I mean I hope the other thing tbat comes out of this is we see way more Evgeny Svechnikov in the lineup!
- Feury

Yzerman didn’t really talk about Svech much. He brought up Rasmussen a couple times (which is new) and Zadina. He’s mentioning those guys more and more and that is a big shift

What a poop trade for the Caps.

Wings did well, not only did they get Vrana+Panik+2021 1st +2022 2nd but they still have their Goalies. We can use both of them for now.

I do appreciate your take. When you take away Washington’s top 2 lines and put Vrana front and center (right now Ovi/Backstom/Oshi are the 2nd line) he’s not going to be the same player. Teams have to expend a tremendous amount of energy in shutting down the top 6. That’s how bottom 6 guys find a lot of success. Once they step into the top 6 on a very weak team where they will be focused on night in and night out, they just can’t function the same
- Jeremy Laura

One extra bit of data to make a counterpoint:

Points per 60, 5-on-5, since 2018-19:

VRANA
1.36 goals
2.46 points

MANTHA
0.76 goals
1.75 points

I think you are correct that Vrana will have a harder time scoring on a per-60 basis in Detroit than he did in Washington.

That said, even if the "cost" of playing in Detroit's offensively-challenged environment cuts Vrana's goal rate almost in half and his point rate by 30 percent, he'd still be able to equal Mantha's even-strength scoring if given the same minutes.

Basically, his scoring rates could drop A LOT and he'd still be in Mantha's league in terms of offensive production given comparable ice time.

Again, I still agree that Mantha is the better player of the two but IMO it's a ton closer than you think it is.

Again, he’s producing on a team with a goals for of 3.43 to a team with 2.22. Look at the talent on Washington. It is way easier to produce in that setting
- Jeremy Laura

And look at how many of his goals are even strength versus powerplay. He is on a high scoring team... that is a blessing and a curse. Its a blessing for a forward to play on a team with offensive talent, no doubt. But the downside is you get little powerplay time.

I cant believe how many Red Wings fans are upset about this lol. This was a great trade for you guys. Varana is a force, he kills the Penguins and plays a smart game. I'm not sad to see him leave Washington.

One extra bit of data to make a counterpoint:

Points per 60, 5-on-5, since 2018-19:

VRANA
1.36 goals
2.46 points

MANTHA
0.76 goals
1.75 points

I think you are correct that Vrana will have a harder time scoring on a per-60 basis in Detroit than he did in Washington.

That said, even if the "cost" of playing in Detroit's offensively-challenged environment cuts Vrana's goal rate almost in half and his point rate by 30 percent, he'd still be able to equal Mantha's even-strength scoring if given the same minutes.

Basically, his scoring rates could drop A LOT and he'd still be in Mantha's league in terms of offensive production given comparable ice time.

Again, I still agree that Mantha is the better player of the two but IMO it's a ton closer than you think it is.
- Sven22

Yea I would rather have Mantha as well but it's not like he's world beating away from Vrana. And well said. I think Detroit did good.

Yzerman fleeced the Caps on the Mantha deal. Good for him.

Long time lurker but just registered today to comment.

I have followed the Wings for about 35 years and have really enjoyed the blogs since Jeremy took over. The blogs and comments have been pretty enjoyable and fun to read, until this afternoon that is. I am simply amazed at some of the comments by several people and how a they cannot step back and find some sort of common ground. Let's face it, time will truly tell the story of this trade and chances are none of us will be 100% correct.

I am a Mantha fan myself and wish him well in Washington but as many faithful fans have pointed out he appeared to take nights off frequently. Yzerman has spoken several times about work ethic, drive, passion, & character so maybe this was a message to the entire roster, you either put in the effort daily or you will not have the privilege of wearing the winged wheel.

The reason Yzerman's son Erne is still on the team and Mantha is gone is probably work ethic, and that's a decent haul for Mantha. Sure, the 1st isn't a high pick in a deep draft, but it's still a pretty good return for a guy who may or may not reach his perceived ceiling.

Panik is inconsistent. Watched him in Tampa and he'd look good in one game and then vanish for long stretches. Sound familiar? A lot of players like that in the league. Bury him in the minors and hope you don't get so many injuries that you need to call him up.

