Two pair of quick goals dun’em-in - due to misplays by Hawk veterans - Zamora, Keith on two of the four, deHaan with a weak clear (albeit on his backhand because he had to skate on his wrong side), Murphy not dropping his stick and holding on to his helmet with both hands (well, maybe not that one)....

Add in another mediocre game from Kane. Not his fault, yeah, opponents are giving him no space or time, not much relief from his linemates, ok....But this team lacks scoring punch - only AdB is scoring consistently. Kubalik, Kurashev, Suter, Strome - it ain’t happ’nin’.

Kane needs to be better - somehow they (THEY) have to find a way.
- StLBravesFan

Not sure how much better he can be. The roster itself is rather flawed, they defend poorly, have little organization and with out a burning hot power play and very good goaltending they don't win.

The team lacks a lot of competent hockey fundamentals. If the roster isn't garbage or the coaching isn't terrible its both being mediocre enough to tease the causal fan but ultimately disappoint.

We're pinning our hopes on a guy who was the 5th highest scorer ON HIS TEAM? In a GERMAN league?

C'mon man......
- mohel

At least it's better than a Tier 2 Swedish league coach.

Show me a successful team where the top player was signed as a UFA. I can’t think of any.
- paulr

Hossa was a big piece for the 2010 team (and in Detroit and in Pitt) as well as Campbell. Lotta monies there. Not the 'best' players on the roster but pretty important to the teams success.

Rafalski was an important piece for the wings.

Niedermayer was pretty important for the Ducks.

Chara was a free agent signing i believe.

Ed Belfour was a solid signing by Dallas.

All those guys won Cups with those teams except for Hossa's stint with the Pens and Wings but did make the finals.

Doesn't not resigning Z accomplish the same thing?
- rpeters01

Yes. But then you lose another player in the expansion draft.

Not sure how much better he can be. The roster itself is rather flawed, they defend poorly, have little organization and with out a burning hot power play and very good goaltending they don't win.

The team lacks a lot of competent hockey fundamentals. If the roster isn't garbage or the coaching isn't terrible its both being mediocre enough to tease the causal fan but ultimately disappoint.
- fattybeef

Best post of the month....

Hossa was a big piece for the 2010 team (and in Detroit and in Pitt) as well as Campbell. Lotta monies there. Not the 'best' players on the roster but pretty important to the teams success.

Rafalski was an important piece for the wings.

Niedermayer was pretty important for the Ducks

Chara was a free agent signing i believe.

Ed Belfour was a solid signing by Dallas.

All those guys won Cups with those teams except for Hossa's stint with the Pens and Wings but did make the finals.
- fattybeef

. Agreed and in every cases the free agent signings added a missing piece to a team already built mainly through the draft. What I’m saying is you sign a free agent to complete a team, you don’t sign a free agent to build around.

Not sure how much better he can be. The roster itself is rather flawed, they defend poorly, have little organization and with out a burning hot power play and very good goaltending they don't win.

The team lacks a lot of competent hockey fundamentals. If the roster isn't garbage or the coaching isn't terrible its both being mediocre enough to tease the causal fan but ultimately disappoint.
- fattybeef

And yet team played well above expectations. No one, including you, never thought the team would play well enough to challenge for a playoff spot when the season began.

And yet team played well above expectations. No one, including you, never thought the team would play well enough to challenge for a playoff spot when the season began.
- paulr

Plus they sold at the deadline, Janmark and Soderberg were an integral part of the offense. Who knows if anything would of been different if they were still here. They had a bigger impact on the team than Connolly and Stillman have so far.

. Agreed and in every cases the free agent signings added a missing piece to a team already built mainly through the draft. What I’m saying is you sign a free agent to complete a team, you don’t sign a free agent to build around.
- paulr

Even Bean Counter Bowman knows that, look at the tdl. I like that he's building with younger pieces, trying to address areas the team lacks on, & collected picks. If they pan out is a different story, but he trusts his staff. I do too.

Hossa was a big piece for the 2010 team (and in Detroit and in Pitt) as well as Campbell. Lotta monies there. Not the 'best' players on the roster but pretty important to the teams success.

Rafalski was an important piece for the wings.

Niedermayer was pretty important for the Ducks.

Chara was a free agent signing i believe.

Ed Belfour was a solid signing by Dallas.

All those guys won Cups with those teams except for Hossa's stint with the Pens and Wings but did make the finals.
- fattybeef

Missing the signing of Brian Campbell in 2008. The Hawks paid two big free agents in order to get to that first cup in 2010.

I'm fine with the Hawks signing a big name FA. Just has to be the right player and the right price.

