After the past two seasons, can you really say Provorov is a top pair defenseman and Sanheim is a 2nd pair defenseman? Farabee is a top 6 forward, but can you really say TK is a top 6 forward over the past 2 seasons also?
- jd250

Provy has not played well. Sanheim continues to be inconsistent. Provy on most teams is easily a top 4. Sanheim is not. He’s a bottom pairing guy that can elevate his play to a top 4 role on occasion. He skates very good but really doesn’t do anything else very good. He doesn’t score much…he doesn’t defend particularly well. Farabee has a chance to be a good top 6 winger….skill and drive are there. TK has regressed…to me he’s one of the biggest disappointment this year and last.

I think Fletcher is a loser.
- SuperSchennBros

I wouldn't go that far. Milbury is a loser.

Fletch, for all his mistakes and shortcomings, is just your garden variety NHL GM that can't get out of their own way. Not being a genius or having an extraordinary quality doesn't make you a loser... it just makes you dime a dozen.

Flyers are in such a deep hole that an average GM simply stands no chance. They need somebody to come in and walk on water or this poop will never get sorted out.

Provy has not played well. Sanheim continues to be inconsistent. Provy on most teams is easily a top 4. Sanheim is not. He’s a bottom pairing guy that can elevate his play to a top 4 role on occasion. He skates very good but really doesn’t do anything else very good. He doesn’t score much…he doesn’t defend particularly well. Farabee has a chance to be a good top 6 winger….skill and drive are there. TK has regressed…to me he’s one of the biggest disappointment this year and last.
- landros 2

Yes, this is my feeling as well. I don't see it with Sanheim. He makes these rushes from time to time that end in nothing, not even a shot. He defends poorly, and routinely looses battles in the slot and corners. Provorov has demonstrated that he cannot carry a defense, he often makes poor decisions and his offense has dried up also. I thought TK would be like Justin Williams but he just isn't doing it. Everyone lauds Lindblom in terms of his work ethic and decision making, but in the end he is not scoring and he has been playing the top 6 for a while now.

When Jason Myrtetus asked today, what is the problem with the Flyers, this is what I thought of the most, that our younger players have not contributed like they should or as we might have hoped they would. Consider the past two games against Detroit to compare to. Dylan Larkin 26, Tyler Bertuzzi 25 and Robby Fabbri 26 are their young core and you got Seider 20, Raymond 19 and Zadina 22 coming right behind them. Their future is bright, but the Flyers not so much unless this next wave of young talent hits for them.

Please no Trump quotes….you were doing so well..
- landros 2

Trump? Who is this Trump that you refer to?

Well, that's the rub. The Flyers have been burned giving up on younger players; Sharp and Williams come to mind. I'm not suggesting they should give up on these players, just questioning what their ceiling really is.
- jd250

I don't think they should give up on them either but I am open to youth for youth trades. Or even using to move up in the draft if possible. They however have to have a balance and not leave the team completely void of veteran support. However I don't think we have to worry about that because this organization has the delusional belief that a few moves and their right back in it.

I don't think they should give up on them either but I am open to youth for youth trades. Or even using to move up in the draft if possible. They however have to have a balance and not leave the team completely void of veteran support. However I don't think we have to worry about that because this organization has the delusional belief that a few moves and their right back in it.
- MJL

Maybe Scott believe that, but I think Fletcher and his staff know its going to be a long haul. When Briere was on with Jason Myrtetus, he indicated that he was expecting a multi year process to retool.

I wouldn't go that far. Milbury is a loser.

Fletch, for all his mistakes and shortcomings, is just your garden variety NHL GM that can't get out of their own way. Not being a genius or having an extraordinary quality doesn't make you a loser... it just makes you dime a dozen.

Flyers are in such a deep hole that an average GM simply stands no chance. They need somebody to come in and walk on water or this poop will never get sorted out.
- Tomahawk

With the organizational philosophy that they have, they need the 2nd coming of Keith Allen. Not going to happen. They really need someone to come in who has the weight to tell them that they're F'ed up and put them on the right course.

