CERB payments and EI payments when the people out of work can't find jobs will obviously cost more if the pandemic gets worse but we have no reason to believe it will get worse. There is a vaccine, it is being administered, there are protocols (rules) in place to help minimize spread.

We may not like some, all of these things but it's not going to endlessly get worse there are too many things being done now that were not being done a year ago.

It may get worse short term because people were being silly, stupid or just revolting but long term it will get better.

So the choice for paid sick days should be viewed with long term impacts as well as short term ones. It's being used (again) as a political issue to try and garner support for some and point the finger at others (sadly). These things aren't free despite what some political parties seem to think so it would be foolish to look at it as an easy to do, with no long term consequences thing.

Can they do something temporary? Probably but the provinces won't do that, it would be a federal thing.

Provinces know if they do it they can never step back and revoke it.

It wasn't too long ago there were no sick days (unpaid or paid) mandated by legislation and the Emergency leave provisions were added to provincial legislation in Ontario. I remember that was widely celebrated as win.

Does everyone want paid sick days? Of course.

Can every business afford to provide them today? I'm not sure.

Will it impact businesses from growing and expanding in the future? Maybe?

Would it perhaps stop someone from opening a business? I hope not but maybe?

Like I said it's an interesting issue with many unknowns, I just think rushing in to do it based on the pandemic may not be work out in the long run if it's done as a permanent provincial change.

As a temporary federal measure to assist in the pandemic response - yell yes do it yesterday (but it won't happen - JT has said as much).
- Cush29

It won’t get worse? That’s the only reason in the world that Doug Ford would ever possibly bring in paid sick leave. If his medical advisors come out and tell him that everything is fine and it’s not necessary, then I’m cool but that’s not what any docs are saying and that’s not why Peel is shutting down businesses.

when you say 'pay for all the sick time themselves' you actually mean politicians & government officials taking the decision to spend taxpayers money.. (just so we're clear that gov't actually doesn't have its 'own' money)
- MaximusAurelius

Yeah they do have their own money. Try not paying your taxes

A little unrelated, but with all you guys talking about having spouses who are teachers:

My parents were both in education, so their vacations always matched.

I have no idea how marriages with only one teacher stay together - especially ones where the guy is the teacher (like my brother).

I would be sooooooo franking pissed if I was getting up every morning in the summer to go to the rock quarry, while my wife slept in 'til noon.
- Atomic Wedgie

I have to layout my clothes in the spare room so I don't disturb her or my son when I get up.

It (frank)ing sucks Wedgie, no nice way to say it.

The Liberals under Kathleen Wynne legislated two sick days per year.

It was one of the first things the Ford government revoked.
- Atomic Wedgie

Huh - didn't know that! I can't say I agree with it and it's fairly surprising to me and shortsighted of the Ford Government.

Did it get alot of media attention because I honestly didn't hear anything about it. Maybe it was just back page news when 'buck a beer' was on the front page.

Yeah they do have their own money. Try not paying your taxes
- Canada Cup

taxes are paid to cover debts of governments.
quantitative easing is only making the rich more wealthy.
my point is that politicians keen on spending more money in general doesn't actually help (mid and long term) the population of a country.

Yesterday @ 5:49 PM ET
For any of you knuckleheads "holding out" for Pfizer/Modena:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3odScka55A
- gravyface


Wow.
Every person thinking about getting vaccine should watch that.

I just watched this video and feel more ed-u-ma-kate-ed now so thank you to whomever shared it.

In all seriousness it is a really well done video and does explain things well.

I have researched the Astrazeneca vaccine a bit via google as it's most likely that's what I'll be getting and besides the stories about the half dose/full dose issue during their clinical trials its hard to find any info on when their trials were conducted.

I was hoping they would show it in the video but they did not (I assume because the video is US based and that vaccine is not approved/being used in the US) but I am intrested to know when those trials were conducted if anyone knows?

I believe from what I read they did 2 trials - one in Brazil and one in the UK?

