You really need to start doing some basic fact checking. The AHL season will start in a week, and training camp is already underway. Did you really think that guys like Brown, Formenton, Abramov, Brannstrom, and Thomson wouldn't be playing the entire season? Those players are important to the team too, and they're also substantially older than 18. It's called player development, and it's important to do correctly even for players who might have exceptional levels of skill. Spezza needed time in the AHL, Hossa needed another year of junior after being drafted... it's not an insult, and it's not because those players couldn't have played at a mediocre level in the NHL the season after they were drafted. It's because you want those players to eventually become the best players on the team, which isn't necessarily going to happen by having to fight for ice time as an 18yo on a struggling team in a pandemic-shortened season without a standard NHL training camp/pre-season.
- khawk

The start date for the AHL has been pushed back multiple times, and it’s naive to think that it won’t happen again. The league doesn’t have near the money that the NHL does, meaning it will be much more difficult to maintain the COVID measures required to play.

Much better to have Stutzle in the NHL where his development is more controlled and consistent.

I always like to use Hoffman and Stone as examples that it sometimes takes awhile to get a regular place on the team. If the beginning of the season is any indicator, Paul is another example. He reminds me of a hockey-sized Pageau.
- PogBoi

I used the example of Paul as being a player that took time to get established. People didn't like it.

Sens fans want their prospects in now and all of the time. Will be funny when prospects do get a chance and not everyone pans out and the same fans accuses the team of rushing certain prospects.

The start date for the AHL has been pushed back multiple times, and it’s naive to think that it won’t happen again. The league doesn’t have near the money that the NHL does, meaning it will be much more difficult to maintain the COVID measures required to play.

Much better to have Stutzle in the NHL where his development is more controlled and consistent.
- sensarmy_11

Stutzle have a close in is contract, if not ready he goes back to Mannheim. But I m not sure if the Del have already started

I used the example of Paul as being a player that took time to get established. People didn't like it.

Sens fans want their prospects in now and all of the time. Will be funny when prospects do get a chance and not everyone pans out and the same fans accuses the team of rushing certain prospects.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

the question is what do you want your prospects to be.

yes, nick paul took a long time to develop into an NHLer, but he was drafted as a goal scorer, wasn't able to be that in the NHL (or AHL for that matter) so he changed his game to become a good 2-way guy.

if that's what you want someone like Logan Brown to be, then by all means leave him in the AHL......but if you want him to be a point producing top line, or even top six center, then he has nothing left to learn in the AHL.

and to the point you quoted, mark stone played 2 half seasons in teh AHL (about 80 games) and was a stud in his first full NHL season. he didn't take time to develop, he just ended up being significantly better than expected, pretty much right away

there are very few examples of guys who spent 3-4 years in the AHL (this will be Brown's 3rd) and who ended up being legit point producing top six forwards. if you want Logan Brown, or Tim Stutzle, to be those guys....they need games in the NHL, at that speed, with quality teammates,

The start date for the AHL has been pushed back multiple times, and it’s naive to think that it won’t happen again. The league doesn’t have near the money that the NHL does, meaning it will be much more difficult to maintain the COVID measures required to play.
Much better to have Stutzle in the NHL where his development is more controlled and consistent.
- sensarmy_11

Okay, but "there is no AHL" is still wrong. For most AHL teams, the season is scheduled to start on-time next week - and there's no reason to think the All-Canadian division won't also be playing games soon, once COVID restrictions ease a bit out East. If they really never do play any AHL games, then sure you keep him with the NHL roster. But suggesting that Stutzle "has" to be developed only at the NHL level is just not true. All of Karlsson, Hossa, Spezza, Chabot, and Stone had at least a full year of non-NHL development after they were drafted, and we don't even know yet if Stutzle will be that level of player. So you really need to give up this false narrative that rushing an 18yo prospect into the NHL is the only way to develop an elite talent.

the question is what do you want your prospects to be.

yes, nick paul took a long time to develop into an NHLer, but he was drafted as a goal scorer, wasn't able to be that in the NHL (or AHL for that matter) so he changed his game to become a good 2-way guy.

if that's what you want someone like Logan Brown to be, then by all means leave him in the AHL......but if you want him to be a point producing top line, or even top six center, then he has nothing left to learn in the AHL.

and to the point you quoted, mark stone played 2 half seasons in teh AHL (about 80 games) and was a stud in his first full NHL season. he didn't take time to develop, he just ended up being significantly better than expected, pretty much right away

there are very few examples of guys who spent 3-4 years in the AHL (this will be Brown's 3rd) and who ended up being legit point producing top six forwards. if you want Logan Brown, or Tim Stutzle, to be those guys....they need games in the NHL, at that speed, with quality teammates,
- sensarmy_11

I mean, I’ve said it before, you rarely see a guy at 22 or 23 years of age crack into the NHL and turn into cornerstone player. I think everyone who is annoyed with the young player development so far thinks these players ceilings are higher than they actually are. Guys like Brown and Chlapik are already in that make it or break it territory. New prospects come and pass over other prospects. Happens all the time in rebuilds. We’ve seen it already with Norris, Tkachuk, Batherson, and Stuzle getting into the lineup before slightly older prospects.

