust. So since they are older when can we expect Allison and Tanner in the lineup?
- Striiker

This ridiculous post does nothing but put words in my mouth. Laughton did take along time to make it to the NHL but nobody expected to have drafted a fourth line center in the first round. As for Aube-Kubel, he wasn’t drafted high enough to expect big things from him, so I don’t even understand why you would use NAK as an example.

Training camps aren’t 7 weeks long.

This ridiculous post does nothing but put words in my mouth. Laughton did take along time to make it to the NHL but nobody expected to have drafted a fourth line center in the first round. As for Aube-Kubel, he wasn’t drafted high enough to expect big things from him, so I don’t even understand why you would use NAK as an example.

Training camps aren’t 7 weeks long.
- SuperSchennBros

NAK was drafted 48 overall. That is high.

So when will you consider the 2 college kids underwhelming? What is the time frame since they are older and all.

As mentioned above Frost has played 60 odd games; yet it is underwhelming.

How long are typical training camps?

Again, I looked at drafts from 14 15 16 17 and 18. For the most part hes right on points with "most guys" in the 25-35 range. Hes 20th in games played for his entire draft class. However. Most players from 16 had their breakout in 20. 15 in 19. 14 in 18. For whatever reason outside the few studs year 4 after draft year seems to be the year they put it together. I become more concerned if he's not in the NHL by season end and going into next year. Especially if he gets passed by guys like lacynski allison sandin
- Tfaehner

Both seem very injury prone.

I have a feeling Farabee is going to have a good year.
- Ftown19125

Me too (knocks on wood). He looked noticeably heavier on the puck than last year, especially along the boards. He still has his good read of plays.

Also, what about the revamped pp look for Team Orange? With Giroux, Couts, Provorov in it, I suspect what we saw yesterday means the structure of the pp is revised.

I saw much more player movement and interchanging of positions. And I think I saw 2 men up high, not just Provy. They played a good 90 seconds before a clear by Team White let the second unit on the ice and it looked different but I had only half an eye on it and cannot be sure.

Taxi squad doesn't travel. So no. I doubt it. I expect bunny to make the 13th spot.
- Tfaehner

About this...I have read a few sources that say the taxi squad will travel with the team. Obviously, the third goalie will because the league is requiring it. Is it optional?

Bill, do you know what the Flyers will be doing?

NAK was drafted 48 overall. That is high.

So when will you consider the 2 college kids underwhelming? What is the time frame since they are older and all.

As mentioned above Frost has played 60 odd games; yet it is underwhelming.

How long are typical training camps?
- Striiker

What two college kids?

Why are you so weirdly upset that I would call Morgan Frost underwhelming? He is underwhelming, to me. Joel Farabee who was drafted a year after Morgan Frost has taken the ball and ran with it. Frost has been given an opportunity in the NHL and has yet to workout.

7 weeks is just under 2 months. I’m not gonna give you an exact time table because players return to town and practice on their own at different times but 7 weeks is a pretty long time for training camp.

Interesting tidbit from that 2017 draft class. Despite missing an entire season plus, Patrick is still 5th in points and 3rd in games played among that draft class.
- MBFlyerfan

This is great work.

Both seem very injury prone.
- Striiker

Allison yes. Tanner had surgery, so no for him

This is great work.
- Peter Richards

Indeed.

So I guess next year we get to find out if O’Brien is a bust.

Should’ve drafted Lind. Wait what.

This is great work.
- Peter Richards

Patrick is 4th in games. But close enough. Very underwhelming draft class outside the top 5. The 16 draft already has 12 guys with 200 games.

Patrick is 4th in games. But close enough. Very underwhelming draft class outside the top 5. The 16 draft already has 12 guys with 200 games.
- Tfaehner

https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2017e.html

This says 3rd. But whatever.

And if Patrick plays the whole season he will be right there at 200 games. So that is something to look forward to.

Patrick is 4th in games. But close enough. Very underwhelming draft class outside the top 5. The 16 draft already has 12 guys with 200 games.
- Tfaehner

Don’t use this word to describe this class...even though I’m remember this being considered a ween draft.

What two college kids?

Why are you so weirdly upset that I would call Morgan Frost underwhelming? He is underwhelming, to me. Joel Farabee who was drafted a year after Morgan Frost has taken the ball and ran with it. Frost has been given an opportunity in the NHL and has yet to workout.

7 weeks is just under 2 months. I’m not gonna give you an exact time table because players return to town and practice on their own at different times but 7 weeks is a pretty long time for training camp.
- SuperSchennBros

I will say he showed glimpses of what the hype is about. His hands are legit. When you look at our forward lineup, really right now there is no rush. Coots, patty and Joel jumped on due to their defensive game being advanced for being 18-19 yrs old. And look at coots now. Best in the league. Frost dominated for years. I have no problem with him seasoning a bit. We have the depth. My guess is if he were on a bottom team he would be starting.

I will say he showed glimpses of what the hype is about. His hands are legit. When you look at our forward lineup, really right now there is no rush. Coots, patty and Joel jumped on due to their defensive game being advanced for being 18-19 yrs old. And look at coots now. Best in the league. Frost dominated for years. I have no problem with him seasoning a bit. We have the depth. My guess is if he were on a bottom team he would be starting.
- Peter Richards

Farabee isn’t an advanced defensive forward in anyway. I think Farabee made the team because we were thin up front last season. In fact there were stretches where he looked really good and others when he didn’t look ready.

wow https://theathletic.com/2...-evander-kane-bankruptcy/

wow https://theathletic.com/2...-evander-kane-bankruptcy/
- 2Real

This kind of thing always amazes me.