Vrana. Don't know jack about him, but I do trust Yzerman. I don't see anything in this trade that would make me question Yzerman's judgement on it.

Long time lurker but just registered today to comment.

I have followed the Wings for about 35 years and have really enjoyed the blogs since Jeremy took over. The blogs and comments have been pretty enjoyable and fun to read, until this afternoon that is. I am simply amazed at some of the comments by several people and how a they cannot step back and find some sort of common ground. Let's face it, time will truly tell the story of this trade and chances are none of us will be 100% correct.

I am a Mantha fan myself and wish him well in Washington but as many faithful fans have pointed out he appeared to take nights off frequently. Yzerman has spoken several times about work ethic, drive, passion, & character so maybe this was a message to the entire roster, you either put in the effort daily or you will not have the privilege of wearing the winged wheel.
- TxWingFan

Lol

Long time lurker but just registered today to comment.

I have followed the Wings for about 35 years and have really enjoyed the blogs since Jeremy took over. The blogs and comments have been pretty enjoyable and fun to read, until this afternoon that is. I am simply amazed at some of the comments by several people and how a they cannot step back and find some sort of common ground. Let's face it, time will truly tell the story of this trade and chances are none of us will be 100% correct.

I am a Mantha fan myself and wish him well in Washington but as many faithful fans have pointed out he appeared to take nights off frequently. Yzerman has spoken several times about work ethic, drive, passion, & character so maybe this was a message to the entire roster, you either put in the effort daily or you will not have the privilege of wearing the winged wheel.
- TxWingFan

You are absolutely right. My behavior today is an embarrassment. Stammer and several others deserve a whole lot better than what they got from me and this blog today. I am sorry to all of you. This is supposed to be fun. Passionate, but fun. I took that away and am truly sorry to all of you.

Time will tell. But there is no reason that any of you should have been attacked just for having an opinion. It sucks and there’s no excuse. I’m sorry to all

I watch a lot of Capitals games. He’s a completely different player. Very much Darren Helm (which in his prime was fantastic speed wise). Washington is a place where guys can score. I don’t know how the system here will work, but I expect if we keep Vrana long term he’ll be a third line center
- Jeremy Laura

Wut.

There's certainly an overarching sense of irony when the blogger says he watches the games all the time, and then describes him as a Darren Helm-esque player, who apparently plays center, a position he has never played ever.

You are absolutely right. My behavior today is an embarrassment. Stammer and several others deserve a whole lot better than what they got from me and this blog today. I am sorry to all of you. This is supposed to be fun. Passionate, but fun. I took that away and am truly sorry to all of you.

Time will tell. But there is no reason that any of you should have been attacked just for having an opinion. It sucks and there’s no excuse. I’m sorry to all
- Jeremy Laura

I knew you would come back to earth.

A lot of passion was displayed here today. A fan favorite got himself traded today and in a little while Vrana too will be a fan favorite! And to think of what Stevie will acquire with a 1st and a 2nd also!!!
This is a good trade for Detroit, and there is much more potential here for the future than what Anthony Mantha would bring. I suspect Mantha will have some fine seasons ahead of him and he in turn may be happier in his new home. I will still enjoy watching him play as well. I can't wait to see Vrana on his new team!

You are absolutely right. My behavior today is an embarrassment. Stammer and several others deserve a whole lot better than what they got from me and this blog today. I am sorry to all of you. This is supposed to be fun. Passionate, but fun. I took that away and am truly sorry to all of you.

Time will tell. But there is no reason that any of you should have been attacked just for having an opinion. It sucks and there’s no excuse. I’m sorry to all
- Jeremy Laura

Jeremy, today's been a kick in the nards for a lot of folks. You're passionate about this blog. I was watching the NHL network's post-TDL show and even THEY commented on how much of a surprise this move was. This will take time to digest. Everyone's going to have a differing opinion about Mantha, like I said; he's an enigma, so he's going to generate a LOT of comments. I don't think anyone was being deliberately offensive, but I think we're all trying to get out point across as best we can. The thing to remember is that people's opinions are what they are. What we need (ALL OF US) to remember is that the disparity of opinions is what's created such an amazing blog. And that's because of YOU.

