If your definition of regression is failing to beat expectations, then the entire history of the stock market would be a regression. You are not really disagreeing with me, you're disagreeing with Merriam Webster about the meaning of the word regression.
- PT21

You've tried to apply your own definition of regression on to me. Nothing to do with expectations. Attempting to deflect away from hockey.

zhitnick for coburn was pretty good. Hommer made some good trades, and iced competitive and entertaining teams. The cap was his enemy.
- bradster

Homer did well all together though when he did make mistakes, they were doozies. Ex Eminger for a 1st, Bryzgalov signing, JVR for Schenn. All Homer's bad moves really stemmed from trying to fill the hole Pronger left. Would be interesting to see how this team turned out had Pronger not got hurt.

You've tried to apply your own definition of regression on to me. Nothing to do with expectations. Attempting to deflect away from hockey.
- MJL

Here is a refresher from a few minutes ago of the course of the discussion:

The setting that the gem is placed in is very important.

Look at all the young players that have regressed in recent years.
- MJL

No one has regressed in absolute terms. They just have not developed as you had hoped they would.
- PT21

Oh, I disagree with that. When is the last time the Flyers had a young player exceed expectations?
- MJL

If your definition of regression is failing to beat expectations, then the entire history of the stock market would be a regression.
- PT21

Here is a refresher from a few minutes ago of the course of the discussion:
- PT21

Don't need a refresher course. Stop always trying to debate words or bring in irrelevant analogies such as with the stock market. Stick to hockey and then maybe we can have a productive conversation. You need to go back further. The context of the conversation is the Flyers development of players. Perhaps you need a refresher. When I state nothing to do with expectations, I mean my expectations which have nothing to do with the situation. Stop creating rabbit holes.

Homer did well all together though when he did make mistakes, they were doozies. Ex Eminger for a 1st, Bryzgalov signing, JVR for Schenn. All Homer's bad moves really stemmed from trying to fill the hole Pronger left. Would be interesting to see how this team turned out had Pronger not got hurt.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

“Did well altogether”: salary cap hell, trading Bob, a single goalie prospect in the system, and stupid trades other than the ones you mentioned (trading Carter, trading for Pronger), giving big contracts to bad and older players without regard to their ability, age or salary cap implications (Shelley, Jones, Leighton, and Pronger).

All I can say as a fan is if I have to live through two 10 game losing streaks in one season, I better be getting a top 5 pick on the other side!

Don't need a refresher course. Stop always trying to debate words or bring in irrelevant analogies such as with the stock market. Stick to hockey and then maybe we can have a productive conversation. You need to go back further. The context of the conversation is the Flyers development of players. Perhaps you need a refresher.
- MJL

It is difficult to have a discussion about anything (where that anything includes hockey) with an illogical amnesiac.

As for what you asked earlier, who has beaten expectations, I would say of the current players, Giroux and Couturier certainly have. So have Lindblom and Ghost. Farabee will, I believe, so will Carter Hart (btw, no one seems to have remarked upon the fact that CH stopped 8 successive shots in the shootout where he is not the best, given to going down too early..), and book is till out on TK. I think TK has high end skill.

If you look around the league, conditional on where Flyers draft, I don't see any huge anomaly. Where they have fallen short however, is that so many guys, including you, utterly anoint our draft picks from the minute they enter our system as to the stardom born. When guys like me point out dissenting expert opinions, guys like you pooh pooh the so-called experts.

And then,far more often than not, your ass gets kicked, and the experts turn out to be right. How is that trade of Sanheim for Nylander that you were against looking now?

Then you react to that by blaming player development deficiencies of the franchise.

You know you are in bad shape when you are longing for Hayes and Brassard to come back from injury!

It is difficult to have a discussion about anything (where that anything includes hockey) with an illogical amnesiac.

As for what you asked earlier, who has beaten expectations, I would say of the current players, Giroux and Couturier certainly have. So have Lindblom and Ghost. Farabee will, I believe, so will Carter Hart (btw, no one seems to have remarked upon the fact that CH stopped 8 successive shots in the shootout where he is not the best, given to going down too early..), and book is till out on TK. I think TK has high end skill.

If you look around the league, conditional on where Flyers draft, I don't see any huge anomaly. Where they have fallen short however, is that so many guys, including you, utterly anoint our draft picks from the minute they enter our system as to the stardom born. When guys like me point out dissenting expert opinions, guys like you pooh pooh the so-called experts.

And then,far more often than not, your ass gets kicked, and the experts turn out to be right. How is that trade of Sanheim for Nylander that you were against looking now?

