Not true about Panarin...almost signed with Isles. Rags outbid them
- hfc355

Not the first time he left money on the table (took lower pay to stay with Hawks)

- Tomahawk

😆🤣😂

the flyers would have been better off drafting 13 lol
- 2Real

Poor Patrick now on Vegas LTIR 😢

- Tomahawk

Fantastic.

I think it’s ridiculous anyone would suggest management, ownership or any high ups don’t care about winning a championship. You better have real evidence to state these claims.
- SuperSchennBros

100% true.

I think it’s ridiculous anyone would suggest management, ownership or any high ups don’t care about winning a championship. You better have real evidence to state these claims.
- SuperSchennBros

yea it's not that they don't want to win it's they're too incompetent to

Fantastic.
- landros 2

That’s gold haha. Connaughton wear number 8 though.

Why is that?
- MJL

Based on very strong empirical evidence, one of the biggest, if not the biggest thing mgmt can do (to build a cup winner) is draft very high. Its not the only thing, but it is one of the things. To do that, the team must be willing to endure some pain of bad year(s).

What kind of market is Philly? Is it closer to CHI/BOS or closer to TOR/MTL? I suggest it is closer to former. If team has a sustained dive in standings, attendance will fall quite a bit. Yes, our attendance did not fall so much in 2006, but that team was not projected to be so bad and it was just a 1 year blip. More tellingly, there were signs of wavering attendance in 19-20 even before Covid hit here, after a missed playoff season in 18-19. Same this year.

If we are like Chi/Bos, well those had sustained falls in attendance when they were bad. From about 97-100 during competitive years to about mid 80s in % terms. However, as long as they stay competitive, it seems these teams essentially sell out. My speculation is that Philly is like that.

In summary, moving from competitive/bubble team to contender status means:

minus: a 15% odd drop in attendance during the rebuild years for sure
plus: a 3% odd gain IF they do succeed in attaining contender status, which is not certain.

Economically, it makes sense to stay in that competitive status area as long as they can. I think that is why Chicago milks the $ by signing SJ, though that team is well past its prime. Same for Boston not doing a rebuild though it is time for them too.

I am not going to go down arguing another rabbit hole with you. We have had this exact same discussion many times. And besides, even if I did, you will ask me the exact same questions 2 days later.

100% true.
- landros 2

Will this do?



Find more statistics at Statista

Will this do?



Find more statistics at Statista
- PT21

What’s that matter?

Based on very strong empirical evidence, one of the biggest, if not the biggest thing mgmt can do (to build a cup winner) is draft very high. Its not the only thing, but it is one of the things. To do that, the team must be willing to endure some pain of bad year(s).

What kind of market is Philly? Is it closer to CHI/BOS or closer to TOR/MTL? I suggest it is closer to former. If team has a sustained dive in standings, attendance will fall quite a bit. Yes, our attendance did not fall so much in 2006, but that team was not projected to be so bad and it was just a 1 year blip. More tellingly, there were signs of wavering attendance in 19-20 even before Covid hit here, after a missed playoff season in 18-19. Same this year.

If we are like Chi/Bos, well those had sustained falls in attendance when they were bad. From about 97-100 during competitive years to about mid 80s in % terms. However, as long as they stay competitive, it seems these teams essentially sell out. My speculation is that Philly is like that.

In summary, moving from competitive/bubble team to contender status means:

minus: a 15% odd drop in attendance during the rebuild years for sure
plus: a 3% odd gain IF they do succeed in attaining contender status, which is not certain.

Economically, it makes sense to stay in that competitive status area as long as they can. I think that is why Chicago milks the $ by signing SJ, though that team is well past its prime. Same for Boston not doing a rebuild though it is time for them too.

I am not going to go down arguing another rabbit hole with you. We have had this exact same discussion many times. And besides, even if I did, you will ask me the exact same questions 2 days later.
- PT21

Not two days later, I'm going to ask you again right now. Nothing you said here explains why it's not worth it. You just babbled. You know the Flyers attendance record. It's stayed pretty much the same with the exception of the Covid dip. So the question becomes a question or revenue and profit. What expenditure is increased by trying to become a top team? Tell me what changes? I guarantee that revenue increases by becoming a championship team. You seem to want to try to indicate that you have to tank and become a bad team first to win and that will result in a reduction in attendance. Then you try to dance around the evidence that it didn't in the past.

What’s that matter?
- landros 2

I just showed you evidence of a business gaining a gigantic monetary windfall all the while showing very, very little interest in winning on the playing field.

