im not saying they shouldnt play hurts. the team responds to him and there is a chance he can become something. but exactly, to me curtailing the offense to THIS extent is more win now as opposed to seeing what he can do. I suppose you do want to grow his confidence etc, but at a certain point they need to see him in the pocket 35 times a game to see what he can do. (not to mention needing to see what you have in your receivers, which for having a pretty underwhelming room is comprised of a staggering amount of draft capital)

also, welcome back from wherever you were haha
- stayinthefnnet

Thanks. Just work resuming to normalcy, so I am actually seeing people at work in person. And the inability to get enthused about the Flyers. To me, they seem to be an aging cover band. At best, they are still a cover band. More likely, you have heard better versions of the song they are playing. Trying to get more into them this season...

don't you have a star wars movie to stand in line for?
- anti-lame

Black Francis: hello.

We were hoping farabee would take the next step, and he regressed. Allison hayes and ellis all out shouldnt be minimized, those are key pieces. We were also hoping oskar would bounce back. But maybe this is what he is, and he was just on a roll before his illness. Either way, the guys we have arent cutting it. This reminds me of having patrick, well lets hope he improves next year......so far it isnt happening. But at least they arent getting bullied, that was embarassing last year when they were. And we still have a decent record.
- bradster

I like Allison. It’s from limited viewing because of injuries but I think he can be a decent part going forward. Farabee is going through a funk after a good start… he needs to fight through it. As far as Oscar, I think he can still play good enough defensively in order to given the ice time find his offensive game….at least for now.

Thanks. Just work resuming to normalcy, so I am actually seeing people at work in person. And the inability to get enthused about the Flyers. To me, they seem to be an aging cover band. At best, they are still a cover band. More likely, you have heard better versions of the song they are playing. Trying to get more into them this season...
- PT21

I was hoping some of the changes would help with my enthusiasm this year as well. While it’s better then last year, I find myself underwhelmed. 10 years of mediocracy will do that I guess. Gotta admit I have never been a cover band enthusiast for anyone.

This year's Farabee equals last year's Patrick.

MJL, did you ever play hockey at any level? You dodge this question regularly - it’s a simple yes or no and would really enlighten a lot of us on your “insight”

He will defect and not answer the question. But I’d like to know if he’s ever laced them up for a team.
- anti-lame

ive asked him tons of questions that he wouldnt answer, even before he started ignoring me lol
i asked him what moves he wouldve made, who he wouldve moved out, the only answer i ever saw was jake, only because his salary. he is clearly biases against chuck and pro ronnie. But thats the past now, lets move forward. Pretty sure hes never played sports, its obvious on his outlook and how he sees things

I like Allison. It’s from limited viewing because of injuries but I think he can be a decent part going forward. Farabee is going through a funk after a good start… he needs to fight through it. As far as Oscar, I think he can still play good enough defensively in order to given the ice time find his offensive game….at least for now.
- landros 2

what can oskar bring? He needs to be scoring 15+ to justify his salary.

I like Allison. It’s from limited viewing because of injuries but I think he can be a decent part going forward. Farabee is going through a funk after a good start… he needs to fight through it. As far as Oscar, I think he can still play good enough defensively in order to given the ice time find his offensive game….at least for now.
- landros 2

i think allison could be a 20 goal scorer, just not sure how his possession numbers will be or if he needs to play with the right players. Dont see him as a puck carrier at all. But if he can be strong on the board, and more toughness is always welcome

We lose 2 games in a row for the first time all season and we're not a good team, not a contender, soft, with no leader? I think Giroux has been leading quite well this year, some of the better moments I've seen of him in the past few seasons. We're short our top D Man, our 2nd line center, and some important depth we were counting on, The team has hung in there admirably. Farabee needs a little confidence boost, he looks lost out there, Lindblom has not put up points as hoped but has not been a liability, he's quite often on the right side of the puck and doing things right, How anyone can still whine about Brassard is beyond me, He's been all we could ask and is noticeable in most every game. This team will be there in the playoffs at seasons end, and if healthy has the potential to get hot Best goaltending we've had in years.

