No it doesn't because if you do that, then the options are playing either Yandle or one of the kids on the 2nd pairing on the left side. How can you not see that calling up Seeler and hopefully giving him 12 minutes of ice time and hopefully zero PK time is the best available option?
- MJL

keep playing Seeler 12 minutes will eventfully take its toll on the other dman. Cant have one of your dman only playing 12 minutes and expect to be successful.

Why such fear, of inserting one of the kids to play with a veteran in Ristolainen?

If the answer is because you don’t trust Rasmus to help guide a young defenseman it will lead to my next point.

Who forced the team into signing Yandle, when a few games into the season it’s very clear he can’t fill in above a 3rd pairing role even in case of injury.

It’s true, they don’t have an ideal way to insert either York or Zamula, but who was the architect?

One injury in, quite predictably to the most injury prone defenseman and the team is pigeon holed into calling up Seeler?
- FlyerFan3260

You keep mentioning fear which really is a ridiculous word to use in this. It is questionable that either player at this point is ready for full time play in the NHL. With that being said, what makes you think they can handle 2nd pair ice time in the NHL against a quality team? When all of the current options are looked at, it's clear what the best option at this time is. When and if Zamula or York are ready, they should break in on the 3rd pair in place of Yandle playing with Braun. That's proper player development.

I know right? Every team has a viable option to losing a top pair dman long term just waiting in the wings.

Malfeasance I say!
- MBFlyerfan

keep slurping

That 4th line and 3rd D pair is just yuck. 7 years into this rebuild/retool/re whatever and this is the best they can do?

Well on the way to a decade of incompetence, yay team.
- BiggE

Nice job Hexy

Yea, the one stiff is currently playing well and close to 20 minutes a game. Actually playing!

The entire idea of a culture change is one of the more laughable ideas I've ever read on HB. They would've been much better this year had they done nothing! That's how bad last year was. Not much of an accomplishment. Do you know what builds a winning culture more than anything? Winning! You do that by being a good team. The better you get the better the winning culture. To this point of the season, and it is very early, the results from the changes are very underwhelming.
- MJL

not as laughable as your statement.

That 4th line and 3rd D pair is just yuck. 7 years into this rebuild/retool/re whatever and this is the best they can do?

Well on the way to a decade of incompetence, yay team.
- BiggE

on the way? they are already there......They have become an irrelevant franchise and team. Sad.

The PK is at 82.6% and it ranks middle of the pack in the NHL. It is not excellent. It is average.

Scoring chances at 5 on 5 for the game were 31-18 in favor of Dallas. High danger chances were 13-7 in favor of Dallas. That's 7 for the entire game for the Flyers.
- MJL

They're ranked dead last in team expected goals against per 60 on the PK. Bottom three in scoring chances against /60 and high danger chances against /60. They're doing terribly on the PK. Worse than last season.

Only thing holding them afloat, ironically, has been the goaltending while SH. From dead last last season to currently sitting 10th in the league in SV%.

This offense really needs to come to life , JVR has become an anchor. Need the top guys to start getting back on the board. Good thing we can count on the fourth line to chip in once every 15 games.

They're ranked dead last in team expected goals against per 60 on the PK. Bottom three in scoring chances against /60 and high danger chances against /60. They're doing terribly on the PK. Worse than last season.

Only thing holding them afloat, ironically, has been the goaltending while SH. From dead last last season to currently sitting 10th in the league in SV%.
- Tomahawk

You can’t say it’s worse than last season, the high danger chance last season was an untouched back door tap in. They have gotten great goaltending for sure but it’s not last season. 5v5 and 5v4

You keep mentioning fear which really is a ridiculous word to use in this. It is questionable that either player at this point is ready for full time play in the NHL. With that being said, what makes you think they can handle 2nd pair ice time in the NHL against a quality team? When all of the current options are looked at, it's clear what the best option at this time is. When and if Zamula or York are ready, they should break in on the 3rd pair in place of Yandle playing with Braun. That's proper player development.
- MJL

yet you female doged about signing Yandel as you wanted York to play. Give me the upside of the 2 rookies, even with the mistakes they will make.

AV will not play these young guys He wants his vets as thinks that will save his job.

They're ranked dead last in team expected goals against per 60 on the PK. Bottom three in scoring chances against /60 and high danger chances against /60. They're doing terribly on the PK. Worse than last season.

Only thing holding them afloat, ironically, has been the goaltending while SH. From dead last last season to currently sitting 10th in the league in SV%.
- Tomahawk

Even not looking at it statistically, there are many, some who claim to have GM level ability who clearly can't see what's actually going on out there. If they get a goaltender injury or have a stretch of lesser goaltending, they're in big trouble. The mix was supposed to have been tweaked. Funny how the qualities of some of the players they traded are the very qualities that they're missing.