I wouldn't go that far. Milbury is a loser.

Fletch, for all his mistakes and shortcomings, is just your garden variety NHL GM that can't get out of their own way. Not being a genius or having an extraordinary quality doesn't make you a loser... it just makes you dime a dozen.

Flyers are in such a deep hole that an average GM simply stands no chance. They need somebody to come in and walk on water or this poop will never get sorted out.
- Tomahawk

Well, we have Briere now and he speaks French, so we are all set!

Maybe Scott believe that, but I think Fletcher and his staff know its going to be a long haul. When Briere was on with Jason Myrtetus, he indicated that he was expecting a multi year process to retool.
- jd250

I have not seen any information which suggests that Scott and Fletcher are not on the same page. Briere is the equivalent of an intern at the GM level.

Fletcher has been a GM for over 12 seasons. Has he ever brought home the prize? By your standards, he is a loser.
- MJL

As would Clarkie as a GM. Yet, there he sits. Chuckie/Bobby running the show that no one wants to see.

What do people think about David Quinn coaching the Flyers next season?
- jd250

I joked about this earlier today. He’s a Boston guy with a poor nhl track record. Sounds like a perfect fit.

if you guys were Avs fans, would you be upset if you gave up newhook for a rental? or would you land on the side of (frank) yeah we are going for it, thats just the cost of taking the plunge.

if you guys were Avs fans, would you be upset if you gave up newhook for a rental? or would you land on the side of (frank) yeah we are going for it, thats just the cost of taking the plunge.
- stayinthefnnet

The latter but if I was an Avs fan, I may want a defenseman.

With the organizational philosophy that they have, they need the 2nd coming of Keith Allen. Not going to happen. They really need someone to come in who has the weight to tell them that they're F'ed up and put them on the right course.
- MJL

They need to hire a GM from a professionally run franchise that hires smart people, who picks smart people for important positions and let him remake this thing. Our insular thing won't really allow that. We would not go to Pittsburgh, Carolina, Tampa or St. Louis for a new GM because our delusional FO still thinks that they are on track to do something interesting in the future. Also, someone from one of these organizations is likely to send the senior advisers packing to go home and enjoy their retirements but to be sure to come back for alumni events. That will get them vetoed early in the process. Instead, we get Chucky/Bobby running the worst poop show this town has seen in a long time with no relief in sight.

With the organizational philosophy that they have, they need the 2nd coming of Keith Allen. Not going to happen. They really need someone to come in who has the weight to tell them that they're F'ed up and put them on the right course.
- MJL

The best we could probably hope for under present circumstances would be for them to hire Babcock or something, and have him mind (frank)/strong arm Fletch into getting him the players he needs to play possession hockey. Babs could have Frost list his teammates in order of work ethic too, that would be fun.

They're just not forward thinking enough to do a Leafs style front-office shakeup. It's retread city.

if you guys were Avs fans, would you be upset if you gave up newhook for a rental? or would you land on the side of (frank) yeah we are going for it, thats just the cost of taking the plunge.
- stayinthefnnet

I would get giving up Newhook if they thought this was their one shot for a cup but they’re fairly young. They shouldn’t be that desperate for a rental.

We need him right now for what? To get a lower draft pick? Hayes is destined to become an overpaid bottom 6 role player.





The Niskanen trade was an outstanding trade.



Braun has been a good player but it was another overpay by Fletcher. Draft picks were more important and they could've added a vet defenseman on a cheap deal in free agency without giving up future assets. Fletcher also bought out Schlemko I believe to get the cap space to make the move. Both were made from the wrong perspective of trying to win now.



Ristolainen has not come close to be a solid 4th defenseman. He is at best a mediocre player. The Flyers gave up 3 top 60 draft picks, Gostisbehere and Haag to add Ristolainen. It was an awful trade.




Don't even have to be a GM to figure this one out. When a team is willing to trade you a player who when healthy is a legit RH top pairing defenseman for what the Flyers gave up, you have to stop and think. No other team in the league was willing to take on Ellis 6 years remaining on his contract and beat that offer? It's the equivalent of a used cars salesman giving you a great deal. To label this deal as working out? Not much to be said further.



