Location: 1st rd exit is the new normal, ON Joined: 08.11.2011
Sep 29 @ 9:40 AM ET
Oh, I'm aware! I just mean that in terms of general effectiveness, Marner expends a lot of energy in the defensive zone at 5v5 accomplishing little. I don't feel he flushes the puck, wins battles or forces the play. Often times he's out of position as the right winger because he's chasing the play when he should be supporting his defensemen on the wall (that said it could be Keefe's D-zone system). I'm not saying Willy is much better, but I don't mistake his defensive inaction of not caring - it's what you're supposed to do when you're the supporting winger on the wall to enable a breakout.
For the record, when I commented that Willy was getting better, last year - especially later in the year - he was getting back in the D-zone in a timely fashion when he was the high forward. He was applying appropriate backchecking and even retrieving pucks. Again, because he has always done it so infrequently or so poorly, it's more noticeable when he DOES it. He'll need to do it consistently in order to change opinions. - Monkeypunk
the defensive responsibilities of the wingers, should be to cover the blueline and to provide puck support at the half wall.
Marner and Nylander both are guilty of the 'fly-by' but there was noticeable improvement by Nylander late in the season and the playoffs.. I hope, he continues that from last season and is more consistent.
the defensive responsibilities of the wingers, should be to cover the blueline and to provide puck support at the half wall.
Marner and Nylander both are guilty of the 'fly-by' but there was noticeable improvement by Nylander late in the season and the playoffs.. I hope, he continues that from last season and is more consistent. - PatC80
Location: Whenever, wherever, ON Joined: 06.27.2013
Sep 29 @ 9:46 AM ET
He's not good on the 24th best penalty kill. - bobbyisno1
Marner does his job on the PK very well. In terms of Shots Against / 60 you have Hagelin, Marner, Atkinson, Dowd, Staal . . . in that order. Marner is the second best forward at shot suppression on the penalty kill.
I'd surmise a lot of that has to do with many PP shots being generated from the point, and Marner's presence as the high PK forward dissuades teams from high shots.
Marner's Goals Against / 60 is 21st. Not top-5, but still not too shabby, and it's team leading among forwards. In fact, the expected Goals Against / 60 for Marner is first among all NHL forwards. It basically throws the goalie under the bus for not making saves he's expected to.
What I thought I'd see is a higher High Danger chance rate because Marner would force the play down-low into the home plate area, but that doesn't happen. He also the 2nd best High Danger chance against rate in the league among forwards.
So when he's out on the PK, he's effective. Very effective.
In terms of comparing defensive capabilities - there's no way Nylander would do that! Marner has quick acceleration and a quick stick. It makes him good for short-handed play because teams end up playing in more static positions and he can burst from point to point to bumper position fairly well and keep his stick going.
Semien is unlikely to sign....as the Jays may ensure they sign Ray instead.
Im hoping both resign...but unlikely. We'll see.
Back to back MVP caliber seasons could happen, but if he's is even better next season?
Wow.
Hard to replicate - Fakepartofme
Factor in a better/healthier year for Springer and some steps forward for Bo and maybe the young catchers. I think the bats can be close without Semien.
Location: I'm excited to see that Joined: 08.28.2010
Sep 29 @ 9:50 AM ET
Marner does his job on the PK very well. In terms of Shots Against / 60 you have Hagelin, Marner, Atkinson, Dowd, Staal . . . in that order. Marner is the second best forward at shot suppression on the penalty kill.
I'd surmise a lot of that has to do with many PP shots being generated from the point, and Marner's presence as the high PK forward dissuades teams from high shots.
Marner's Goals Against / 60 is 21st. Not top-5, but still not too shabby, and it's team leading among forwards. In fact, the expected Goals Against / 60 for Marner is first among all NHL forwards. It basically throws the goalie under the bus for not making saves he's expected to.
What I thought I'd see is a higher High Danger chance rate because Marner would force the play down-low into the home plate area, but that doesn't happen. He also the 2nd best High Danger chance against rate in the league among forwards.
So when he's out on the PK, he's effective. Very effective.
In terms of comparing defensive capabilities - there's no way Nylander would do that! Marner has quick acceleration and a quick stick. It makes him good for short-handed play because teams end up playing in more static positions and he can burst from point to point to bumper position fairly well and keep his stick going. - Monkeypunk
Those fancy stats, the one stat that is most important doesn't mean a thing.
But, that penalty kill has to be better.