You can’t say it’s worse than last season, the high danger chance last season was an untouched back door tap in. They have gotten great goaltending for sure but it’s not last season. 5v5 and 5v4
- ClaudeFather

Those back door chances were certainly memorable, but here are the #'s:

2020-21 PK HDCA/60: 21.28
2021-22 PK HDCA/60: 29.08


Now, we're talking a dozen or so game sample, so it could equalize as the season goes on. But as of today, they're actually much worse than last year on the PK. W/o the improvement in the goaltending, we'd be looking at a bottom-tier unit.

(Just to put the #'s in perspective, Calgary is at 9.91 HDCA/60)

You keep mentioning fear which really is a ridiculous word to use in this. It is questionable that either player at this point is ready for full time play in the NHL. With that being said, what makes you think they can handle 2nd pair ice time in the NHL against a quality team? When all of the current options are looked at, it's clear what the best option at this time is. When and if Zamula or York are ready, they should break in on the 3rd pair in place of Yandle playing with Braun. That's proper player development.
- MJL

They aren’t going to take Yandle’s spot because the coaching staff is likely not to sit a veteran with Ellis already out, you know this. Perhaps if they played York instead of being married to Yandle from game 1, we might have more present day options but that would require a smart plan, something Fletcher isn’t capable of doing.

I’m not going to dwelve into the idea that Zamula or York aren’t ready for some NHL action. They are, if properly supported.

Again, if the Flyers willingly pigeon hole themselves to not allow a call up based on roster construction that’s something they can own.

Nobody with a 100% certainty can say a defense core of Provorov/Sanheim, York/Zamula with Ristolainen, and Yandle/Braun is most definitely worse than the one being trotted out currently.

Deferring to the Flyers on when one of these kids are ready, and more importantly how to handle them is a stance I’d be very weary of taking with what we have seen the past few years.

No, a 2nd pair start is not the way to ideally integrate, but simply throwing the hands into the air while ignoring they put themselves into this position is folly. Doubling down on it even further is something they are about to do.

We will see what the on ice product shows in the next 10 or so games. The Flyers are terrified of inserting any youngster after wrongly attributing last season’s struggles on their inexperience. The moves this off season and initial roster selection easily prove this.

It’s a fearful, cowardly, and antiquated way of thinking.

They aren’t going to take Yandle’s spot because the coaching staff is likely not to sit a veteran with Ellis already out, you know this. Perhaps if they played York instead of being married to Yandle from game 1, we might have more present day options but that would require a smart plan, something Fletcher isn’t capable of doing.

I’m not going to dwelve into the idea that Zamula or York aren’t ready for some NHL action. They are, if properly supported.

Again, if the Flyers willingly pigeon hole themselves to not allow a call up based on roster construction that’s something they can own.

Nobody with a 100% certainty can say a defense core of Provorov/Sanheim, York/Zamula with Ristolainen, and Yandle/Braun is most definitely worse than the one being trotted out currently.

Deferring to the Flyers on when one of these kids are ready, and more importantly how to handle them is a stance I’d be very weary of taking with what we have seen the past few years.

No, a 2nd pair start is not the way to ideally integrate, but simply throwing the hands into the air while ignoring they put themselves into this position is folly. Doubling down on it even further is something they are about to do.

We will see what the on ice product shows in the next 10 or so games. The Flyers are terrified of inserting any youngster after wrongly attributing last season’s struggles on their inexperience. The moves this off season and initial roster selection easily prove this.

It’s a fearful, cowardly, as antiquated way of thinking.
- FlyerFan3260

no worries the GM wil reacquire Hagg. Maybe get Marc Staal

They aren’t going to take Yandle’s spot because the coaching staff is likely not to sit a veteran with Ellis already out, you know this. Perhaps if they played York instead of being married to Yandle from game 1, we might have more present day options but that would require a smart plan, something Fletcher isn’t capable of doing.


- FlyerFan3260

So this supports my opinion for why playing York or Zamula is not currently a good option.

I’m not going to dwelve into the idea that Zamula or York aren’t ready for some NHL action. They are, if properly supported.


- FlyerFan3260

Properly supported would be breaking in on the 3rd pair supported by playing with a vet like Braun. Currently not an option.

Again, if the Flyers willingly pigeon hole themselves to not allow a call up based on roster construction that’s something they can own.

Nobody with a 100% certainty can say a defense core of Provorov/Sanheim, York/Zamula with Ristolainen, and Yandle/Braun is most definitely worse than the one being trotted out currently.


- FlyerFan3260

Nor can anyone say it's better than just calling up Seeler. Why risk putting a young player who is not unquestionably ready for the NHL into that situation?

Deferring to the Flyers on when one of these kids are ready, and more importantly how to handle them is a stance I’d be very weary of taking with what we have seen the past few years.


- FlyerFan3260

Should we instead defer to a fan such as yourself?