Good solid deal and I love Atkinson as a player. The issue with this trade is that it filled a hole but created a hole.



No complaints about this one but not a difference maker.



Disagree completely. Fletcher has not been trying to keep Hextall's plan together. He has mortgaged the future, screwed up the cap and set the team back. The injuries this season are going to bail him out from the cluster (frank) of his overall work as a GM.



Hextall's drafting was not poor. It was solid. In 5 drafts, Hextall supplied the team with a starting goaltender, a top pair defenseman, a 2nd pair defenseman. two top 6 wingers as well as drafting I believe 10 NHL players overall. He did not however add any elite players.



You missed a number of exceptions. Middle six players are valuable to a team. Especially if they were selected with lower picks.

It is a false narrative to say that he did not listen to the people whose job it was to evaluate players. People want to look at one pick, the Patrick pick and then state that he didn't listen to the scouts. Hextall drafted 42 players over 5 drafts. I'm quite sure he listened to the scouts. Hextall drafted Patrick, who at the time was a consensus top 2 pick. Labeled the most NHL ready player in the draft and a future #1 NHL center. It didn't work out.








No complaints about this one but not a difference maker.






Hextall's drafting was not poor. It was solid. In 5 drafts, Hextall supplied the team with a starting goaltender, a top pair defenseman, a 2nd pair defenseman. two top 6 wingers as well as drafting I believe 10 NHL players overall. He did not however add any elite players.



You missed a number of exceptions. Middle six players are valuable to a team. Especially if they were selected with lower picks.

It is a false narrative to say that he did not listen to the people whose job it was to evaluate players. People want to look at one pick, the Patrick pick and then state that he didn't listen to the scouts. Hextall drafted 42 players over 5 drafts. I'm quite sure he listened to the scouts. Hextall drafted Patrick, who at the time was a consensus top 2 pick. Labeled the most NHL ready player in the draft and a future #1 NHL center. It didn't work out.



Hextall has been gone for 3+ years. It is far more Fletcher, Scott's and the Flyers country club's failure. They made a huge mistake organizationally moving away from Hextall's approach. A huge mistake. It's why the team is in the spot they currently are.
The injuries are a blessing in disguise that will help lessen the damage done by the actions from the organizational wide incompetence.
- MJL

Hextall has been gone for 3 years that doesnt change the fact that the team is built around the mess he created. You dont need to draft bottom 6 players. They are a dime a dozen.

For a guy you think drafted well, this team lacks any sort of young talent. He made a few good picks, every GM hits a couple. At the end of the day this team was just as bare when Hextall left than when he left. Fletcher hasnt mortgaged anything. He removed non essential players and picks.

At the end of the day

The players hextall brought in through the draft havent been good enough. 3 Year later we are still suffering from how bare the cupboards were. Hextall changed nothing. He plotted this course. At the end of the day the best thing Fletcher could have done was tear down everything Hextall built. Adding JVR was supposed to be a step forward and all we did was go backwards. Hence why he got fired. For someone who boasts about how Hextall rfilled the cupboards, the cupboards are bare and that has nothing to do with Fletcher as he hasnt moved prospects.

Fletcher will eventually be fired. I dont doubt that but the next GM is going to come in and do the same thing. Try to build around what this team has which is not much.

Fletcher built this team around the young players Hextall added and they have not lived up to the Hype.

Konecny is at best a 3rd line winger

Lindblom is likely another 3rd line guy.

Hart has bounced back for sure but you cant discount the fact he is playing well in an environment where theres no pressure on him to succeed due to the state of the team. When the pressure was on last season he caved.

Provorov hasnt really lived up to the #1 D position. More like #2 guy right now

Sanheim is a 3rd pair Dman

Aside from Farabee no other young player has panned out as expected.

