Marner for Brown plus 2 unprotected 1st and that gets the neg going
- senstroll

Marner for Chabot and Brannstrom

He's had a lot less opportunity too. This is after you disregard the idea that 3 goals in his last 11 playoff games is actually quite an improvement on 0 for last 18.
- joel878

Marner is not a goal scorer...but he should have a couple of goals in 18 games.
But he still has like 12 points in those 18 games

I was hoping this place would have settled down a bit by now, but nope. Still wild. Some of these takes are awful.
- UsernameUnknown

Welcome to the leafs off season.

I was hoping this place would have settled down a bit by now, but nope. Still wild. Some of these takes are awful.
- UsernameUnknown

Another whole summer of whining about cap hits. “Is he any good?” I don’t know I haven’t seen his cap hit.

Marner is not a goal scorer...but he should have a couple of goals in 18 games.
But he still has like 12 points in those 18 games
- Fakepartofme

There's "not being a goal scorer" and there's "I can't score a goal to save my life."

Marner is not a goal scorer...but he should have a couple of goals in 18 games.
But he still has like 12 points in those 18 games
- Fakepartofme

the problem is, he is getting worse each playoffs.. he looked terrible this year, bobbling and coughing up pucks, timid, scared, weak...couldn't handle the pressure as the game got tougher. ..all of it

Another whole summer of whining about cap hits. “Is he any good?” I don’t know I haven’t seen his cap hit.
- shack67

Shiny new toyitis

Does not make sense to try and move Marner for equivalent salary coming back. The only way it works is for the Leafs is if they can create cap space to acquire a top 4 Dman and goaltender.

Still think the best play is to try and convince Melnyk on the merits of taking Marner even up for Connor Brown ($3.6m. cap). I believe you could get Melnyk to agree to the deal once the Leafs pay out the bonus Marner is due in July.
- spatso

and the Sens 1st round pick will be needed

or
shut the front door.

Marner is not a goal scorer...but he should have a couple of goals in 18 games.
But he still has like 12 points in those 18 games
- Fakepartofme

I admittedly do not put much stock in his assist totals. It comes back to opportunity for me and the belief that a 4-5 million dollar winger is going to be capable of producing the same totals with that opportunity.

It's the proven drop-off from regular season to playoffs which speaks loudest for me. It may be acceptable at a lower dollar value, but at the 7th highest cap hit in the entire league it's not.

I also believe that 32 career playoff games is a decent enough sample period to know what we can expect going forward.

His output when it counts factored against cap hit is a hindrance and you have to spend your money better if you want to win a cup in this league 🤷🏻‍♂️

There's "not being a goal scorer" and there's "I can't score a goal to save my life."
- AdamFrench

This. Top line PP lock, couldn't lose those minutes if he was trying to... and can't put one puck in the net on the PP over the course of an entire season. At the 7th highest cap hit in the sport.

Not going to cut it.

Marner for Brown plus 2 unprotected 1st and that gets the neg going
- senstroll

There are very few teams willing to take on Marner's cap hit. Hard for Leafs to do a deal where it works for the other team.

and the Sens 1st round pick will be needed

or
shut the front door.
- dmnted

You won't get a 1st from the Sens, but they do have an extra 2nd. If the Leafs got a 2nd from the Sens, they might flip it to Carolina to acquire negotiation rights for Dougie Hamilton.

There are very few teams willing to take on Marner's cap hit. Hard for Leafs to do a deal where it works for the other team.
- spatso

thanks for the super helpful insight...they are not trading him for conor (frank)ing brown

There are very few teams willing to take on Marner's cap hit. Hard for Leafs to do a deal where it works for the other team.
- spatso

We have enough money with Tatarrrrrrrrr leaving and Drouin most likely gone next year. We'll take Mitch! Make him go full evil traitor!

There are very few teams willing to take on Marner's cap hit. Hard for Leafs to do a deal where it works for the other team.
- spatso

This is where stupid people out themselves.

The LA's and Anaheims of the league that aren't worried about going deep into the playoffs and are just concerned with building a marketable team and taking that step towards playoff contention would jizz all over themselves to take Marner and his cap hit.

Not to mention no trade in the league is going to be made with 11 million going one way and zero million going the other.

It's genuinely as stupid as saying no team in the league would touch McDavid because fitting his salary would be impossible. When you're young and talented and marketable teams will do anything to make the money work.