Then you react to that by blaming player development deficiencies of the franchise.
- PT21

Not every player drafted is going to make it. But you can tell pretty quickly most of the time if a player is going to be an NHL player or not, and its lunacy to blame player development every single time a player does not make it. Look at Cam York as an example. He is the bright spot of this otherwise dreadful season. He shows game in and game out that he belongs in the NHL. Then you look at Frost and its up in the air as to whether he will make it or not. Each player is different, they develop differently and some at a later or slower pace than others. But that is why there are no guarantees in the draft.

It is difficult to have a discussion about anything (where that anything includes hockey) with an illogical amnesiac.

As for what you asked earlier, who has beaten expectations, I would say of the current players, Giroux and Couturier certainly have. So have Lindblom and Ghost. Farabee will, I believe, so will Carter Hart (btw, no one seems to have remarked upon the fact that CH stopped 8 successive shots in the shootout where he is not the best, given to going down too early..), and book is till out on TK. I think TK has high end skill.

If you look around the league, conditional on where Flyers draft, I don't see any huge anomaly. Where they have fallen short however, is that so many guys, including you, utterly anoint our draft picks from the minute they enter our system as to the stardom born. When guys like me point out dissenting expert opinions, guys like you pooh pooh the so-called experts.

And then,far more often than not, your ass gets kicked, and the experts turn out to be right. How is that trade of Sanheim for Nylander that you were against looking now?

Then you react to that by blaming player development deficiencies of the franchise.
- PT21

When you learn to stop making personal insults against people, then we can have another conversation. No need for me to read further due to your obsession with insults and your unwillingness to consider other points of view.

Not every player drafted is going to make it. But you can tell pretty quickly most of the time if a player is going to be an NHL player or not, and its lunacy to blame player development every single time a player does not make it. Look at Cam York as an example. He is the bright spot of this otherwise dreadful season. He shows game in and game out that he belongs in the NHL. Then you look at Frost and its up in the air as to whether he will make it or not. Each player is different, they develop differently and some at a later or slower pace than others. But that is why there are no guarantees in the draft.
- jd250

York is an example. Looks like an NHL player. The best thing they can do with York moving forward is to not place too much responsibility on him. Like the Flyers have done with other players countless times. You're right, each player is different so why are you comparing them? Frost is never going to develop playing in a bottom 6 role with marginal 4th line grinders.

Not every player drafted is going to make it. But you can tell pretty quickly most of the time if a player is going to be an NHL player or not, and its lunacy to blame player development every single time a player does not make it. Look at Cam York as an example. He is the bright spot of this otherwise dreadful season. He shows game in and game out that he belongs in the NHL. Then you look at Frost and its up in the air as to whether he will make it or not. Each player is different, they develop differently and some at a later or slower pace than others. But that is why there are no guarantees in the draft.
- jd250

York is an example. Looks like an NHL player. The best thing they can do with York moving forward is to not place too much responsibility on him. Like the Flyers have done with other players countless times. You're right, each player is different so why are you comparing them? Frost is never going to develop playing in a bottom 6 role with marginal 4th line grinders.

York is an example. Looks like an NHL player. The best thing they can do with York moving forward is to not place too much responsibility on him. Like the Flyers have done with other players countless times. You're right, each player is different so why are you comparing them? Frost is never going to develop playing in a bottom 6 role with marginal 4th line grinders.
- MJL

The thing with Frost is I don't know what is going on off the ice, in the gym, at team meetings, practice time, etc. and neither do you. Obviously the coaches see him all the time and have determined what he is capable of handling. Last night he started on the 4th line but moved to the 3rd line with JVR for more than half the game. Plus Frost is playing on the 2nd PP unit. To me he is getting his shot but he is not taking advantage of it so far. He is just not making plays, even a 1 on 3 play, where he is trying to make something happen, that is my concern with him right now.

“Did well altogether”: salary cap hell, trading Bob, a single goalie prospect in the system, and stupid trades other than the ones you mentioned (trading Carter, trading for Pronger), giving big contracts to bad and older players without regard to their ability, age or salary cap implications (Shelley, Jones, Leighton, and Pronger).
- iamscore2day

Homer would do something good, then he'd follow it up with a half dozen dumb moves.

He never had the mandate to properly rebuild... wonder what could have been if he did. There was a lot of quality young talent coming up at the time. Enough to win a lot of games with, possibly a Cup or two.

Homer would do something good, then he'd follow it up with a half dozen dumb moves.

He never had the mandate to properly rebuild... wonder what could have been if he did. There was a lot of quality young talent coming up at the time. Enough to win a lot of games with, possibly a Cup or two.
- Tomahawk

I do think Snider was a problem for him to manage. But Homer did many dumb things. I still remember the presser when he was asked questions about the salary cap and did not realize until then that his largesse to Pronger would be a salary cap problem because of Pronger's age when he signed it. Oops.