Frost might even not develop into a top 6 guy

These were the young players Fletcher was supposed to build the team around. These are the guys who have been reasons for our struggles whether it be struggling or just not living up to expectations

Not to mention all the other busts Hextall brought in via the draft. Rubtsov, Myers Laberge, O'Brien, Nolan Patrick, Strome, Ratcliffe, Allison.

Thats our future! Career AHLers or in Allisons case Morin 2.0.

By all means you can fault Fletcher in some capacities because the team hasnt made progress to this point but Hextall is just as responsible and he was in fact not a good GM. That doesnt mean he cant improve. In Pittsburgh with Burke he is set up to learn how to be a better GM but as far as his time with Philly, he was not a good GM.

Despite the season we have had Fletcher is still in charge. So his tenure is not defined yet. This season is the best thing to happen to this team. It gives us the chance to restock the farm and maybe actually get some potential top talent. Drafting bottom pair Dmen and bottom 6 Forwards is not successful drafting. These guys are a dime a dozen in the Free Agency pool.

With Fletchers draft success we might actually improve the farm team status. That is why Frost, Zamula, Brink, Foerester and York are better to stay in the AHL because we need to make damn sure they develop because beyond them we have nothing in those positions.

People want to go on about not going for Eichel but the fact is we never had the pieces to make a legit offer. Buffalo got a lot for Eichel. Tuch and Krebs are 1st round picks and they still got a 2022 1st and a 2nd round pick on top of that. Pretty much Three 1sts and a 2nd. Buffalo would not take Couturier, they arent in a position to utilize Couturier. He's now in his prime, his window is starting to close. He isnt a piece for a rebuilding team. He's a piece for a contending team.

I would get giving up Newhook if they thought this was their one shot for a cup but they’re fairly young. They shouldn’t be that desperate for a rental.
- hereticpride

It's not a Joe Sakic type of move at all. It's a Bob Clarke/Paul Holmgren type of move.

Not a Fletcher fan, though he didn't mortgage the future. Trading a 1st and 2-2nds isn't mortgaging the future.

Fletcher also miscalculated how good the players were that the Saint left behind on the roster and in the minors. That failure is on him for not recognizing this from jump street.

I would get giving up Newhook if they thought this was their one shot for a cup but they’re fairly young. They shouldn’t be that desperate for a rental.
- hereticpride

thats my view as well. the cap savings with a potential top six type guy on an ELC is huge for a potentially cap strapped contending team with a window for the next 5 plus years.

Hextall has been gone for 3 years that doesnt change the fact that the team is built around the mess he created. You dont need to draft bottom 6 players. They are a dime a dozen.

For a guy you think drafted well, this team lacks any sort of young talent. He made a few good picks, every GM hits a couple. At the end of the day this team was just as bare when Hextall left than when he left. Fletcher hasnt mortgaged anything. He removed non essential players and picks.

At the end of the day

The players hextall brought in through the draft havent been good enough. 3 Year later we are still suffering from how bare the cupboards were. Hextall changed nothing. He plotted this course. At the end of the day the best thing Fletcher could have done was tear down everything Hextall built. Adding JVR was supposed to be a step forward and all we did was go backwards. Hence why he got fired. For someone who boasts about how Hextall rfilled the cupboards, the cupboards are bare and that has nothing to do with Fletcher as he hasnt moved prospects.

Fletcher will eventually be fired. I dont doubt that but the next GM is going to come in and do the same thing. Try to build around what this team has which is not much.

Fletcher built this team around the young players Hextall added and they have not lived up to the Hype.

Konecny is at best a 3rd line winger

Lindblom is likely another 3rd line guy.

Hart has bounced back for sure but you cant discount the fact he is playing well in an environment where theres no pressure on him to succeed due to the state of the team. When the pressure was on last season he caved.

Provorov hasnt really lived up to the #1 D position. More like #2 guy right now

Sanheim is a 3rd pair Dman

Aside from Farabee no other young player has panned out as expected.

Frost might even not develop into a top 6 guy

These were the young players Fletcher was supposed to build the team around. These are the guys who have been reasons for our struggles whether it be struggling or just not living up to expectations

Not to mention all the other busts Hextall brought in via the draft. Rubtsov, Myers Laberge, O'Brien, Nolan Patrick, Strome, Ratcliffe, Allison.