I was hoping some of the changes would help with my enthusiasm this year as well. While it’s better then last year, I find myself underwhelmed. 10 years of mediocracy will do that I guess. Gotta admit I have never been a cover band enthusiast for anyone.
- landros 2

I thought I was just gettind old. But I am quite excited for the Eagles, so its not that.

I will give you this though: so far, Risto does not look so bad. Maybe the price was too high, but I do not see gaffes like he used to make in Buffalo, esp going for hits.

I think Flyers can be a good team if Ellis returns and can stay, and once Frost and Allison (and maybe York) come in. Hayes will eventually be a good player. Oskar: sometimes you recover from a big setback, the mind recovers later than the body.

But even with all that, I do not think I will lose my bet wih you and NCFyersfan.

Don't worry, in 3-4 years time, you will be on the full rebuild camp with me. We have tried the competitive rebuild plan, now we are in the aimlessly shuffling pieces plan.

There will be only one thing left.

what can oskar bring? He needs to be scoring 15+ to justify his salary.
- bradster

Honestly I wish I knew.

We lose 2 games in a row for the first time all season and we're not a good team, not a contender, soft, with no leader? I think Giroux has been leading quite well this year, some of the better moments I've seen of him in the past few seasons. We're short our top D Man, our 2nd line center, and some important depth we were counting on, The team has hung in there admirably. Farabee needs a little confidence boost, he looks lost out there, Lindblom has not put up points as hoped but has not been a liability, he's quite often on the right side of the puck and doing things right, How anyone can still whine about Brassard is beyond me, He's been all we could ask and is noticeable in most every game. This team will be there in the playoffs at seasons end, and if healthy has the potential to get hot Best goaltending we've had in years.
- GPerogie

You're right about a lot of this but the reality is that there are many warning signs. This team is being propped up by goaltending. What you saw in the Boston game wasn't anything different from the majority of the season. The goaltending didn't bail them out and they got thoroughly beaten. They are in the bottom of the league in scoring chances against and scoring chances for at 5 on 5. The PP isn't good. It's the same with the PK.
What do we want, a team that might get hot and make a one season run at it? Or a team that is a true contender and will be in the mix over a significant period of seasons? Goaltending only holds up for so long. Brassard has put up points but he is not the solution and is part of the reason why this team doesn't carry play more. Same with the defense. Ristolainen was the wrong player to add. Will Ellis be able to stay healthy? Will Hayes come back strong? Core injuries have a tendency to degrade players. If they can come back, that will be a big boost. Right now, numerous players need to step up. Get those players back hopefully and then go from there. No more quick fixes.

I think if healthy a good amount of those warning signs disappear. We’re hanging in there with Braun who has filled in beautifully but of course is not ideally a 1-2 d man on a solid team (and nothing against him. He is playing surprisingly well). If Hayes comes back, Ellis returns (concern on this one) those flags could be blips on the radar. If you told me Ellis was out to start the season I would not have expected this record. We win faceoffs we got goaltending. Would love to see av find a forecheck around the modified trap teams run against us but overall I still have faith. Granted I had faith in my Phillies this year too so maybe just speaking from my heart/butt instead of the brain

I was hoping some of the changes would help with my enthusiasm this year as well. While it’s better then last year, I find myself underwhelmed. 10 years of mediocracy will do that I guess. Gotta admit I have never been a cover band enthusiast for anyone.
- landros 2

Would it be if the goalies weren't 10x better than they were last year?

I thought I was just gettind old. But I am quite excited for the Eagles, so its not that.

I will give you this though: so far, Risto does not look so bad. Maybe the price was too high, but I do not see gaffes like he used to make in Buffalo, esp going for hits.

I think Flyers can be a good team if Ellis returns and can stay, and once Frost and Allison (and maybe York) come in. Hayes will eventually be a good player. Oskar: sometimes you recover from a big setback, the mind recovers later than the body.

But even with all that, I do not think I will lose my bet wih you and NCFyersfan.

Don't worry, in 3-4 years time, you will be on the full rebuild camp with me. We have tried the competitive rebuild plan, now we are in the aimlessly shuffling pieces plan.