In as much as it is a business, and their central role is to make money after all, what do you mean "what's that matter?"

Will this do?



Find more statistics at Statista
- PT21

you don't think they don't want to earn more money?

I just showed you evidence of a business gaining a gigantic monetary windfall all the while showing very, very little interest in winning on the playing field.

In as much as it is a business, and their central role is to make money after all, what do you mean "what's that matter?"
- PT21

The NFL is a cash cow. They have large profit sharing. Major TV contracts. Every NFL franchise grows in value.

you don't think they don't want to earn more money?
- 2Real

Sure, but not if it risks jeopardizing what they are making was my point.

I guarantee that revenue increases by becoming a championship team.
- MJL

Would it tho?

It's a gate-driven league. Simply milking the glory days and providing the merest whiff of hope has been enough to fill the building almost every night. And despite not winning since the '70's, the Flyers are one of the tops in terms of franchise value.

What's the upside to doing something different? More licensing/merch sales? A bigger local TV deal? There's got to be something worth risking the golden goose over.

The NFL is a cash cow. They have large profit sharing. Major TV contracts. Every NFL franchise grows in value.
- MJL

Snyder has beaten the trend very, very handsomely in the past decade

Would it tho?

It's a gate-driven league. Simply milking the glory days and providing the merest whiff of hope has been enough to fill the building almost every night. And despite not winning since the '70's, the Flyers are one of the tops in terms of franchise value.

What's the upside to doing something different? More licensing/merch sales? A bigger local TV deal? There's got to be something worth risking the golden goose over.
- Tomahawk

Exactly, the cost of inputting an inferior product in the ice is much bigger than the gain of the team going through that and eventually coming a great team 5 years down the road. It’s much easier to stay status quo and probably more cost effective

Would it tho?

It's a gate-driven league. Simply milking the glory days and providing the merest whiff of hope has been enough to fill the building almost every night. And despite not winning since the '70's, the Flyers are one of the tops in terms of franchise value.

What's the upside to doing something different? More licensing/merch sales? A bigger local TV deal? There's got to be something worth risking the golden goose over.
- Tomahawk

Is this why they went after Risto and not Savard? Cheaper, same position, much better analytics, wouldn't have required a 1st to sign, and Tampa ponied up a 1st to get him for just a rental value, so one could argue just as good as Risto, if not better.

Poor Patrick now on Vegas LTIR 😢
- THE EVIL WITHIN

But lucky myers got back into the lineup. Injuries.

Snyder has beaten the trend very, very handsomely in the past decade

- PT21

now imagine if they were a championship team and could charge more for tickets and what not

That’s gold haha. Connaughton wear number 8 though.
- Hextall271

44 is taken. And may be retired at the end of season.

What kind of market is Philly? Is it closer to CHI/BOS or closer to TOR/MTL? I suggest it is closer to former. If team has a sustained dive in standings, attendance will fall quite a bit. Yes, our attendance did not fall so much in 2006, but that team was not projected to be so bad and it was just a 1 year blip. More tellingly, there were signs of wavering attendance in 19-20 even before Covid hit here, after a missed playoff season in 18-19. Same this year.
- PT21

I don't believe fan engagement for the Flyers necessarily hinges on winning games on the ice. A lot of the entertainment value provided by this team is in the dramatic fashion in which they fail, and the bat poop crazy things they do every summer to try to get "better". Lindros' entire career arc. The offer sheets, the huge signings, the huge trades. All the coaches sacrificed along the way. The Dry Island core explosion. Bryzgalov, lol. Fans ate all that poop up.

I'm starting to think that Hextall was actually fired for not providing that level of entertainment. There weren't leaks during his tenure, very few crises, few splashes, no public humiliation of scape goats... just a lot of normal hockey/process stuff. The fans actually became bored with the team and ownership realized they needed to bring "bias for action" back again.

now imagine if they were a championship team and could charge more for tickets and what not
- 2Real

Imagine if that involves having a competent coach run his own ship, and build from scratch, and not just sign every big name you can to keep drawing the corporate suits to the games. Imagine giving up the ego trip of not interfering etc.

I'm sure that Fletcher would.

I'd be surprised if Dave Scott spends any time at all thinking about the Stanley Cup. His idea of success for the Flyers is probably a lot more nuanced and practical than simply chasing a trophy.
- Tomahawk

Dave Scott is currently amazed that even though the team has lost nine straight games, they are not on a 9 game losing streak