No, a 2nd pair start is not the way to ideally integrate, but simply throwing the hands into the air while ignoring they put themselves into this position is folly. Doubling down on it even further is something they are about to do.

We will see what the on ice product shows in the next 10 or so games.
- FlyerFan3260

I guess you can argue somewhat that trading for an injury prone player in Ellis did that. There isn't a team in the league that has a viable replacement ready for a injury to a top pair defenseman. 7th defenseman are what they are.

They have gotten great goaltending for sure but it’s not last season. 5v5 and 5v4
- ClaudeFather

5V5 they are near the bottom in xGA/60, SCA/60 and HDCA/60 as well.

Decent goaltending was covering up a lot of their warts early last season, too. When the bottom fell out of that, the season spiraled out of control. The underlying #'s never lie. They're headed for a similar fate today unless Hart can keep standing on his head, or the team finally turns a corner in their fundamentals.

Do you really believe this?
- hello it's me 2050

Do I believe what?

- our young guys can’t play in the nhl right now, yes. Have you paid attention to the Phantoms this year?

- management and the coach don’t care if you are 20 or 40. If you can help the team you are in. yes

- some fans have a love affair w young players and want them to be played without really looking at all the variables. yes

- The flyers prob knew of Ellis’ issues and still made the trade cause they knew Patrick was damaged goods and Myers was overrated by phila folks and was never going to be a top 4 deman. yes

7th defenseman are what they are.
- MJL

correct that is why you call up your top d prospects to fill in long term...

I’m not going to fellow a argument directly dictated by questions. Control the direction and you control the outcome.

We can disagree, and that is more than fine.

Nobody forced the team to not play York to start the season, or rush out to sign a 3rd pairing defenseman that is clearly cooked, yet a staple in the lineup.

The team is struggling, and it would warrant some creativity to try, and insert one of York/Zamula.

To have such fear in doing so is strange to me. What is the worst that will happen, they will lose a few games? Contenders they are not as presently constructed so that is irrelevant. York or Zamula indeed show they need some more seasoning? The Flyers have shown to be very willing to demote a player so that should not be a worry.

One can continue to trust their assessments, it’s produced success after all? If Hart falters even a little, this house of cards will look even more similar to last season. Perhaps they will call someone up then.

Can someone, anyone out there tell me you have watched Zamula or York this year?

You have been impressed to the point where you think they are ready?

What games?

Do I believe what?

- our young guys can’t play in the nhl right now, yes. Have you paid attention to the Phantoms this year?

- management and the coach don’t care if you are 20 or 40. If you can help the team you are in. yes

- some fans have a love affair w young players and want them to be played without really looking at all the variables. yes

- The flyers prob knew of Ellis’ issues and still made the trade cause they knew Patrick was damaged goods and Myers was overrated by phila folks and was never going to be a top 4 deman. yes
- Joe Nardone

Believe that if they were ready they would called up. Clearly you do. I myself do not. AV loves his vets.

Example being Nate still in the lineup. Yandle playing to keep his streak alive.

Do I believe what?

- our young guys can’t play in the nhl right now, yes. Have you paid attention to the Phantoms this year?

- management and the coach don’t care if you are 20 or 40. If you can help the team you are in. yes

- some fans have a love affair w young players and want them to be played without really looking at all the variables. yes

- The flyers prob knew of Ellis’ issues and still made the trade cause they knew Patrick was damaged goods and Myers was overrated by phila folks and was never going to be a top 4 deman. yes
- Joe Nardone

Agree with all 4.

Can someone, anyone out there tell me you have watched Zamula or York this year?

You have been impressed to the point where you think they are ready?

What games?
- Joe Nardone

York should have been on the team to start the season.

Zamula is the next in line in terms of talent. Playing some sort of game where the talented kids need to absolutely dominate like Purenovich is such a strange strategy.

There is always an element of risk with playing a young player, but it’s time this organization learned to value the payoff more than the risks.

We can continue with the status quo, it’s worked so well after all.

5V5 they are near the bottom in xGA/60, SCA/60 and HDCA/60 as well.

Decent goaltending was covering up a lot of their warts early last season, too. When the bottom fell out of that, the season spiraled out of control. The underlying #'s never lie. They're headed for a similar fate today unless Hart can keep standing on his head, or the team finally turns a corner in their fundamentals.
- Tomahawk

I’m hoping they can start to drive some more offense, I think this forward group has more to give. Lines 1-3 at least....

York should have been on the team to start the season.

Zamula is the next in line in terms of talent. Playing some sort of game where the talented kids need to absolutely dominate like Purenovich is such a strange strategy.

There is always an element of risk with playing a young player, but it’s time this organization learned to value the payoff more than the risks.

We can continue with the status quo, it’s worked so well after all.
- FlyerFan3260

Based on what? Certainly not his play.