I would think everyone here follows hockey enough to know Lehner is incredibly unreliable and at this point he comes off as being kind of an idiot.

Lehner, Eichel, Patrick and the rest all had votes in the most recent CBA. If they had concerns in their ability to file grievances and have recourse should there be an issue, they could have done something about it. Also they pay agents and money back to the Players Association to represent them.

The Flyers were incredibly patient and professional with Patrick.

The NHL has been sensitive with Lehner’s personal battles and have given him a number of chances. Chances other industries would not have provided.

When his play tails off or other issues arise and you better believe for whatever reason his play will tail off, he will then decide Vegas also takes advantage of their players.

There is no way I would have given this guy 5 mill and shipped out Fleury. Ridiculous mistake and I can guarantee you some folks in the Vegas front office feel the same way today.

Also there is nothing different or unique about Eichels injury situation. Players and teams disagree all the time. They should have pushed for more terms in the CBA focusing on this. Guess they didn’t. Oh well. They are all welcome to go out and get real jobs..

Just another example of a spoiled brat athlete who gets a backbone after they sign a big contract.
- Joe Nardone

I read yesterday he had a problem in Buffalo with a high ankle sprain that the team handled badly. Maybe the treatment was bad (drugs) ?
- Angus4444

Nah, I just thought he made that reference to his experience with Buffalo’s medical staff because of Buffalo’s current medical stance on Eichel’s situation.

There is no way I would have given this guy 5 mill and shipped out Fleury. Ridiculous mistake and I can guarantee you some folks in the Vegas front office feel the same way today.
- Joe Nardone

With as well as Vegas has done from the moment they conducted their expansion draft this move is still very puzzling to me. I understand that MAF is getting older and they had to start thinking about the future but bailing on him and hanging their hat on Lehner seems like a very poor decision.

NHL starting a new deal with ESPN and a week before the season this guy is making major waves, can’t make it up. I don’t disagree about the Eichel stuff , the league needs to step in there, it’s dragged on long enough.
- ClaudeFather

It is in the NHLPA contract that the team has final surgery say. What can the league do?

I agree with you. I thought it was just coach speak..."gotta do a better job" kind of thing... "got to work harder"
- Dkos

well Hart just may be a sensitive soul. Cant hurt his feelings. Did he ever hire back his BFF therapist?

Work smarter not harder. Don't think Harts work ethic has ever been questioned.

This is correct.


The thing that is really weird from my point of view is that the disc replacement surgery is a much better option for Eichel and by proxy for the team. Fusion permanently limits range of motion and you almost always require more surgery after. The disc replacement allows for more range of motion and usually doesn't require more surgery down the line.

Its "experimental" only in that its never been done on a professional hockey player.
- MBFlyerfan

I understand it may be experimental, but think about it, people and athletes are getting hip and knee replacements all the time and swear by it. I know a tennis player that has replaced his hip and is playing pain free right now and playing well. If the technology is there and proven, not sure what the problem is. What is the downside if the procedure doesn't go well, Eichel doesn't play hockey? He is not playing hockey now and we know from plenty of experience hockey players who get their vertebrae fused never come back the same player. I think the Sabres have screwed the pooch on this one!

Lehner definitely made some good points on the NHLPA and the lack of support for Eichel from his peers in the league. Also made a great point mentioning if it was yourself in this situation you’d want the support from fellow NHL players.
- arichardson22

The players agreed to a contract. What support is he looking for? To change the current NHLPA deal?

It is in the NHLPA contract that the team has final surgery say. What can the league do?
- hello it's me 2050

I totally get that but why wouldn’t the employer try to get involved when clearly jack and his camp are saying we are not going to get the surgery they are recommending. Is this just going to be a stand still for the rest of his career? It’s dragged on long enough.

How are they going to support him. It's in the CBA negotiated by the NHLPA that the team has final say in medical procedures.
- MJL

This is what people are missing. Not saying it is right or wrong. This is what they agreed to.

I understand it may be experimental, but think about it, people and athletes are getting hip and knee replacements all the time and swear by it. I know a tennis player that has replaced his hip and is playing pain free right now and playing well. If the technology is there and proven, not sure what the problem is. What is the downside if the procedure doesn't go well, Eichel doesn't play hockey? He is not playing hockey now and we know from plenty of experience hockey players who get their vertebrae fused never come back the same player. I think the Sabres have screwed the pooch on this one!
- jd250

My point that you missed was that it really isn't experimental anymore.