I'm just trying to figure out how similar or different the efficiency rate should be viewed against the other big name vaccines as were shown in the video.

Full disclosure - my wife wanted to wait for one of the 'better' vaccines and I have kept saying nope whatever is offered to me I'm taking. She has come around and has signed up but I know still has some hesitancy an this video with a bit of AZ info might help me make her feel better about it.

Thx if anyone knows and now back to your regularly scheduled Leaf talk.

Our PP sucks it needs to be fixed.

Our goalies suck but we have no options so let's hope 1 or more of them figure it out

Lou Foligino is the saviour and will fix it all.

Go Leafs Go
- Cush29

This is a great video. Very informative.
Thanks Gravy and Cush for sharing.

It would be interesting to take this poll with women.

I'm guessing that the numbers would be higher.

Not because they get sick more or abuse the system - but because they aren't into the macho bullpoop like we are.
- Atomic Wedgie

Most homes I think the women call in sick if the child is.

It won’t get worse? That’s the only reason in the world that Doug Ford would ever possibly bring in paid sick leave. If his medical advisors come out and tell him that everything is fine and it’s not necessary, then I’m cool but that’s not what any docs are saying and that’s not why Peel is shutting down businesses.
- Canada Cup

Did you read where I said it may get worse short term or just skip that part entirely? Do you have access to what his medical advisors have told him because I haven't seen it published publically.

Doctor's are saying lots of things, the government takes it lead from the advisors in the government not doctors or teachers (or teachers unions) - this is fact. It may anger people and you may or may not agree with how it works but it's how it works.

Peel is making their own decisions, so is every other area in the province what's your point?

Let's not kid ourselves any doctor who is asked will say paid sick days are a good thing and they would have said that before COVID so them saying it now is not a new, earth shattering revelation. Hell I think pretty much anyone you ask doctor or not would say the same thing.

There are only 2 provinces in the country that have mandatory / legislated paid sick days now and they are 2 days per year in one and 1 day per year in the other. Opposition parties in Ontario are calling for 10 paid sick days per year - that's quite a jump from 2 or zero.

The feds could do something - but I'm pretty sure they won't.

The point I was making is that it's a complex issue with short and long term gains and potential negative impacts and not a provincial decision I think should be rushed into.

I'm not sure why you want to argue with me about it?

So question for you fellas and ladies who already have paid sick days:

What's the most you've ever taken?

I don't think I've ever taken more than two in a year.

And on the one hand, I don't think I'll be as macho-dude anymore and go in even when I'm feeling like poop, but I also think there will be more days where I say I'm feeling under the weather but can still work, so I'll just work from home.
- Atomic Wedgie

8 days once and I was on a contract which hurt the bank account

Stress is enemy #1 for lots of bad things.

I know now how stressful my job was... Easily my best decision ever to half my $$ and divide my hours by ~5.
- 21peter

Thats awesome Looking after yourself and making sure you are getting the best out of your life is important

I went to work after having 3 wisdom teeth removed. Specifically got the 8 am appointment so I would just be a few minutes late.

I'm now thinking how stupid that was.

Nobody gave me a trophy.
- Atomic Wedgie

I put in a full day's work after I got home at night after my kidney stone surgery.
I did not want to ruin my perfect record.

This was during a time when the boss I had treated me like poop and I was miserable all the time,

I look back at that and think what an idiot I was to care.

people in Canada on a fixed contract working at a company (blackberry or a bank or working in a hospital or whatever) when calling in sick and staying home get less salary that month??

people in Canada on a fixed contract working at a company (blackberry or a bank or working in a hospital or whatever) when calling in sick and staying home get less salary that month??

I put in a full day's work after I got home at night after my kidney stone surgery.
I did not want to ruin my perfect record.

