I believe the teams he's played for have only won 1 playoff series? No playoffs this year
- BetweenTheDots

CBUS and NYR. Put Panarin on this team... are they in the playoffs? No, but he is an outstanding player.

CBUS and NYR. Put Panarin on this team... are they in the playoffs? No, but he is an outstanding player.
- Chunk

With that salary (frank) no. Gotta let go of the pretty shiny pieces, right now with his salary the way he plays and his ability to score goals rather have the cat.

Not sure I follow. You note that most if not all the goals are due to player error, but that Colliton should have adjusted to something.

I'm not saying that Colliton is a good/great coach. Far from it. All I am asking is how to square individual mistakes being blamed on the coach.

I certainly may be missing your point.
- Chunk

My point was about more than the player errors - those happen, many / most are due to inexperience - even tho many are also due to lack of communication.

But I was mostly considering his in-game management - he hasn’t proven that he can make the adjustments to counter what the opponent is doing.

If you want to say that he hasn’t proven unable to do it, ok - If you want to blame it, too, on all of the rookies, inexperience, youth, new players - ok, I won’t argue. But I WILL argue that he hasn’t yet proven that he can be the bench coach that a Cup-contender needs.

I never said (like many here) “fire him tomorrow” - I never said he WON’T be able to get there. I’m just saying he hasn’t proven yet that he CAN.

Next season is a critical one for him and this team: let’s see how it goes.

Explain Bickell.
- BINGO!

Bickell's contract was precisely what he would get on the open market at the time.

My point was about more than the player errors - those happen, many / most are due to inexperience - even tho many are also due to lack of communication.

But I was mostly considering his in-game management - he hasn’t proven that he can make the adjustments to counter what the opponent is doing.

If you want to say that he hasn’t proven unable to do it, ok - If you want to blame it, too, on all of the rookies, inexperience, youth, new players - ok, I won’t argue. But I WILL argue that he hasn’t yet proven that he can be the bench coach that a Cup-contender needs.

I never said (like many here) “fire him tomorrow” - I never said he WON’T be able to get there. I’m just saying he hasn’t proven yet that he CAN.

Next season is a critical one for him and this team: let’s see how it goes.
- StLBravesFan

What about the Oilers series last year?

MS, he is supposed to predict that. Besides, he was big in the 2015 cup run.
- LAHawk

I mean giving him that contract.

You don't pay a 20-30 point guy that kind of money, even if he did have *checks notes* ....10 points in 19 playoff games?

Then to trade away your top prospect with him so you can get a couple middling picks back?

Terrible asset management.

My point being Bowman has basically been fleeced continuously on his trades. And let's not get into the 11 million for Panera please ?
We've been through that for years now. You don't trade a superstar to fill needs.... EVER.
- Hawkytalk

The trade was made IN PART BECAUSE Chicago could not fit in Panarin's next contract under the salary cap. I agree that you don't trade a superstar to fill a need. Bowman did try to do that, and at that time he was correct when he said that the team needed more North South players. More size and willingness to play cycle game would have been a more articulate answer.

Bowman's trading record has been spotty. But you my friend are just a Bowman basher so you see everything in the worse possible way

I question his hiring of Colliton and how inappropriate the system he introduced. Colliton probably won't be judged as inappropriate or failing, even could be better by Bowman until much better talent. Also fewer rookies/more experience yet the team is getting outplayed too wide a margin and still has difficulties with the system. Then Colliton should make adjustments or he could loose his job

I am only trying to look at this objectively; I am not a Bowman apologetic. But it may just kill you to accept that Bowman identified core pieces, kept him here for three Cups and reconstructed the roster during a salary cap era. This is an impressive accomplishment.

His drafting has been pretty good past few years. I do not have much faith in his trading going forward but he may be ok. He has signed worthwhile euro free agents and he brought Panarin here. If you want to call him out for anything, you must admit that he has managed successfully, overall. You don't think he was under orders to be competitive although his core players were aging and some of them were no longer as good as previously

Explain Bickell.
- BINGO!

Have you heard of MS?

Bickell's contract was precisely what he would get on the open market at the time.
- Chunk

I guess? I dunno. It always smacked of a poor decision to me, and an even poorer one when they got rid of him the way they did.

I mean giving him that contract.

You don't pay a 20-30 point guy that kind of money, even if he did have *checks notes* ....10 points in 19 playoff games?

Then to trade away your top prospect with him so you can get a couple middling picks back?

Terrible asset management.
- BINGO!

They were upset TT rather play golf than train during the summer. Yea that was a big swing and a miss by the Blackhawks, but with all the moves Bowman made it could of been a hell of a lot worse for us. It's not like we traded for Darling.

Have you heard of MS?
- rpeters01

I don't mean what happened to him. I mean packaging Teravainen with him to get a second round pick back.

My point was about more than the player errors - those happen, many / most are due to inexperience - even tho many are also due to lack of communication.

But I was mostly considering his in-game management - he hasn’t proven that he can make the adjustments to counter what the opponent is doing.

If you want to say that he hasn’t proven unable to do it, ok - If you want to blame it, too, on all of the rookies, inexperience, youth, new players - ok, I won’t argue. But I WILL argue that he hasn’t yet proven that he can be the bench coach that a Cup-contender needs.

I never said (like many here) “fire him tomorrow” - I never said he WON’T be able to get there. I’m just saying he hasn’t proven yet that he CAN.