I am no pro scout but I think Frost will be just fine. He is still young and needs to get stronger and learn a little bit more about positional play without the puck.
Those of you saying well look at Farabee and how quickly he made it to the NHL... first of you look at their points per game averages:
GM. Pts. PPG. P/60 Corsi
Farabee 52. 21. .40. 1.75. 48.9
Frost. 20. 7. .35. 1.65. 51.5

Is that substantially different? No but...
I could argue that Frost is actually the better player. First, playing center in the NHL is probably the second hardest position to learn aside from goalie with wing being the easiest. Second, they want Frost at center not at wing. They expect he will be a bonafide top 2 line center when ready and they have even said as much. When Frost did come up for his first game they played him with Giroux and Konecny., not third line wing. (Farabee started playing with Couturier and Lindblom).

Frost got most of those games very early in the season and he was still trying to figure things out playing center in the NHL. Creating scoring opportunities was never the issue. If you go and look at all his possession metrics they were fantastic, his scoring metrics were very good, his defensive metrics... not so much. Most of his shifts started in the offensive zone but many ended in the defensive zone. His face off % was also not great (47%). These are things Farabee never had to learn.
So, I would say the expectations for Frost are higher but I think when the light bulb turns on so will the rewards.
The greatest prediction of future performance is past performance... Frost played very well with the Greyhounds, then made team Canada (playing wing and put up 8 points in 5 games), then went to the Phantom s and led them in points making the All-star team, then made it to the Flyers and scored 3 points in his first 2 games...
My guess is that Frost is ready now... but he will only play if he gets to replace someone on the top 2 lines or 3rd line center is open (if center 1 or 2 misses time I could see them promoting NP to give him a chance before giving Frost that huge responsibility as a youngster.

If you think Frost should play 4th line or 3rd line wing then I think you are mis-using his talent. So playing top line minutes in LHV for half a season (till the trade deadline?) might be best for his development to play heavy minutes in all game situations. By the trade deadline does not mean I would trade him, in fact I wouldn’t. But if other more expensive trade options were to be dealt for a defenseman or draft picks that could open the perfect opportunity to add Frost permanently to the team for the next 10 years?

Just 1 guys opinion...

wow https://theathletic.com/2...-evander-kane-bankruptcy/
- 2Real

Why am I not surprised, this guy is a POS. Watch the video of him explaining his tracksuit incident with Winnipeg or Buffalo, just such a blatant lie and he sounds like an idiot.

I am no pro scout but I think Frost will be just fine. He is still young and needs to get stronger and learn a little bit more about positional play without the puck.
Those of you saying well look at Farabee and how quickly he made it to the NHL... first of you look at their points per game averages:
GM. Pts. PPG. P/60 Corsi
Farabee 52. 21. .40. 1.75. 48.9
Frost. 20. 7. .35. 1.65. 51.5

Is that substantially different? No but...
I could argue that Frost is actually the better player. First, playing center in the NHL is probably the second hardest position to learn aside from goalie with wing being the easiest. Second, they want Frost at center not at wing. They expect he will be a bonafide top 2 line center when ready and they have even said as much. When Frost did come up for his first game they played him with Giroux and Konecny., not third line wing. (Farabee started playing with Couturier and Lindblom).

Frost got most of those games very early in the season and he was still trying to figure things out playing center in the NHL. Creating scoring opportunities was never the issue. If you go and look at all his possession metrics they were fantastic, his scoring metrics were very good, his defensive metrics... not so much. Most of his shifts started in the offensive zone but many ended in the defensive zone. His face off % was also not great (47%). These are things Farabee never had to learn.
So, I would say the expectations for Frost are higher but I think when the light bulb turns on so will the rewards.
The greatest prediction of future performance is past performance... Frost played very well with the Greyhounds, then made team Canada (playing wing and put up 8 points in 5 games), then went to the Phantom s and led them in points making the All-star team, then made it to the Flyers and scored 3 points in his first 2 games...
My guess is that Frost is ready now... but he will only play if he gets to replace someone on the top 2 lines or 3rd line center is open (if center 1 or 2 misses time I could see them promoting NP to give him a chance before giving Frost that huge responsibility as a youngster.

If you think Frost should play 4th line or 3rd line wing then I think you are mis-using his talent. So playing top line minutes in LHV for half a season (till the trade deadline?) might be best for his development to play heavy minutes in all game situations. By the trade deadline does not mean I would trade him, in fact I wouldn’t. But if other more expensive trade options were to be dealt for a defenseman or draft picks that could open the perfect opportunity to add Frost permanently to the team for the next 10 years?

Just 1 guys opinion...
- Tommycasino

It's really a numbers situation right now with Frost. Here is how I view it. What does the coach want. Most coaches want some veteran presence in the lineup for situational play. You need competent forwards for the PK. I'd like to see Laughton moved to wing and Frost start the season centering the 4th line. I readily acknowledge that changes the makeup of the 4th line and possibly removes a PK forward. What kind of 4th line do you want?