Thats our future! Career AHLers or in Allisons case Morin 2.0.

By all means you can fault Fletcher in some capacities because the team hasnt made progress to this point but Hextall is just as responsible and he was in fact not a good GM. That doesnt mean he cant improve. In Pittsburgh with Burke he is set up to learn how to be a better GM but as far as his time with Philly, he was not a good GM.

Despite the season we have had Fletcher is still in charge. So his tenure is not defined yet. This season is the best thing to happen to this team. It gives us the chance to restock the farm and maybe actually get some potential top talent. Drafting bottom pair Dmen and bottom 6 Forwards is not successful drafting. These guys are a dime a dozen in the Free Agency pool.

With Fletchers draft success we might actually improve the farm team status. That is why Frost, Zamula, Brink, Foerester and York are better to stay in the AHL because we need to make damn sure they develop because beyond them we have nothing in those positions.

People want to go on about not going for Eichel but the fact is we never had the pieces to make a legit offer. Buffalo got a lot for Eichel. Tuch and Krebs are 1st round picks and they still got a 2022 1st and a 2nd round pick on top of that. Pretty much Three 1sts and a 2nd. Buffalo would not take Couturier, they arent in a position to utilize Couturier. He's now in his prime, his window is starting to close. He isnt a piece for a rebuilding team. He's a piece for a contending team.
- xShoot4WarAmpsx

When Hexy got canned, we were consistent goaltending away from regularly making the playoffs. Cliff brought a bias for action that would take us to the next level. How is that next level working out for us? Not so well, it seems. He hired the wrong coach whom he had to fire and has spent all of our salary cap with worse results. Now, we are apparently tanking in the hope that we might get a high pick. Some bias. Some action. Some outcome. Nice going Dave S. I hope Bobby Clarke lets you get a lot of jock-sniffing in so that you can feel like you are doing something right.

They need to hire a GM from a professionally run franchise that hires smart people, who picks smart people for important positions and let him remake this thing. Our insular thing won't really allow that. We would not go to Pittsburgh, Carolina, Tampa or St. Louis for a new GM because our delusional FO still thinks that they are on track to do something interesting in the future. Also, someone from one of these organizations is likely to send the senior advisers packing to go home and enjoy their retirements but to be sure to come back for alumni events. That will get them vetoed early in the process. Instead, we get Chucky/Bobby running the worst poop show this town has seen in a long time with no relief in sight.
- iamscore2day

The right move would be to steal Eric Tulsky from Carolina. He's from the area, a Flyers fan, it would be his dream gig. Maybe the smartest guy working in the game right now.

But with Dave Scott deferring to our Dear Senior Advisors, there's no way in hell a hire like that would happen. They'll keep Fletch, because Bob Clarke loves him. And they'll hire some dippoop like Torts or Randy Carlyle to keep the hamster wheel turning. And they'll try to make the POs next season again.

Hextall has been gone for 3 years that doesnt change the fact that the team is built around the mess he created. You dont need to draft bottom 6 players. They are a dime a dozen.



- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Hextall didn't create a mess, he inherited one. LOL. A team with major cap issues and no prospect base. Hextall straightened out the cap and had the team better positioned for the future than it is now after he left.

For a guy you think drafted well, this team lacks any sort of young talent. He made a few good picks, every GM hits a couple. At the end of the day this team was just as bare when Hextall left than when he left. Fletcher hasnt mortgaged anything. He removed non essential players and picks.



- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Stating that this team lacks any sort of young talent in inaccurate and misguided. Your comment that the team was just as bare when Hextall left is also not accurate. Fletcher has traded multiple high draft picks and capped out the team with veteran players who are far more likely to be cap anchors than key players on a legit cup contending team.