Next season is a critical one for him and this team: let’s see how it goes.
- StLBravesFan

We are vehemently agreeing with each other on every point here except one. You state that Colliton hasn't made any (or at least hasn't shown the ability to) make in game adjustments. What would those adjustments be? How would you determine that he HAS made an adjustment that worked?

They were upset TT rather play golf than train during the summer. Yea that was a big swing and a miss by the Blackhawks, but with all the moves Bowman made it could of been a hell of a lot worse for us. It's not like we traded for Darling.
- BetweenTheDots

touche

I mean giving him that contract.

You don't pay a 20-30 point guy that kind of money, even if he did have *checks notes* ....10 points in 19 playoff games?

Then to trade away your top prospect with him so you can get a couple middling picks back?

Terrible asset management.
- BINGO!

That top prospect was about to be needed to be paid substantial $'s and had not proven anything.

What about the Oilers series last year?
- BetweenTheDots

In 2 1/2 seasons (considering this as a full season), you go to one 5-game series to counter an argument? A series that (under normal circumstances) they wouldn’t have played well enough to get into?

OK - he coached well, his players played well.

We are vehemently agreeing with each other on every point here except one. You state that Colliton hasn't made any (or at least hasn't shown the ability to) make in game adjustments. What would those adjustments be? How would you determine that he HAS made an adjustment that worked?
- Chunk

Bad players would play good is the only thing I can think of these posts mean?

That top prospect was about to be needed to be paid substantial $'s and had not proven anything.
- rpeters01

We signed him for $2.86 for two years, and then for $5.4 for 5.

I mean giving him that contract.

You don't pay a 20-30 point guy that kind of money, even if he did have *checks notes* ....10 points in 19 playoff games?

Then to trade away your top prospect with him so you can get a couple middling picks back?

Terrible asset management.
- BINGO!

Bickell was putting up similar numbers to Tom Wilson at the time of their new contracts. Bickell got 4X $4 on a contract that started in 2013. Wilson got 6X $5.16 on a contract that started in 2018 and Bickell was not a total pud.

The trade sucks now. At the time, Stan NEEDED to get rid of a contract and TT was good but underwhelming. Stan ended up wrong on that one. You can't just take the situation out of the transactions.

Not sure I follow. You note that most if not all the goals are due to player error, but that Colliton should have adjusted to something.

I'm not saying that Colliton is a good/great coach. Far from it. All I am asking is how to square individual mistakes being blamed on the coach.

I certainly may be missing your point.
- Chunk

The thing I have noticed about the Hawks especially on defense is a real lack of structure especially for a young team with very little chemistry playing together. Is that on Colliton, the players, or a combination of both? I am also beginning to think the Hawks over hyped Mitchell kind of like they did with Sikura. I hope not but....

I don't see the upside continuing with Z, Murphy and deHaan

Keith unfortunately age is catching up to him

Stillman, Kalynuk, Mitchell and Boqvist all showing promise but are green

If we couldn't win and we had Carolina top 4 dmen then....
- BetweenTheDots

All true - but not relevant to the decision on Collitan
If you think he's the leader we need - let us know?

Bickell was putting up similar numbers to Tom Wilson at the time of their new contracts. Bickell got 4X $4 on a contract that started in 2013. Wilson got 6X $5.16 on a contract that started in 2018 and Bickell was not a total pud.

The trade sucks now. At the time, Stan NEEDED to get rid of a contract and TT was good but underwhelming. Stan ended up wrong on that one. You can't just take the situation out of the transactions.
- Chunk

I was mistaken on which year that Bickell deal was signed. Had it in my head it was after the 13-14 season, not the 12-13 one.

We are vehemently agreeing with each other on every point here except one. You state that Colliton hasn't made any (or at least hasn't shown the ability to) make in game adjustments. What would those adjustments be? How would you determine that he HAS made an adjustment that worked?
- Chunk

So here is my bottom line, which I have stated several times:

He hasn’t proven to me that he can be a coach of a Cup-contender in the NHL.

Maybe to you and the rest of the hockey world he has, maybe I’m completely wrong, but he hasn’t proven it one way or the other.

Two-and-one-half seasons without a real playoff finish - bad players to coach, certainly, teams that SHOULDN’T have made the tournament - not his fault, OK.

But my belief is that he hasn’t proven that he can coach a Cup-contender - or that he can’t. Not enough evidence.

So this “kid” isn’t bashing him, hasn’t bashed him (criticized, yes, not bashed), hasn’t called for his head (like many others here) - just not ready to give him a 10-year contract confident that he’s the guy.

In 2 1/2 seasons (considering this as a full season), you go to one 5-game series to counter an argument? A series that (under normal circumstances) they wouldn’t have played well enough to get into?

OK - he coached well, his players played well.
- StLBravesFan

I don't understand JCs defense, but I'm not going to poop on him until he gets some actual NHL dmen, watching Z, deHaan, Murphy, is so frustrating and their record would of been even worse if Lanky didn't stand on his head, unfortunately like many inexperienced goalies they get on their knees earlier and earlier as the season goes on and the forwards start hitting the bigger net from further out

You can minimize the Oilers series but that was a playoff series

Bad players would play good is the only thing I can think of these posts mean?
- rpeters01

Why don’t you learn how to read for comprehension: it’s a useful skill.

Or would you rather just give things your own interpretation?

I’m guessing the last sentence is true.

We can pretend that's true.
- I Am The Breadman

He is a failure ! I would take Mark Crawford over our current failure of a coach Mr. Roger's.