The thing with Frost is I don't know what is going on off the ice, in the gym, at team meetings, practice time, etc. and neither do you. Obviously the coaches see him all the time and have determined what he is capable of handling. Last night he started on the 4th line but moved to the 3rd line with JVR for more than half the game. Plus Frost is playing on the 2nd PP unit. To me he is getting his shot but he is not taking advantage of it so far. He is just not making plays, even a 1 on 3 play, where he is trying to make something happen, that is my concern with him right now.
- jd250

His goal on the line with TK and OL earlier this year was a thing of beauty. He should be playing with other fast, skilled players so we can see what he can do. Putting him with two clods is no way to measure that. Did you see the chemistry between him and Big Red? The guys know he can play. His only problem is our talent "development," which is to stifle speed and creativity so far as I can see.

When you learn to stop making personal insults against people, then we can have another conversation. No need for me to read further due to your obsession with insults and your unwillingness to consider other points of view.
- MJL

For god's sake, stop your petulant whining. Nothing I said was intended to be personal for its own sake, or off the mark or less than what you deserve on merit.

Come home, have a warm shower, kiss the wife, and open a cold beer. And don't mess with that order of suggestions.

It is difficult to have a discussion about anything (where that anything includes hockey) with an illogical amnesiac.

As for what you asked earlier, who has beaten expectations, I would say of the current players, Giroux and Couturier certainly have. So have Lindblom and Ghost. Farabee will, I believe, so will Carter Hart (btw, no one seems to have remarked upon the fact that CH stopped 8 successive shots in the shootout where he is not the best, given to going down too early..), and book is till out on TK. I think TK has high end skill.

If you look around the league, conditional on where Flyers draft, I don't see any huge anomaly. Where they have fallen short however, is that so many guys, including you, utterly anoint our draft picks from the minute they enter our system as to the stardom born. When guys like me point out dissenting expert opinions, guys like you pooh pooh the so-called experts.

And then,far more often than not, your ass gets kicked, and the experts turn out to be right. How is that trade of Sanheim for Nylander that you were against looking now?

Then you react to that by blaming player development deficiencies of the franchise.
- PT21

You have to admit that we have a problem with that, don't you agree? Also, the Leafs were reportedly very interested in Sanheim. I don't know about Nylander but that was widely reported.

Not every player drafted is going to make it. But you can tell pretty quickly most of the time if a player is going to be an NHL player or not, and its lunacy to blame player development every single time a player does not make it. Look at Cam York as an example. He is the bright spot of this otherwise dreadful season. He shows game in and game out that he belongs in the NHL. Then you look at Frost and its up in the air as to whether he will make it or not. Each player is different, they develop differently and some at a later or slower pace than others. But that is why there are no guarantees in the draft.
- jd250

There are no absolute guarantees for most of life. But there are shades/degrees of guarantee, and it is in those degrees that most of life occurs, isn't that true?

You keep trying to beat those degrees, and keep falling short, why the moaning and chest-beating? Nothing unexpected has occurred.

Frost was passed over by what, 26 teams who do this for a living?Our entire premise that this is some diamond in the rough broadcasting in some crazy frequency that only we were were tuned in to is what needs adjustment.

He may still turn out to be an average to decent 2/3 C. Too early yet.

For god's sake, stop your petulant whining. Nothing I said was intended to be personal for its own sake, or off the mark or less than what you deserve on merit.

Come home, have a warm shower, kiss the wife, and open a cold beer. And don't mess with that order of suggestions.
- PT21

youre missing out on just how wonderful a drink or two pre and during a shower can be my man

You have to admit that we have a problem with that, don't you agree? Also, the Leafs were reportedly very interested in Sanheim. I don't know about Nylander but that was widely reported.
- iamscore2day

No I don't admit it. I could be totally wrong and am open to that, but so far, what I see ie a franchise on average proceeding with player development where similar franchises (in terms of pick position) are also.

Who are the studs that Habs and Wild have picked (never mind Kaprisov, arguably luck there).

Like I said, could be wrong. Tell me why though.

For god's sake, stop your petulant whining. Nothing I said was intended to be personal for its own sake, or off the mark or less than what you deserve on merit.

Come home, have a warm shower, kiss the wife, and open a cold beer. And don't mess with that order of suggestions.
- PT21

stop, still with mom

youre missing out on just how wonderful a drink or two pre and during a shower can be my man
- stayinthefnnet

And you are perhaps missing out on the 3rd of those suggestions and what the reaction would be if the order is altered?

stop, still with mom
- hello it's me 2050

He said he met his wife while he was a ski instructor in his youth.

And you are perhaps missing out on the 3rd of those suggestions and what the reaction would be if the order is altered?
- PT21

Still a happy bachelor here pal.

if a girl is getting a ring from me shes going to need to have to chill with some things