True, it was weird to see the TSN draft tracker where under Arizona it was Ghost and picks and under the Flyers it said "nothing"

You think this will motivate Ghost this coming season after seeing that?
- jd250

I actually think Ghost's offensive numbers will rise, but overall that team is in disarray and his decision making is going to have a giant spotlight on them.

True, it was weird to see the TSN draft tracker where under Arizona it was Ghost and picks and under the Flyers it said "nothing"

You think this will motivate Ghost this coming season after seeing that?
- jd250

I think Ghost will be fine and have a solid year. Then all the Ghost "fans" will come out of the wood work ripping the flyers. He had to go simple as that really. Same with Bobby.

What Bill described: hard to play against, will stick up for skill teammates, etc., seems to me to be frankly Maroon/Luke Schenn/Ryan Reaves/Gudas territory.

If he is so hard to play against, and has such an effect on the game, why is he getting lit up when he is on the ice?
- PT21

Because he plays for a sh*t team, in fact a team that has been a steaming pile of turd ever since he was drafted. RR is far better than the players you list above, and is slotted perfectly on the Flyers.

But surely though, those facts mean something. Instead of focusing on what it is not, why not look at what it is?

After all, many things not visible to the eye in hockey can be captured by stats. Else, a guy like Eric Tulsa, a Ph.D in Chemistry from Berkeley with no hockey background, would not be the Assistant GM (and rumored to be the next GM) for the Canes. It would not be the case that possession stats like Fenwick would be more predictive of success than even regular season records (Both the Blues of 18-19 and the LA Kings of 11-12 were in the top 5). The surprising Habs team this year was #2 or #3.

If we agree that Risto's advanced stats mean something, tell me, what do they mean? Because they are outlandishly bad.
- PT21

The problem is that you aren't open minded and aren't open to the possibility that Ristolianen's numbers weren't dragged down due to the team he played on. You refuse to accept that the numbers aren't individual player numbers. They're team numbers.

If the numbers we have available to us as fans, were so good, teams wouldn't need to spend money on an analytics department. Why do you think they do?

If we agree that Risto's advanced stats mean something, tell me, what do they mean? Because they are outlandishly bad.
- PT21

ok, we get it, you think hes bad. Not sure how many times you have to post you think he is bad. Are you trying to convince other people or just trying to be repetitive? I will hold judgement until i see him play on the team in a new role

I just hope the head coach doesnt try to neuter Risto is all. Also hope they give him a look on the pp though I will not count on it.

At this point I can't see Chuck needing or wanting to move JVR. I am sure there are several teams that would want JVR, given what we saw with other recent trades across the league. But at this point, I think JVR is on the team. CF has the cap space he needs now to sign a goalie, Morin, a PK depth forward (Coleman maybe?) and extend Hart and Sanheim. I would be surprised if there were any other major moves.
- jd250

Did you see what Goodrow got? What do you think Coleman is getting? Is Coleman going to play on the 4th line.

I like the moves for the short term as the team seems to appear to be stronger on paper for next year. They have more guys who you can assume what you are going to get from and less that you dont know. Gave up on some young players, Myers..Hagg..who were bad last year like rest of team but solid year before. Paid the piper in the GHOST and Risto moves. Had to do something to change the locker room and love the Jake move. Giving up 1st..2nd..Myers..Hagg and even Patrick to a degree risky but have to give to get. At this point scary to be paying Risto 6.5M next year on new deal and if the dont resign him then they really lost big time on that deal. Short term better team..long term we will see
- hfc355

Keep in mind if they don't re-sign him he will be very enticing to teams at the TDL, especially if a team loses a dman.

I would rather see him play as a Flyer before any decision is made about a contract extension. I don't see him getting paid more or the same as Provorov or Ellis, it just won't happen.

I am trying nowadays. Not easy in these parts.

Re Risto: Price was bloody stiff though!!
- PT21

Ya ... we should have blown it up and drafted Berniers, Power and Cassa in the first round, then the cup would have been ours!! Get real!

Really? What makes you so sure none are a female?
- hello it's me 2050

The 3 of them who I addressed? One is called Mikey, another drools over Taryn Hatcher in a very male way, and a 3rd has said so.

I am trying nowadays. Not easy in these parts.

Re Risto: Price was bloody stiff though!!
- PT21

Well, I have a self imposed rule. I never take anything personally and only try to engage in conversation about hockey hoping to learn about the team I love and maybe contribute. Haha.

Was it though? The team is close to moving into irrelevancy and we gave up a first but not too 5 in what is generally recognized as being a weak draft that’s more of a crap shoot than normal.

Further, we’ve been in stockpile picks mode for what 7 years now? I think we can afford to give up one pick due to the prevailing conditions I mention above.

Did you see what Goodrow got? What do you think Coleman is getting? Is Coleman going to play on the 4th line.
- MJL

Yes, that's true. I wasn't expecting Coleman to play on the 4th line, I was thinking anywhere in the bottom 6. We'll see who Fletcher is targeting soon enough. Seems like he is getting what he wants this off season.

Bill any idea why the GM didnt try for a Reinhart and Risto package seeing what he was dealt to florida for? Did they try?