Would I like to see younger players in the lineup over aging vets? 100%. They are more pleasurable to watch because we have more attachment since we have been talking about the likes of L. Brown for 4 years. However, I am not sold these players should be put into the lineup just because it is their perceived time without any real merit in doing so. I want a player to prove they deserve a spot. Especially in a rebuild. Vets will get the benefit of the doubt early but the leash will tighten if they don’t produce.

I do think we will see some of these players crack the lineup around the 30-game mark. I hope guys like L. Brown, Chlapik, and Brannstrom prove they should have been in the lineup all along. There is nothing holding them back to prove this. If sitting an extra few week and getting some reps in the AHL stunts their development, there are larger issues at play.

Okay, but "there is no AHL" is still wrong. For most AHL teams, the season is scheduled to start on-time next week - and there's no reason to think the All-Canadian division won't also be playing games soon, once COVID restrictions ease a bit out East. If they really never do play any AHL games, then sure you keep him with the NHL roster. But suggesting that Stutzle "has" to be developed only at the NHL level is just not true. All of Karlsson, Hossa, Spezza, Chabot, and Stone had at least a full year of non-NHL development after they were drafted, and we don't even know yet if Stutzle will be that level of player. So you really need to give up this false narrative that rushing an 18yo prospect into the NHL is the only way to develop an elite talent.
- khawk

there hasn't been, and until they drop the puck, there isn't. i was reading that the belleville guys are skating, but they don't even have enough players to scrimmage right now. guys like Logan Brown and Formenton haven't played a game in a year.

as to your list of players who had "a full year of non-nhl development".......sure, when leagues were running normally, and they could play full seasons in those leagues...........the ONLY league that seems to be running normally right now is the NHL. there is no jr hockey as of right now, AHL hasn't started, and the euro leagues keep shutting down leagues or individual teams, and with the way outbreaks are occuring in Europe it's only a matter of time before all those leagues shut down too.

in a "normal year" sure, put him in the AHL for 70 games or in Germany for the same......but right now, THIS YEAR, the only league where he's assured (as much as anything can be assured) to play regular games is in the NHL.

I mean, I’ve said it before, you rarely see a guy at 22 or 23 years of age crack into the NHL and turn into cornerstone player. I think everyone who is annoyed with the young player development so far thinks these players ceilings are higher than they actually are. Guys like Brown and Chlapik are already in that make it or break it territory. New prospects come and pass over other prospects. Happens all the time in rebuilds. We’ve seen it already with Norris, Tkachuk, Batherson, and Stuzle getting into the lineup before slightly older prospects.

Would I like to see younger players in the lineup over aging vets? 100%. They are more pleasurable to watch because we have more attachment since we have been talking about the likes of L. Brown for 4 years. However, I am not sold these players should be put into the lineup just because it is their perceived time without any real merit in doing so. I want a player to prove they deserve a spot. Especially in a rebuild. Vets will get the benefit of the doubt early but the leash will tighten if they don’t produce.

I do think we will see some of these players crack the lineup around the 30-game mark. I hope guys like L. Brown, Chlapik, and Brannstrom prove they should have been in the lineup all along. There is nothing holding them back to prove this. If sitting an extra few week and getting some reps in the AHL stunts their development, there are larger issues at play.
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

i'm not saying put them in despite having no merit, i'm suggesting that there is NO WAY IN HELL that a player like anisimov/paquette/haley/watson/etc/etc/etc deserve it more.

You aren't handing Brown a guaranteed roster spot, you're allowing him to start in the NHL over mulitple players who aren't good and aren't part of the future, to see if he actually belongs. after 10-15 games, in a season that is meaningless anyways, if he still sucks then send him down and let him ride it out......but at least give him a chance. how is this team better off with anisimov in the NHL lineup and Brown in the AHL. Not saying Brown would be better, but i can guarantee you it's almost impossible for him to be worse

i'm not saying put them in despite having no merit, i'm suggesting that there is NO WAY IN HELL that a player like anisimov/paquette/haley/watson/etc/etc/etc deserve it more.

You aren't handing Brown a guaranteed roster spot, you're allowing him to start in the NHL over mulitple players who aren't good and aren't part of the future, to see if he actually belongs. after 10-15 games, in a season that is meaningless anyways, if he still sucks then send him down and let him ride it out......but at least give him a chance. how is this team better off with anisimov in the NHL lineup and Brown in the AHL. Not saying Brown would be better, but i can guarantee you it's almost impossible for him to be worse
- sensarmy_11

In theory, I agree. I scratch those guys for youngsters all the time in my NHL 21 franchise on PlayStation. In actuality there are contract issues, waiver issues, and a garbage owner issues. These contribute to frustrating roster moves.

I think everyone agrees too many veterans were brought in, but it what it is.

Serious question: What happens if these young players were in the lineup and the results are the exact same. Is this a good thing or bad thing?