Your apology and taking ownership of what you may have contributed to today's blog shows that you truly care about not only the team, but the folks who come to this page.

Like I said, guys: We all need to take a breath and sort this out and get our emotions in check. Time will tell who "won" this deal, we ain't gonna decide that here today. And we're not going to readily change someone's opinion in a blog. But I will say this; there are compelling arguments on BOTH sides of the Mantha deal discussion.....there's some SMART frankers on this site, that's what makes it so good, and highly charged. Like having a bunch of Michelin-starred chefs in here. I love this (frank)ing blog!!!!

You guys are good. Smart. Insightful. Passionate. Forgiving.....

No, I’m not high. And no, Vrana isn’t the best player in the deal. He is a grinder. He’s got some scoring touch, but he’s a 3rd line guy on a very good team
- Jeremy Laura

I think that you are going to be pleasantly surprised with how good Vrana is. This looks to be a good trade for Detroit --- Stevie Y took advantage of a Washington team that is clearly going "all in" for the Cup this year.

I knew you would come back to earth.

A lot of passion was displayed here today. A fan favorite got himself traded today and in a little while Vrana too will be a fan favorite! And to think of what Stevie will acquire with a 1st and a 2nd also!!!
This is a good trade for Detroit, and there is much more potential here for the future than what Anthony Mantha would bring. I suspect Mantha will have some fine seasons ahead of him and he in turn may be happier in his new home. I will still enjoy watching him play as well. I can't wait to see Vrana on his new team!
- HenryHockey

I enjoyed watching Mantha play, and am definitely a fan. Losing him is going to be hard to handle. BFabs said it earlier, we have to trust the Yzerplan.....and it's DAMN hard to when a fan favorite is traded. It's going to take a while to come to terms with this. There's one thing I KNOW For sure; WE cannot change what's been done. We just have to trust the move....and wait. I'll say this; the 1st & 2d will be nice to have....the only way we don't get dorked by Bettman's balls again

I'm with Jeremy on this one...i don't like this trade. Vrana won't have centers like Backstrom or Kuznetsov in Detroit or solid depth to take heat off of him. We'll see how well he does when he starts facing the other teams top pairs all the time playing with Larkin (if he even clicks with him) or he ends up playing with the rest of the crappy centers the Wings have to offer. He better click with Larkin for his sake or be able to generate his offense on his own like AA had to do.


I think Vrana's numbers will take a nose dive while Mantha will go up. Draper better hit on those picks imo or this will be bad for the Wings.

I could have been ok with trading Mantha if they at least filled a need of a good young offensive center or top end young left handed dman.

You are absolutely right. My behavior today is an embarrassment. Stammer and several others deserve a whole lot better than what they got from me and this blog today. I am sorry to all of you. This is supposed to be fun. Passionate, but fun. I took that away and am truly sorry to all of you.

Time will tell. But there is no reason that any of you should have been attacked just for having an opinion. It sucks and there’s no excuse. I’m sorry to all
- Jeremy Laura

I remember when we drafted mantha. It’s hard watching a player knowing he could be a 30 plus goal scorer and knowing he’s likely gonna do that now on another team... with that said nobody will know who won this trade until years down the road. Glad you took a breather and apologized to feds both you guys are to knowledgeable and such a asset to this site!

I enjoyed watching Mantha play, and am definitely a fan. Losing him is going to be hard to handle. BFabs said it earlier, we have to trust the Yzerplan.....and it's DAMN hard to when a fan favorite is traded. It's going to take a while to come to terms with this. There's one thing I KNOW For sure; WE cannot change what's been done. We just have to trust the move....and wait. I'll say this; the 1st & 2d will be nice to have....the only way we don't get dorked by Bettman's balls again
- mcmastermike1968

You guys definitely deserve first overall. You keep getting the shaft on that. But you guys did good with the Mantha trade. Mantha is at a point in his career now where it's time to go win anyways. He doesn't come off as the type of player that will do well going into his 30's. He may yet get traded from the Caps with a year left on his deal to a contender down the road.