I totally get that but why wouldn’t the employer try to get involved when clearly jack and his camp are saying we are not going to get the surgery they are recommending. Is this just going to be a stand still for the rest of his career? It’s dragged on long enough.
- ClaudeFather

I would guess they have and will not make it public is all. They cant choose sides so to speak publicly.

well Hart just may be a sensitive soul. Cant hurt his feelings. Did he ever hire back his BFF therapist?

Work smarter not harder. Don't think Harts work ethic has ever been questioned.
- hello it's me 2050

One doesn’t become a NHL goalie without the ability to take criticism. Stop projecting.

AV referenced expectations of practice habits along with the work harder and better. Again, with hardly any practice available, it makes no sense. The break was a really good thing to actually provide that time though. Just poorly worded communication, not a big deal in itself.

To repeat, AV says nice things about Hart also.

I would guess they have and will not make it public is all. They cant choose sides so to speak publicly.
- hello it's me 2050

True, would have thought they could have moved it forward to a resolution though. Just an odd scenario.

True, would have thought they could have moved it forward to a resolution though. Just an odd scenario.
- ClaudeFather

They know buffalo is a poop show. I believe they are doing everything in their power behind the scenes to get this resolved.

One doesn’t become a NHL goalie without the ability to take criticism. Stop projecting.

AV referenced expectations of practice habits along with the work harder and better. Again, with hardly any practice available, it makes no sense. The break was a really good thing to actually provide that time though. Just poorly worded communication, not a big deal in itself.

To repeat, AV says nice things about Hart also.
- NC Flyers Fan

the work harder is just an archaic saying guys like AV use..

My point that you missed was that it really isn't experimental anymore.
- MBFlyerfan

Agreed these medical advances are nothing new so one wound think the NHLPA would have ensured they can leverage these procedures when negotiating the new CBA.

Yes, I didn't realize this point, and its somewhat horrifying to me. I don't believe anyone should make medical decisions for a human being, not a government, and certainly not a hockey organization. I understand the implications given the team has invested heavily in the player, and I certainly think the team should have inputs on what should occur, but ultimately it should be the player that makes the call. It doesn't sound to me like Eichel is being unreasonable in this instance, he wants to replace his disk with an artificial one, which as I understand would be less recovery time and no need for future surgeries, whereas fusing the vertebrae would be 6 months and most likely future procedures. If I were Eichel I would opt for the new technology.
- jd250

I honestly cannot fathom why the NHLPA agreed to that.

I understand that’s what the NHLPA agreed to, but this situation seems more unique than any injury in recent years. While the injury/surgery is the core issue, it also seems it’s deeper and there’s bad blood between Sabres and Jack.
- arichardson22

Eichel wants to win and he wants the surgery he wants.

It’s honestly bothersome all the support AV has shown for Carter is just being ignored entirely. Are we also forgetting Hart’s great season under AV’s first year of coaching? So many times AV mentioned this is just a young goalie going through adversity that ALL young goalies go through in the NHL. That Carter will learn from this and get better. It’s comical. Do you really think Hart would have signed an extension here if AV was so horrible?
- arichardson22

I have no problem with AV calling out Hart but as far as Hart signing a contract here he had no other option.

I have no problem with AV calling out Hart but as far as Hart signing a contract here he had no other option.
- hfc355

No other option? Despite his RFA status he could have turned down extensions. Or worse, demand a trade.

it'd be nice if we could be competitive against boston for once

it'd be nice if we could be competitive against boston for once
- 2Real

We competed with them just fine in 19-20.

Lehner is a bi polar drunk. Not sure going to believe what he says until verified elsewhere.
- hello it's me 2050

Real classy calling a guy a bipolar drunk. Guy has a serious medical condition out of his control. Go back in your hole. Dont know why so many people are worked up over what he said. If its false he looks foolish if it's TRUE heads will roll. As far as being a distraction for AV why would it be if it's not true. Just move on to hockey season and let league investigate.

Real classy calling a guy a bipolar drunk. Guy has a serious medical condition out of his control. Go back in your hole. Dont know why so many people are worked up over what he said. If its false he looks foolish if it's TRUE heads will roll. As far as being a distraction for AV why would it be if it's not true. Just move on to hockey season and let league investigate.
- hfc355

I am not worked up in anyway. He is a bi polar drunk.

My point that you missed was that it really isn't experimental anymore.
- MBFlyerfan

I didn't miss it, I was just piling on :-)