In theory, I agree. I scratch those guys for youngsters all the time in my NHL 21 franchise on PlayStation. In actuality there are contract issues, waiver issues, and a garbage owner issues. These contribute to frustrating roster moves.

I think everyone agrees too many veterans were brought in, but it what it is.

Serious question: What happens if these young players were in the lineup and the results are the exact same. Is this a good thing or bad thing?
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

my opinion, it's a good thing. they're getting NHL reps, in a pressure free environment. i don't give a poop about the losses this year, i just want to see the young kids develop so this team can start taking steps in the right direction

i think the fan base is okay with losing, as long as the team has a clear direction and the young kids are developing properly. A guy like Brown has already learned and developed all he can in the AHL, time to see what they have with him at the NHL level. it would be different if this team was in a win now mode, and were contending for a playoff spot...........where a rookie playing badly could cost you games.........but it's a meaningless season, relatively speaking, so why not see what you have with these guys

i'm not saying put them in despite having no merit, i'm suggesting that there is NO WAY IN HELL that a player like anisimov/paquette/haley/watson/etc/etc/etc deserve it more.

You aren't handing Brown a guaranteed roster spot, you're allowing him to start in the NHL over mulitple players who aren't good and aren't part of the future, to see if he actually belongs. after 10-15 games, in a season that is meaningless anyways, if he still sucks then send him down and let him ride it out......but at least give him a chance. how is this team better off with anisimov in the NHL lineup and Brown in the AHL. Not saying Brown would be better, but i can guarantee you it's almost impossible for him to be worse
- sensarmy_11

I think it really says something that Norris is in Ottawa right now and Brown isn't.

I'd also prefer to see Brown here than in Belleville, but the team clearly wants something more in his game.

Jaros Traded

Jaros Traded
- david22

Inevitable, would have been nearly impossible for him to crack the top six D here moving forward.

Chabot, brannstrom, JBD, Sanderson, wolanin, zaitsev, Thomson, tychonik, klevin, zub........I don’t see where he would fit

Serious question: What happens if these young players were in the lineup and the results are the exact same. Is this a good thing or bad thing?
- Gord_Wilson_2.0

See, I would generally consider that a very bad thing. Having your high-potential young players fail persistently is really not a recipe for success. And if some of these players are struggling with fundamentals like defensive awareness and game-to-game consistency (i.e. Brown), then you're really just throwing them to the wolves. Even for higher-end talent, I don't see much value in having an 18yo Stutzle grind out a bottom-dweller season to prove that he's marginally better than a random UFA-age veteran they brought in as affordable depth. Especially when the goal is for Stutzle to become the team's dynamic offensive centerpiece.

See, I would generally consider that a very bad thing. Having your high-potential young players fail persistently is really not a recipe for success. And if some of these players are struggling with fundamentals like defensive awareness and game-to-game consistency (i.e. Brown), then you're really just throwing them to the wolves. Even for higher-end talent, I don't see much value in having an 18yo Stutzle grind out a bottom-dweller season to prove that he's marginally better than a random UFA-age veteran they brought in as affordable depth. Especially when the goal is for Stutzle to become the team's dynamic offensive centerpiece.
- khawk

So what if he goes to the AHL and that team gets caved in every night.....should we send him down to the ECHL.

As long as the prospect is playing well and developing, who cares if the team is losing.

Just like, if the player is playing like poop and not developing, send him down, regardless of if the team is winning

this team is just unwatchable now, and it's 100% because of the AWFUL (frank)ing veterans that dorion brought in.

the ONLY players on this team, over the age of 26, who don't belong in the ECHL is Zaitsev and i guess dadonov.

as far as i'm concerned, this team would be infinitely better off without stepan, cobourn, gudbrandson, reilly, paquette, anisimov, haley, and watson.....every one of these guys is more useless than the 10 year olds that i coach

this team is just unwatchable now, and it's 100% because of the AWFUL (frank)ing veterans that dorion brought in.

the ONLY players on this team, over the age of 26, who don't belong in the ECHL is Zaitsev and i guess dadonov.

as far as i'm concerned, this team would be infinitely better off without stepan, cobourn, gudbrandson, reilly, paquette, anisimov, haley, and watson.....every one of these guys is more useless than the 10 year olds that i coach
- sensarmy_11

They looked better in the first...

They looked better in the first...
- david22

the kids looked good.....the vets are useless, regardless of the period, full stop

Reilly and Cobourn are so awful that they actually make me miss Ceci and Cowen

the kids looked good.....the vets are useless, regardless of the period, full stop

Reilly and Cobourn are so awful that they actually make me miss Ceci and Cowen
- sensarmy_11

Don’t you ever say that




Ever!!

Pretty sure the intention of bringing in all these vets was to not only help protect and ease pressure of the kids, but to potentially trade them at the deadline.

Has anyone actually improved their stock?

Maybe Watson...

Ill make it easier for u today Michael THUMBS ALL THE WAY DOWN FOR OTTAWA AND THE REST OF THE SEASON.


BURN THIS YEAR IMMEDIATELY