I think people overrate the importance of wearing the C on a player’s sweater. Everyone talks about Messier’s bold statement in the 94 playoffs guaranteeing victory. But that Cup doesn’t happen if the Rags management wasn’t shrewd enough to draft franchise cornerstones Richter & Leetch, and build a deep and loaded roster. Nor do they win without having Mike Keenan behind the bench.

Bobby Clarke was another great captain, but the Flyers weren’t winning squat without Fred Shero behind the bench or GM Keith Allen drafting players like Clarke, Bill Barber and Jim Watson and pulling off lopsided deals to acquire guys like Macleish, Lonsberry, Dupont and most of all Bernie Parent.

If Bobby Clarke had been drafted by the California Golden Seals, they certainly would have been better but I very much doubt they’d have gone on to win 2 Cups.

So as the captain you are saying he bears no responsibility. Understood. There are things a captain can do to get his team going. You know this.

Again it has nothing to do with him being the best he player per say. Both are separate issues imo.

I also think Poulin and def Primeau had a hand in that as well. They didn't like either coach. The captain was the buffer and made sure the coaches message was getting across. Cant keep blaming the coaches when he has had how many?
- hello it's me 2050

Poulin and Primeau were both fine captains

But

What Dman has Giroux played with that is the equivalent of Mark Howe? Or a goal scoring machine like Tim Kerr. And Primeau? Let’s be real, the team had one good run under his leadership and still failed to reach the final.

I love Dave Poulin, but put him on the Winnipeg Jets in the mid 80s and guess what? The Jets still suck.

Poulin and Primeau were both fine captains

But

What Dman has Giroux played with that is the equivalent of Mark Howe? Or a goal scoring machine like Tim Kerr. And Primeau? Let’s be real, the team had one good run under his leadership and still failed to reach the final.

I love Dave Poulin, but put him on the Winnipeg Jets in the mid 80s and guess what? The Jets still suck.
- BiggE

Best shot his teams had IMO was when they lost the first round to the rangers in 7. Unfortunately Mason missed the first 3 games, RIP razor. Henrik was unreal in that series but Mason was better but only played 4 games.

Poulin and Primeau were both fine captains

But

What Dman has Giroux played with that is the equivalent of Mark Howe? Or a goal scoring machine like Tim Kerr. And Primeau? Let’s be real, the team had one good run under his leadership and still failed to reach the final.

I love Dave Poulin, but put him on the Winnipeg Jets in the mid 80s and guess what? The Jets still suck.
- BiggE

Not a matter of the team sucking or only 1 good run. Yes the captain cant change that if the team sucks. He can however do things to try to limit the losing streaks and slow starts. Or do you disagree?

I think people overrate the importance of wearing the C on a player’s sweater. Everyone talks about Messier’s bold statement in the 94 playoffs guaranteeing victory. But that Cup doesn’t happen if the Rags management wasn’t shrewd enough to draft franchise cornerstones Richter & Leetch, and build a deep and loaded roster. Nor do they win without having Mike Keenan behind the bench.

Bobby Clarke was another great captain, but the Flyers weren’t winning squat without Fred Shero behind the bench or GM Keith Allen drafting players like Clarke, Bill Barber and Jim Watson and pulling off lopsided deals to acquire guys like Macleish, Lonsberry, Dupont and most of all Bernie Parent.

If Bobby Clarke had been drafted by the California Golden Seals, they certainly would have been better but I very much doubt they’d have gone on to win 2 Cups.
- BiggE

I’ve said this 10 times on here. Ovechkin was a horrible captain in the eyes of many until he won. It makes no sense. More than Half the teams in the league just have the C on the best players sweater. It takes a collective group to lead a locker room and win a championship. But you know, it’s captain comfortables fault.

Not a matter of the team sucking or only 1 good run. Yes the captain cant change that if the team sucks. He can however do things to try to limit the losing streaks and slow starts. Or do you disagree?
- hello it's me 2050

I’m sure he’s tried to the best of his ability. He’s not a deity or a magician. Do you truly believe that he does not give an honest effort on the ice? If so, there is no point continuing this conversation, we will never see eye to eye on this.

I’ve said this 10 times on here. Ovechkin was a horrible captain in the eyes of many until he won. It makes no sense. More than Half the teams in the league just have the C on the best players sweater. It takes a collective group to lead a locker room and win a championship. But you know, it’s captain comfortables fault.
- ClaudeFather

Exactly

Just a thought while watching the all-star skills last night. Jordan Kyrou was a 2nd round pick in 2016 and now, 5 years later, is leading the St. Louis Blues in scoring and just won the fastest skater in the league, beating out Connor McDavid, Cale Makar and Connor, all 1st round picks. A 2nd round pick!