There will be only one thing left.
- PT21

I’m still not cool on a rebuild in the context most talk about around here…I think a lot can change when you draft and develop properly and hit on some guys that maybe you weren’t expecting too. A teams fortunes can turn quickly when you already have a bunch of quality pieces which the Flyers clearly do.

This year's Farabee equals last year's Patrick.
- Phillywhiteout

Would it be if the goalies weren't 10x better than they were last year?
- rayc16

I also think the team is a tougher team to play against…last year there was a lot of games where there was simply no push back. I like their over all defensive structure better…there are no where close to the amount of defensive break downs they had last year, how many times last year did they allow easy tap in goals because a d man made a poor read?…it still needs work, but it’s improved. And yes the goaltending has been way better.

This year's Farabee equals last year's Patrick.
- Phillywhiteout

Not even close. Patrick was completely unengaged.

I also think the team is a tougher team to play against…last year there was a lot of games where there was simply no push back. I like their over all defensive structure better…there are no where close to the amount of defensive break downs they had last year, how many times last year did they allow easy tap in goals because a d man made a poor read?…it still needs work, but it’s improved. And yes the goaltending has been way better.
- landros 2

Overall I agree with you.
However, at this point last year the Flyers were 9-4-3. They're 8-5-3 now and starting a difficult string of games. Next 10 games could make or break this season. No easy ones.

Overall I agree with you.
However, at this point last year the Flyers were 9-4-3. They're 8-5-3 now and starting a difficult string of games. Next 10 games could make or break this season. No easy ones.
- rayc16

Comparisons keep being made between this year and last. That's fools gold. Last year was the worst season relative to talent that I ever watched. Being better in any area to last years team is not an achievement. The comparison that needs to be made is between this years team and the top teams in the league. Right now, they come up way short. It's more than just the injuries. That's even with elite goaltending to this point.

Comparisons keep being made between this year and last. That's fools gold. Last year was the worst season relative to talent that I ever watched. Being better in any area to last years team is not an achievement. The comparison that needs to be made is between this years team and the top teams in the league. Right now, they come up way short. It's more than just the injuries. That's even with elite goaltending to this point.
- MJL

My main point was the next 10 games are going to determine what this team is.... without Ellis and likely without Hayes for at least some portion of it.

My main point was the next 10 games are going to determine what this team is.... without Ellis and likely without Hayes for at least some portion of it.
- rayc16

I understand that but I'm not sure that you can determine what this team is missing a top pairing defenseman and a 2nd line center. I do think that they could be out of it real quick if they don't play well over the next 10 games. Hopefully the goaltending holds up.

This year's Farabee equals last year's Patrick.
- Phillywhiteout

frost is more on the level of patrick

Hmm ... I thought this was me. Now you have done the impossible: hurt my feelings.


Joking aside, I often see guys like you, JD250, phillywhiteout, joe nardone (just posters I have seen take this pov last few days): say: "Stats don't measure everything, they don't measure intimidation, sticking up for others, team spirit etc."

This is not true, and you can just use common sense to see it is not true (no stat needed). Take Risto as an example. I will give you this: he has been way better than what I remember in Buffalo. But say he intimidates forwards near the paint, a la Pronger. Well, in that case, this will show up in stats for High Danger chances when he in on the ice. Say he intimidates forwards bringing puck up ice, a la Stevens. Well, in that case, that should lead to hurried dump-ins, and easier outs, which in turn will show up in Corsi and Rel Corsi when he is on ice.

Stats were never intended to provide everything. If winning is the journey, stats present a road map for the journey, not a Google Street View photograph of detail. If things you consider important don't show up in any of the maps, maybe they only matter in your mind, not for the journey, like the chick sunbathing on the balcony on the way.
- PT21

Let us know when you moneyballers are done talking about corsi so the rest of us that actually play the game can have an adult hockey conversation.

I understand that but I'm not sure that you can determine what this team is missing a top pairing defenseman and a 2nd line center. I do think that they could be out of it real quick if they don't play well over the next 10 games. Hopefully the goaltending holds up.
- MJL

Hart is the only reason AV still has a job right now. They are bad/terrible in almost every aspect of the game. CF must be getting nervous.