What a poop trade for the Caps.
- Blackstrom2

I really don't think it's that awful.

The Caps' window isn't closed yet, but realistically they probably only have a couple years left to gun for at least one more Cup with this core.

Mantha is a very very good player. Probably an upgrade over Vrana, albeit a modest one. He's also cost-controlled at a relatively team-friendly rate for three more years (i.e., likely the remainder of Washington's Cup window).

You also get rid of Panik's contract, which is not really that bad of a deal in a vacuum but maybe not ideal in a flat-cap environment on a team that's trying to load up for 2-3 more kicks at the can.

Was the upgrade from Vrana to Mantha worth a 1st and a 2nd? No, probably not on paper. It's a high price to pay for a relatively small short-term improvement. But I get the logic from Washington's perspective.

Don't get me wrong, if I had to pick a single winner in this deal it's definitely Detroit. But I think ultimately it has the potential to work out well enough for both sides.

I think you'll reconsider this statement.
Guy was our only explosive forward (that speed is special), before we got Sheary.

Maybe with Sheary, they thought he was expendable or something. I'm peeved though.

He wasn't getting great minutes, and was a bit careless defensively sometimes, but his speed can be dominant, and he's got a sneaky finish.

Will be interesting to see him step into a bigger role; I know nothing about Mantha, but Vrana has certifiable upside (guy basically won Game 7 against Tampa for us).
- ghostibator

If you're trying to comfort this guy, comparing Vrana to Sheary ain't gonna help

I'm with Jeremy on this one...i don't like this trade. Vrana won't have centers like Backstrom or Kuznetsov in Detroit or solid depth to take heat off of him. We'll see how well he does when he starts facing the other teams top pairs all the time playing with Larkin (if he even clicks with him) or he ends up playing with the rest of the crappy centers the Wings have to offer. He better click with Larkin for his sake or be able to generate his offense on his own like AA had to do.


I think Vrana's numbers will take a nose dive while Mantha will go up. Draper better hit on those picks imo or this will be bad for the Wings.

I could have been ok with trading Mantha if they at least filled a need of a good young offensive center or top end young left handed dman.
- dcz28

Interesting caveat from Larry Murphy on the Wings broadcast: Vranna did nt get a lot of PP time because Ovi hogged most of that (for good reasons). So Vranna's PP time should greatly increase with the Wings as well as his total TOI, which will give him more opportunity to increase his point totals.
So there is that. He will get his chance and may just surprise us!

I'm with Jeremy on this one...i don't like this trade. Vrana won't have centers like Backstrom or Kuznetsov in Detroit or solid depth to take heat off of him. We'll see how well he does when he starts facing the other teams top pairs all the time playing with Larkin (if he even clicks with him) or he ends up playing with the rest of the crappy centers the Wings have to offer. He better click with Larkin for his sake or be able to generate his offense on his own like AA had to do.


I think Vrana's numbers will take a nose dive while Mantha will go up. Draper better hit on those picks imo or this will be bad for the Wings.

I could have been ok with trading Mantha if they at least filled a need of a good young offensive center or top end young left handed dman.
- dcz28

Over the last three seasons combined, among players with at least 2000 minutes of 5-on-5 ice time, Vrana is fifth in the entire NHL in goals per 60.

Matthews, Ovechkin, Gallagher, Pastrnak, Vrana. That's the top five.

No, he will almost certainly not be anywhere near that efficient while playing top minutes for Detroit. At the same time, his rate of production is so incredibly good that he can take a pretty big nosedive and still end up being pretty damn good.

Over the last three seasons combined, among players with at least 2000 minutes of 5-on-5 ice time, Vrana is fifth in the entire NHL in goals per 60.

Matthews, Ovechkin, Gallagher, Pastrnak, Vrana. That's the top five.

No, he will almost certainly not be anywhere near that efficient while playing top minutes for Detroit. At the same time, his rate of production is so incredibly good that he can take a pretty big nosedive and still end up being pretty damn good.
- Sven22

Good think you are on the stats there Sven! This deal is looking better by the minute!
Now to poke the bear: Vrana's sweater # is 13!