And yet team played well above expectations. No one, including you, never thought the team would play well enough to challenge for a playoff spot when the season began.
- paulr

Give Colliton and the leaders of this team credit - they came out ready to play in January and they built up a good point total based in large part on consistent, high energy effort, Kane, Debrincat and Lankinen. And without any top 6 centers with Toews and Dach out. I don't think anyone was counting on a full season, if any games, from Seabrook and Shaw. Eventually the league caught up.

They are not finished this season, but the tea leaves are not looking good relative to Nashville, and as pointed out, Dallas has an easier end to the season. "Shadow Kane and exploit the team defense" is a model everyone seems to be following. Until/unless the defense improves and the special teams become closer to special, a better draft choice is a likelier outcome.

Credit to Stan for turning two rentals into some young players that hopefully will contribute beyond their previous team's assessment. Then it is a home run.

. Agreed and in every cases the free agent signings added a missing piece to a team already built mainly through the draft. What I’m saying is you sign a free agent to complete a team, you don’t sign a free agent to build around.
- paulr

Not sure I get why Barkov, etc., can't complete the team. If you have a core of very good players, but are missing the #1 center to make you an elite team, why wouldn't you sign him (assuming you can?

If, at the end of next year, the kids are not progressing well, I wouldn't do it either. But, if they are, I'd sign a Barkov or a Matthews. But not older UFA types.

Not sure I get why Barkov, etc., can't complete the team. If you have a core of very good players, but are missing the #1 center to make you an elite team, why wouldn't you sign him (assuming you can?

If, at the end of next year, the kids are not progressing well, I wouldn't do it either. But, if they are, I'd sign a Barkov or a Matthews. But not older UFA types.
- mohel

Maybe a Barkov or Matthews could complete a team. But I don’t see a team to be completed. I see an awful lot of holes to be filled before the team starts looking at UFAs. Keith isn’t half of what he was and he’s still the best defenseman the team has. Boqvist is looking better each game. Kaylnuk, Mitchell and Beaudin have shown lots of potential but also questions. Kane will start to decline soon. They have Dach, ADB and Kubalik but not much else as far as top end talent going forward. There is also a lack of depth players. The question is can Barkov be the glue to make the team gel? I think the team is too early in the build for him or anyone to make it a contender. Will this change in a year?

Maybe a Barkov or Matthews could complete a team. But I don’t see a team to be completed. I see an awful lot of holes to be filled before the team starts looking at UFAs. Keith isn’t half of what he was and he’s still the best defenseman the team has. Boqvist is looking better each game. Kaylnuk, Mitchell and Beaudin have shown lots of potential but also questions. Kane will start to decline soon. They have Dach, ADB and Kubalik but not much else as far as top end talent going forward. There is also a lack of depth players. The question is can Barkov be the glue to make the team gel? I think the team is too early in the build for him or anyone to make it a contender. Will this change in a year?
- paulr

We'll see. No need to decide until after next year.

For the record - I agree with your approach. I don't like high priced UFA's. Those two are exceptions in my book; because they are pretty young UFA's, and because they are really good.

The big thing is.....no need to decide until after next season. And Barkov will likely be signed by then.

Maybe a Barkov or Matthews could complete a team. But I don’t see a team to be completed. I see an awful lot of holes to be filled before the team starts looking at UFAs. Keith isn’t half of what he was and he’s still the best defenseman the team has. Boqvist is looking better each game. Kaylnuk, Mitchell and Beaudin have shown lots of potential but also questions. Kane will start to decline soon. They have Dach, ADB and Kubalik but not much else as far as top end talent going forward. There is also a lack of depth players. The question is can Barkov be the glue to make the team gel? I think the team is too early in the build for him or anyone to make it a contender. Will this change in a year?
- paulr

Goes back to a lot of what ifs. My post back on page 2 listed 11 home grown players that have to continue to develop. Add Lankinen to make it an even dozen. If they take the next step next season, the team will improve, unless the coaching and the system hinders their development. Somewhere down the road you'll need a top C and D to go from point B to A.

We'll see. No need to decide until after next year.

For the record - I agree with your approach. I don't like high priced UFA's. Those two are exceptions in my book; because they are pretty young UFA's, and because they are really good.

The big thing is.....no need to decide until after next season. And Barkov will likely be signed by then.
- mohel

And if the defense looks to be coming together, if there’s more than two lines and if the team is stronger than this season then maybe Barkov can be the missing piece. Let’s hope the team improves drastically enough where signing Barkov is a viable option.