This. Top line PP lock, couldn't lose those minutes if he was trying to... and can't put one puck in the net on the PP over the course of an entire season. At the 7th highest cap hit in the sport.

Not going to cut it.
- joel878

I don't give a single heck about Marners goal total. Fake is right, he's not much of a scorer. I'm not saying he didn't suck, and I'm not saying he isn't overpaid, because those are seperate issues, but if Marner had 0 goals and 10 assists in those 7 games and moved on to round two, nobody is complaining.

There's been nobody in here for the past 2+ weeks saying 1 goal in 7 games is good enough for the goddamn Rocket Richard winner. People are too scared but I don't care. He played better than Marner, but I dont care. Get (frank)ed. Marner and Matthews dragged each other down. If Matthews scores, Marner gets points. Then everybody is happy. Neither should need the other given their cap hits, which I'm well aware of, but plucking Marner as the only scapegoat is crazy.

thanks for the super helpful insight...they are not trading him for conor (frank)ing brown
- senstroll

Connor Brown.. *and a second*

thanks for the super helpful insight...they are not trading him for conor (frank)ing brown
- senstroll

Leafs are in tough. But, in the end, you have to hold your nose and pull the trigger. It has to be done. There is not a perfect solution.

I don't give a single heck about Marners goal total. Fake is right, he's not much of a scorer. I'm not saying he didn't suck, and I'm not saying he isn't overpaid, because those are seperate issues, but if Marner had 0 goals and 10 assists in those 7 games and moved on to round two, nobody is complaining.

There's been nobody in here for the past 2+ weeks saying 1 goal in 7 games is good enough for the goddamn Rocket Richard winner. People are too scared but I don't care. He played better than Marner, but I dont care. Get (frank)ed. Marner and Matthews dragged each other down. If Matthews scores, Marner gets points. Then everybody is happy. Neither should need the other given their cap hits, which I'm well aware of, but plucking Marner as the only scapegoat is crazy.
- UsernameUnknown

The difference is Matthews was noticeable, he was putting pucks on net, he was hitting, he was generating offence. He literally hit the post more times than Marner did.. Well... Anything.

And he did this despite Marner absolutely killing any offensive drive by relentlessly turning the puck over or making some ridiculous junior league play.

Their shortcomings are not in the same department.

The difference is Matthews was noticeable, he was putting pucks on net, he was hitting, he was generating offence. He literally hit the post more times than Marner did.. Well... Anything.

And he did this despite Marner absolutely killing any offensive drive by relentlessly turning the puck over or making some ridiculous junior league play.

Their shortcomings are not in the same department.
- joel878

So, you could warm up to the idea of Connor Brown plus a 2nd for Marner?

So, you could warm up to the idea of Connor Brown plus a 2nd for Marner?
- spatso

Wow.

I've seen lowball offers before.

But WOW.

The difference is Matthews was noticeable, he was putting pucks on net, he was hitting, he was generating offence. He literally hit the post more times than Marner did.. Well... Anything.

And he did this despite Marner absolutely killing any offensive drive by relentlessly turning the puck over or making some ridiculous junior league play.

Their shortcomings are not in the same department.
- joel878

They absolutely are. 1 goal, 5 points, 0 goals 4 points.

Matthews makes enough money that he should be expected to score no matter who's on his wing. A Céline Dion cutout would get 30 points next to McD or Crosby. Matthews makes the big bucks and is expected to produce at a high level at all times. He didn't. The "Marner dragged him down" excuse is absolute trash. I'm not even saying Marner didn't, I'm saying Matthews is supposed to be good enough where that shouldn't happen. But nobody is prepared to say he didn't get the job done either.

How many years in a row is he playing through an injury before he's just not very good?

That logic wasn't valid with Andersen I don't see why it's valid here.
- joel878

Andersen played through an injury this year not last year.

Wow.

I've seen lowball offers before.

But WOW.
- Scabeh

I am making the assumption the Leafs will flip the Sens 2nd to Carolina to acquire negotiation rights for Dougie Hamilton.

Because I decided recent performances were more of an indicator than what volume they both produced as essentially rookies.

But okay, let's look at the full picture then. We pay Marner a hair under 11 million per season for 5 playoff goals in 32 career games. Wow... That's so much better than 3 goals in 15. 🤦🏻‍♂️

Some astounding analysis there thanks for that.
- joel878

25 points in 32 games

5 points in 15 games