Marner does his job on the PK very well. In terms of Shots Against / 60 you have Hagelin, Marner, Atkinson, Dowd, Staal . . . in that order. Marner is the second best forward at shot suppression on the penalty kill.
I'd surmise a lot of that has to do with many PP shots being generated from the point, and Marner's presence as the high PK forward dissuades teams from high shots.
Marner's Goals Against / 60 is 21st. Not top-5, but still not too shabby, and it's team leading among forwards. In fact, the expected Goals Against / 60 for Marner is first among all NHL forwards. It basically throws the goalie under the bus for not making saves he's expected to.
What I thought I'd see is a higher High Danger chance rate because Marner would force the play down-low into the home plate area, but that doesn't happen. He also the 2nd best High Danger chance against rate in the league among forwards.
So when he's out on the PK, he's effective. Very effective.
In terms of comparing defensive capabilities - there's no way Nylander would do that! Marner has quick acceleration and a quick stick. It makes him good for short-handed play because teams end up playing in more static positions and he can burst from point to point to bumper position fairly well and keep his stick going. - Monkeypunk
Isn't the simpliest evidence that Keefe trusts Marner late in games with leads and in those, and similar, situations more often than Willie. Marner's shut down defensive game is much better than Willies.
But, Willie is a very good top 6 forward on every team. Whoever suggests otherwise is sniffin' glue.
Yes he's a "floater" - he likes to watch the puck and use his brain more than he likes diving in without thinking. Lots of skill guys are guilty of that.
His shot is elite ...needs to use it more. Floats and stings ...lets call him Ali.
Factor in a better/healthier year for Springer and some steps forward for Bo and maybe the young catchers. I think the bats can be close without Semien.
Pitching needs some work if they lose Ray. - The Law
I wouldnt shut the door 100% on Semien, could sign back with the Jays....even if its a small chance.
Hitting in front of Vlad for the next few years has to be enticing.
but also get 2 or 3 elite relivers, cant mess around with that again
I wouldnt shut the door 100% on Semien, could sign back with the Jays....even if its a small chance.
Hitting in front of Vlad for the next few years has to be enticing.
but also get 2 or 3 elite relivers, cant mess around with that again - senstroll
I heard him the other day say that he still considers himself a SS. I just think some team will agree and pay him 6 x 25 and let him play SS. Hopefully not the Yankees.
Location: Whenever, wherever, ON Joined: 06.27.2013
Sep 29 @ 10:04 AM ET
Those fancy stats, the one stat that is most important doesn't mean a thing.
But, that penalty kill has to be better. - bobbyisno1
It does. But Marner isn't the problem with it. Hyman was not effective on the PK last year, and having guys like Spezza and Kerfoot on your PK is a terrible idea that hopefully we've seen the last of. Especially Spezza. I love me some Spezza, but Christ is he terrible on the PK.
Location: 1st rd exit is the new normal, ON Joined: 08.11.2011
Sep 29 @ 10:05 AM ET
I wouldnt shut the door 100% on Semien, could sign back with the Jays....even if its a small chance.
Hitting in front of Vlad for the next few years has to be enticing.
but also get 2 or 3 elite relivers, cant mess around with that again - senstroll
The bats should still be ok... Hernandez, Vladdy, Bo, and Springer... Gurriel is no slouch either.
Defensively, they could use Espinal at 2B but his bat is no where near as good as Semien..
Who knows, maybe Cavan Biggio has a comeback year next season?
Location: We’re Too Old, Boston Joined: 04.03.2013
Sep 29 @ 10:07 AM ET
The bats should still be ok... Hernandez, Vladdy, Bo, and Springer... Gurriel is no slouch either. Defensively, they could use Espinal at 2B but his bat is no where near as good as Semien..
Who knows, maybe Cavan Biggio has a comeback year next season? - PatC80
Location: 1st rd exit is the new normal, ON Joined: 08.11.2011
Sep 29 @ 10:07 AM ET
It does. But Marner isn't the problem with it. Hyman was not effective on the PK last year, and having guys like Spezza and Kerfoot on your PK is a terrible idea that hopefully we've seen the last of. Especially Spezza. I love me some Spezza, but Christ is he terrible on the PK. - Monkeypunk
I wouldn't be surprised if Matthews got some PK time.
Kerfoot and Marner will probably be the first two forwards out on the PK, but after that maybe Matthews and Mikheyev, or Engvall?