Goes back to a lot of what ifs. My post back on page 2 listed 11 home grown players that have to continue to develop. Add Lankinen to make it an even dozen. If they take the next step next season, the team will improve, unless the coaching and the system hinders their development. Somewhere down the road you'll need a top C and D to go from point B to A.
- boilermaker100

Like I said to Mo, let’s hope the team gets stronger next season so we can have a serious discussion about signing a big name free agent

bill in the 2020 draft there was a pretty strong consensus top 12. with lundell being the 12th guy. then maybe a next group of 5-10. Jarvis, mercer, holloway. anrimov, lapeirre, guhle. reichel at the edge of that.

in the 12 there was a top 3 then 9 guys that really depending on the situation any one of them could end up being the best of the 2nd group

Were are the breaks in this draft.

https://www.lines.com/nhl/drafts
- kmw4631

I just figured that bill might have many me, Bill.
2020 had a strong top three, a nice next tier of 13 and the draft choices quickly ramped down.
At the time I had Guhle in that group not Rodian Armirov, and really felt Dawson Mercer a great jackknife centre wing who plays smart and the German kid were in that tier...I expected Braden Schneider to go before Reichel, Dawson, Armirov, mostly because, I simply have limited perceptions and not a NHL scouting group adding to "what I think I see/don't see."

Your question about the tiers in thi=s class is a reasonable but tough one, in that many teams this time have their minds made up not just on the limited looks but on what they scouted and decided the year before.
It does look like the World Junior under 19 will be played and that may be a golden ticket or a pink slip based on one more viewing.

I don't know if these draft prognosticators simply follow each other and adjust their thoughts based on others, but I have never seen a draft where so many players are thought of as top selections and not top selections at the same time.
If you go to the 2021 Draft on Lines.com and click on PLAYER RANKINGS (this for reason a develop put the first list and it only has 200 of the 550 names in the class.)
THAT is where I had them when I started.
You will notice that Dylan Guenther was my first forward at slot one (NOW STILL TWO)
and Owen power was #2 player and now is number one.
I don't think you saw many of the other draft guys with them both sitting there.

And throughout the months, the players names I have heard that are top ten worthy, including mine well I see 17. I dont know if I ever have seen this type of diversity.
I think part of it stems from the size in many defenders, the abilities and upside of som many of the 17 year old forwards and the IQ, Hands and overall general smarts and skill that this draft is full of. It is the coaching the teaching reviews and everything elsel that has enabled so many players to be on the radar to go early.
Believe me, the first time I saw the 3rd Hughes brother being talked about as one of the topmdefendewrs to be drafted, I did more than roll my eyes...There are /were simply too many big quick defenders for them to consider him as "separated" from them.th
Same when Elite Prospects chief scout announced that Willam Ecklund was by far the first choice and from my limited views was starting at then end of my second round, and is presently the 4th best forward if teams pass on the defenders....
The Michigan freshman are all worthy of consideration by me if I'm a GM picking high.
Chancy to pick a defender ? Be careful?
I don't care if Kent Johnson ends up on the wing (either wing), because he can score and will score at the next level. Boo the frank hoo if he isn't a centre.

Same goes for the predictions that Matthew Beniers is only 2nd line upside as a centre. I saw the World Junior USAand whenever he was out there no matter what zone he was in the middle of the action, or leading it or causing it. If youy draft early you wanna hockey player, right? There he is. I just don'd which I would take.

If Owen Power scares you, or Simon Edvinsson scares you, (what could scare you about Brandt Clarke?) or you don't see the upside I do in Carson Lambos, then take a forward!
If you really think Hughes can be an NHL defender, by all means select him!

Just don't be surprised when some snags 6' 5" USA defender4 Roman Schmidt without fear later. Or the BCHL Makar clone Corson Ceulemans some love, or the Sweden (Anton Olsson), the two Russians (Daniil Chayka & Artem Grushnikov) and the Czech (Stanislav Svozil) when they get picked.

Bobby McKenzie says there are two goalies going early. Jesper Wallstedt and Sebastian Cossa. If that happens, that thickens the list.

It as an eyeopener when I went to MyNHLdraft and the comments on each and every player were so diverse and so many complimentary, and Although it will not fog my opinion, there are a lot of guys that are locked in to go early, more than there are slots.

I am just saying with the strong love I keep seeing for Fabian Lysell, Oskar Olausson, and Simon Robertsson, you cannot close you eyes on Cole Sillenger. I heard he can't skate. LOL. I don't care where he plays ,a s he already does" play."

Same with Chad Lucius, out because of the knee. He has hands that put the puck where he wants it. You gonna pass on him?