Since 2014, the Flyers drafted the following players in the 2nd round: NAK, Laberge (drafted one pick after Kyrou), Hart (great pick), Allison (we're probably never going to know), Ratcliff (might be a bottom 6 forward) and Ginning. Please, don't anyone tell me what a great drafter Hextall was, because when I see players like Gyrou lighting it up and having the skills of a successful modern NHL player, I get sick to my stomach! Is Fletcher any better? I guess we'll see with Brink, Andrae and Tuomaala.

I’m sure he’s tried to the best of his ability. He’s not a deity or a magician. Do you truly believe that he does not give an honest effort on the ice? If so, there is no point continuing this conversation, we will never see eye to eye on this.
- BiggE

Don't think you are understanding what I am saying. Wins/losses and leadership can be 2 diff things. I aint saying the captain should have this team or prior ones the playoffs. That doesn't fall on him.

What he can do imo is do more during these multiple losing streaks and years of slow starts. I see the same old same old. Has nothing to do with him still being the best player or most talented player. Like you said wont see eye to eye.

Just a thought while watching the all-star skills last night. Jordan Kyrou was a 2nd round pick in 2016 and now, 5 years later, is leading the St. Louis Blues in scoring and just won the fastest skater in the league, beating out Connor McDavid, Cale Makar and Connor, all 1st round picks. A 2nd round pick!

Since 2014, the Flyers drafted the following players in the 2nd round: NAK, Laberge (drafted one pick after Kyrou), Hart (great pick), Allison (we're probably never going to know), Ratcliff (might be a bottom 6 forward) and Ginning. Please, don't anyone tell me what a great drafter Hextall was, because when I see players like Gyrou lighting it up and having the skills of a successful modern NHL player, I get sick to my stomach! Is Fletcher any better? I guess we'll see with Brink, Andrae and Tuomaala.
- jd250

and you never heard of him until last week...stfu

Good night for a couple of prospects on Friday. Brink had 1G,4A and Attard had 1A, 3G. I am liking Ronnie Attard's progress in college and can't wait to see how he handles the AHL, hopefully next year. He is only a junior so we will see.

I think people overrate the importance of wearing the C on a player’s sweater. Everyone talks about Messier’s bold statement in the 94 playoffs guaranteeing victory. But that Cup doesn’t happen if the Rags management wasn’t shrewd enough to draft franchise cornerstones Richter & Leetch, and build a deep and loaded roster. Nor do they win without having Mike Keenan behind the bench.

Bobby Clarke was another great captain, but the Flyers weren’t winning squat without Fred Shero behind the bench or GM Keith Allen drafting players like Clarke, Bill Barber and Jim Watson and pulling off lopsided deals to acquire guys like Macleish, Lonsberry, Dupont and most of all Bernie Parent.

If Bobby Clarke had been drafted by the California Golden Seals, they certainly would have been better but I very much doubt they’d have gone on to win 2 Cups.
- BiggE

Honestly, it's really not all that difficult of a concept.

Just a thought while watching the all-star skills last night. Jordan Kyrou was a 2nd round pick in 2016 and now, 5 years later, is leading the St. Louis Blues in scoring and just won the fastest skater in the league, beating out Connor McDavid, Cale Makar and Connor, all 1st round picks. A 2nd round pick!

Since 2014, the Flyers drafted the following players in the 2nd round: NAK, Laberge (drafted one pick after Kyrou), Hart (great pick), Allison (we're probably never going to know), Ratcliff (might be a bottom 6 forward) and Ginning. Please, don't anyone tell me what a great drafter Hextall was, because when I see players like Gyrou lighting it up and having the skills of a successful modern NHL player, I get sick to my stomach! Is Fletcher any better? I guess we'll see with Brink, Andrae and Tuomaala.
- jd250

So since the Blues drafted Kyrou with a 2nd round pick, Hextall was not a great drafter? Sometimes I don't even know where to begin with your posts. First of all, I don't know anyone, including me, who thinks that Hextall was a great drafter. Now that we've got this straight, Kyrou counts but drafting Hart, an NHL #1 goalie and a potential for even higher doesn't count?

So since the Blues drafted Kyrou with a 2nd round pick, Hextall was not a great drafter? Sometimes I don't even know where to begin with your posts. First of all, I don't know anyone, including me, who thinks that Hextall was a great drafter. Now that we've got this straight, Kyrou counts but drafting Hart, an NHL #1 goalie and a potential for even higher doesn't count?
- MJL

On a team that has had goalie issues for how long?