This was during a time when the boss I had treated me like poop and I was miserable all the time,

I look back at that and think what an idiot I was to care.
- Aetherial

just watched a video on India...wow that looks bad there

- 21peter

people in Canada on a fixed contract working at a company (blackberry or a bank or working in a hospital or whatever) when calling in sick and staying home get less salary that month??
- MaximusAurelius

It depends on the contract.

just watched a video on India...wow that looks bad there
- senstroll

I just saw some news on it also on CP24

Honestly, I am surprised they have not been nearly as bad until now. I would have guessed they would easily be the hardest hit country in the world all along.

I just saw some news on it also on CP24

Honestly, I am surprised they have not been nearly as bad until now. I would have guessed they would easily be the hardest hit country in the world all along.
- Aetherial

pushing your loved one up to a hospital door and just having to watch them die and not be able to get care . heartbreaking

Good answer:

Arthur Staple
@StapeAthletic

Palmieri on NHL protocols: "The challenges we face as hockey players pale in comparison to what the rest of the world has been facing."
11:25 AM · Apr 22, 2021·Twitter Web App

pushing your loved one up to a
hospital door and just having to watch them die and not be able to get care . heartbreaking
- senstroll

according to some guy in here, Indians apparently dont care - because they can just buy 3dollar drug regimen that heals covid patients quickly...

Did you read where I said it may get worse short term or just skip that part entirely? Do you have access to what his medical advisors have told him because I haven't seen it published publically.

Doctor's are saying lots of things, the government takes it lead from the advisors in the government not doctors or teachers (or teachers unions) - this is fact. It may anger people and you may or may not agree with how it works but it's how it works.

Peel is making their own decisions, so is every other area in the province what's your point?

Let's not kid ourselves any doctor who is asked will say paid sick days are a good thing and they would have said that before COVID so them saying it now is not a new, earth shattering revelation. Hell I think pretty much anyone you ask doctor or not would say the same thing.

There are only 2 provinces in the country that have mandatory / legislated paid sick days now and they are 2 days per year in one and 1 day per year in the other. Opposition parties in Ontario are calling for 10 paid sick days per year - that's quite a jump from 2 or zero.

The feds could do something - but I'm pretty sure they won't.

The point I was making is that it's a complex issue with short and long term gains and potential negative impacts and not a provincial decision I think should be rushed into.

I'm not sure why you want to argue with me about it?
- Cush29

What’s wrong with people having different points of view? Can’t we talk about policy ideas without getting upset?

I’m talking about a temporary initiative of paid sick days to get us through a temporary worsening of the pandemic so that it lasts for less time than it would if people who are sick go back to work because they can’t afford to stay home.

I’m not proposing a long term thing at all. I know who the Premier is and that this sort of thing isn’t an option. And I’m talking about his medical advisors - not random doctors.

according to some guy in here, Indians apparently dont care - because they can just buy 3dollar drug regimen that heals covid patients quickly...
- MaximusAurelius

Some guy that used to be in here I believe

What’s wrong with people having different points of view? Can’t we talk about policy ideas without getting upset?

I’m talking about a temporary initiative of paid sick days to get us through a temporary worsening of the pandemic so that it lasts for less time than it would if people who are sick go back to work because they can’t afford to stay home.

I’m not proposing a long term thing at all. I know who the Premier is and that this sort of thing isn’t an option. And I’m talking about his medical advisors - not random doctors.
- Canada Cup

very much agree that in principle it makes sense for governments to temporarily set up a program that reduces the risk of infection.
however, since EDIT; it is not clear what part of new incidence cases are caused by asymptomatic transmission, it could potentially not be a very effective measure (if the goal is to reduce transmission).
in any case - people that are really ill from covid are not going into work - even if it means they are losing money that they cannot afford to lose.

taxes are paid to cover debts of governments.
quantitative easing is only making the rich more wealthy.
my point is that politicians keen on spending more money in general doesn't actually help (mid and long term) the population of a country.
- MaximusAurelius

Depends what they spend the money on. Unfortunately, paying down the debt is becoming a bigger share of total spending