I just hope the head coach doesnt try to neuter Risto is all. Also hope they give him a look on the pp though I will not count on it.
- hello it's me 2050

If the Flyers re-sign Morin I am curious to see how the dynamic is with Risto and Sam in the lineup at the same time. I really don't want Morin to be "he's only there to fight" guy, but having that presence could be good, especially when Risto is getting physical and Konecny is yapping.

I think Ghost will be fine and have a solid year. Then all the Ghost "fans" will come out of the wood work ripping the flyers. He had to go simple as that really. Same with Bobby.
- hello it's me 2050

I hope both do really wel except against us.

I’ve met Jake before in person and seems like a great guy.

The 3 of them who I addressed? One is called Mikey, another drools over Taryn Hatcher in a very male way, and a 3rd has said so.
- PT21

Please explain.

Sorry, I 1000% disagree with you on that latter point. CF just created a real window for this team to compete for the cup, similar to what Homer did back in 2007. I don't understand what he gave up that you think would damage their path to being a true contender?? What .. Myers? Hagg? The 13th pick?? Really?

CF just got rid of our worst players and replaced them with really good hockey players that can play for this team at a high level for another 3-5 years. That is the definition of a path to the Cup!
- jd250

Yes, really first round and 2nd round picks have more potential to drive this team to being a contender than the moves he made recently. Here you go again, devaluing draft picks in order to justify the moves. Which I will remind you of the next time you criticize a team for doing the same.

What could possibly elevate this team to a Cup team would be if Hart rapidly escalates to becoming a top NHL goaltender. Or if a player like Frost or York turns out to be more than projected. Otherwise the most likely outcome is a team that is not good enough and now has aging players signed to high contracts that have declined such as Hayes, Ellis, Ristolainen and Atkinson.

Keep in mind if they don't re-sign him he will be very enticing to teams at the TDL, especially if a team loses a dman.

I would rather see him play as a Flyer before any decision is made about a contract extension. I don't see him getting paid more or the same as Provorov or Ellis, it just won't happen.
- Glak18

If the flyers are even sniffing the playoffs Risto will not be traded.

I thought Bill's and your responses were spot on. That was one thing that I noticed as well, PT21 is so caught up on the possession metric that he failed to see in the same chart that RR had played the most minutes on the Buffalo defense. For a player who supposedly stinks, he seemed to play an awful lot of hockey last year, even with his Covid issues. RR is a good player and he is exactly what this Flyers backend needed!
- jd250

That chart was play against "elite competition," not TOI overall.

I mean, all I did was say so, in my blurb, and in the chart. Of course you would miss it.

I don't particularly want to argue with guys like you, whose logic largely consists of "this is the way I see it and it is correct because this is the way I see it," but for others a little less dogmatic and little more keen-sighted, the entire point of that chart was that while Risto has played the most against elite competition, others have not played as poorly as he did when they did so, not even close.

To answer why he has played more mins while playing poorly: there are several explanations: Bad coaching. Line matchups. That the numbers don't reflect underlying play, and so on.

Yes, really first round and 2nd round picks have more potential to drive this team to being a contender than the moves he made recently. Here you go again, devaluing draft picks in order to justify the moves. Which I will remind you of the next time you criticize a team for doing the same.

What could possibly elevate this team to a Cup team would be if Hart rapidly escalates to becoming a top NHL goaltender. Or if a player like Frost or York turns out to be more than projected. Otherwise the most likely outcome is a team that is not good enough and now has aging players signed to high contracts that have declined such as Hayes, Ellis, Ristolainen and Atkinson.
- MJL

Here you go again over valuing them again. Equal chance getting the next Rubstov, Labarge, or ginning or an nh player. Love "potential".

So the Flyers trade youth and multiple high draft picks for players to win now and you say it now makes sense to trade Couturier?

- MJL

Just can’t make this stuff up. 🤦‍♂️

Please explain.
- hello it's me 2050

Out of control salivating about skin display.

Keep in mind if they don't re-sign him he will be very enticing to teams at the TDL, especially if a team loses a dman.

I would rather see him play as a Flyer before any decision is made about a contract extension. I don't see him getting paid more or the same as Provorov or Ellis, it just won't happen.
- Glak18

If they dont resign him Flyers will be lucky to get a 2nd for him. Nowhere near what they paid for him. He isnt going to take a pay cut to stay here no matter how he plays. Will be north of 6M for sure.

Keep in mind if they don't re-sign him he will be very enticing to teams at the TDL, especially if a team loses a dman.

I would rather see him play as a Flyer before any decision is made about a contract extension. I don't see him getting paid more or the same as Provorov or Ellis, it just won't happen.
- Glak18

Two things. The Flyers would trade him at the deadline if they're in a playoff spot? If they aren't in a playoff spot, then the moves are a disaster.

Yes, that's true. I wasn't expecting Coleman to play on the 4th line, I was thinking anywhere in the bottom 6. We'll see who Fletcher is targeting soon enough. Seems like he is getting what he wants this off season.
- jd250

Look at the Flyers forwards. Who is coming out to make room for Coleman on the 3rd line?