Oh, I failed to mention three other Canadian Junior centres and Raty...

so to answer on the tiers:

No top generation tier players are in the class until they develop and are.
a) There is a top nine that all could go first.
b) But there are also at very last three more prospects that could easily go in that top 8 and depending upon what teams think maybe more.
c) at slot 13, I see at least another half-dozen that you could consider enough to call them possible top ten guys.
e) so at 18 I would say you start a tier that backups into the middle of the second round, and to me that is extremely rare.

In general,this is the first draft in years where there seems to be first round talent up to slot 29, in that you probably can get quy who plays for your team.

And if the defense looks to be coming together, if there’s more than two lines and if the team is stronger than this season then maybe Barkov can be the missing piece. Let’s hope the team improves drastically enough where signing Barkov is a viable option.
- paulr

If his drafts are any indication, Bowman decided awhile ago to build from the blue line forward. He then signs Euros every year trying to give the team some offence up front.

None of it is working very well as they are totally devoid up the middle of the ice. Dach might be better slotted as a winger but they are going to have to use him at center because there are no candidates that I see that can fill his spot.

Stan better hope Borgstrom and Reichel can play the pivot at the NHL level.

Like I said to Mo, let’s hope the team gets stronger next season so we can have a serious discussion about signing a big name free agent
- paulr

Agreed. Good conversation.

Not sure I get why Barkov, etc., can't complete the team. If you have a core of very good players, but are missing the #1 center to make you an elite team, why wouldn't you sign him (assuming you can?

If, at the end of next year, the kids are not progressing well, I wouldn't do it either. But, if they are, I'd sign a Barkov or a Matthews. But not older UFA types.
- mohel

I'm not knocking them as players, but the important part of your question "if you have a core of very good players" do we? I like what we have & competed against strong teams, Covid is to blame, but how would we look against the league? Sadly, we play 7 teams, and I can't make a sound, complete judgment. I think we are more than one piece away & filling one hole expensively doesn't address all needs & could create more down the road.

We need more status updates as it could change us. Another year? I would love one of those players, but Matthew's "bridge deal" made him expensive as that ends. I feel like an expensive forward creates another Kane/Panarin set of seasons - outscore the opponent without much d help & Lank & Subban prove they aren't stellar dependable. They could be, but might not.

Not sure I get why Barkov, etc., can't complete the team. If you have a core of very good players, but are missing the #1 center to make you an elite team, why wouldn't you sign him (assuming you can?

If, at the end of next year, the kids are not progressing well, I wouldn't do it either. But, if they are, I'd sign a Barkov or a Matthews. But not older UFA types.
- mohel

The best free agent signings are usually 26-27 year old type players. It’s not often that you get lucky signing a 30 year old FA, the only two that have worked out in Chicago are Hossa and Lester. Look at the Braves and Maddux, I believe he was 26 when they signed him. If you sign a stud 26 year old FA, you have a much better chance of said player being successful than say a 31-32 year old FA. Normally there are not many stud 26 year olds that become FA’s, unless you have a bad organization (see Cubs when they let Maddux go).

Losing Toews is a killer because of the number of boxes he checks as a center, even with the decline in his game from five years ago. Arguably the Hawks need two centers, another top 6 winger and at least two top-4 defensemen either from what they have or between now and the middle of next season to be relevant. And that assumes Lankinen is more of his first three months than the last one. That is a lot to ask.

Missing the signing of Brian Campbell in 2008. The Hawks paid two big free agents in order to get to that first cup in 2010.

I'm fine with the Hawks signing a big name FA. Just has to be the right player and the right price.
- bhawks2241

And (no red font) it has to be the right time. As Paul said, hopefully the end of the 22-23 season will be the right time.

I'm not knocking them as players, but the important part of your question "if you have a core of very good players" do we? I like what we have & competed against strong teams, Covid is to blame, but how would we look against the league? Sadly, we play 7 teams, and I can't make a sound, complete judgment. I think we are more than one piece away & filling one hole expensively doesn't address all needs & could create more down the road.

We need more status updates as it could change us. Another year? I would love one of those players, but Matthew's "bridge deal" made him expensive as that ends. I feel like an expensive forward creates another Kane/Panarin set of seasons - outscore the opponent without much d help & Lank & Subban prove they aren't stellar dependable. They could be, but might not.
- I Am The Breadman

Don't forget, next season if we are through the horror period of COVID, if Tampa and Florida are a wash with Colorado and Winnipeg, we subtract Detroit and bring back the Blues without their Stanley Cup hangover. That is a pretty big wall to climb....