At the end of the day

The players hextall brought in through the draft havent been good enough. 3 Year later we are still suffering from how bare the cupboards were. Hextall changed nothing. He plotted this course. At the end of the day the best thing Fletcher could have done was tear down everything Hextall built. Adding JVR was supposed to be a step forward and all we did was go backwards. Hence why he got fired. For someone who boasts about how Hextall rfilled the cupboards, the cupboards are bare and that has nothing to do with Fletcher as he hasnt moved prospects.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

I disagree that Hextall changed nothing. He added some quality players to the team and was not given a chance to finish what he started. Hextall got fired because the country club got restless and the incompetent organization would not further commit to what needed to be done. Now since Fletcher took over, the team is worst positioned. The injuries may partially bail them out and get them a better pick.

Fletcher will eventually be fired. I dont doubt that but the next GM is going to come in and do the same thing. Try to build around what this team has which is not much.

Fletcher built this team around the young players Hextall added and they have not lived up to the Hype.

Konecny is at best a 3rd line winger

Lindblom is likely another 3rd line guy.

Hart has bounced back for sure but you cant discount the fact he is playing well in an environment where theres no pressure on him to succeed due to the state of the team. When the pressure was on last season he caved.

Provorov hasnt really lived up to the #1 D position. More like #2 guy right now

Sanheim is a 3rd pair Dman


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

.

Koenecny is a 2nd line winger. Sanheim is a 2nd pair defenseman. Hart has all the talent and ability to be a quality #1 NHL goaltender. If they ever get a coaching staff in here that can fix the teams play, we might see that more. Lindblom is a quality player and is the kind of player that every good team needs as a 3rd line winger.
Provorov is ultimately probably better off as a #2 but he's played as the team's #1 since he's been here. He is a better player than given credit for.

Aside from Farabee no other young player has panned out as expected.

Frost might even not develop into a top 6 guy

These were the young players Fletcher was supposed to build the team around. These are the guys who have been reasons for our struggles whether it be struggling or just not living up to expectations

Not to mention all the other busts Hextall brought in via the draft. Rubtsov, Myers Laberge, O'Brien, Nolan Patrick, Strome, Ratcliffe, Allison.

Thats our future! Career AHLers or in Allisons case Morin 2.0.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

It would help if the Flyers weren't incompetent in developing young players.

By all means you can fault Fletcher in some capacities because the team hasnt made progress to this point but Hextall is just as responsible and he was in fact not a good GM. That doesnt mean he cant improve. In Pittsburgh with Burke he is set up to learn how to be a better GM but as far as his time with Philly, he was not a good GM.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

Fletcher was mandated to improve the team but overall he has done an awful job with the Flyers. Hextall was solid here. Not perfect and made some mistakes but he moved the team forward.

Despite the season we have had Fletcher is still in charge. So his tenure is not defined yet. This season is the best thing to happen to this team. It gives us the chance to restock the farm and maybe actually get some potential top talent. Drafting bottom pair Dmen and bottom 6 Forwards is not successful drafting. These guys are a dime a dozen in the Free Agency pool.

With Fletchers draft success we might actually improve the farm team status. That is why Frost, Zamula, Brink, Foerester and York are better to stay in the AHL because we need to make damn sure they develop because beyond them we have nothing in those positions.


- xShoot4WarAmpsx

The Flyers have mishandled Frost all season and right now having Frost and York in the AHL is incompetence. Both belong in the NHL. York playing with Braun and Frost on a scoring line with the Flyers top offensive players.

Not a Fletcher fan, though he didn't mortgage the future. Trading a 1st and 2-2nds isn't mortgaging the future.

Fletcher also miscalculated how good the players were that the Saint left behind on the roster and in the minors. That failure is on him for not recognizing this from jump street.
- hello it's me 2050

Bingo.

The right move would be to steal Eric Tulsky from Carolina. He's from the area, a Flyers fan, it would be his dream gig. Maybe the smartest guy working in the game right now.

But with Dave Scott deferring to our Dear Senior Advisors, there's no way in hell a hire like that would happen. They'll keep Fletch, because Bob Clarke loves him. And they'll hire some dippoop like Torts or Randy Carlyle to keep the hamster wheel turning. And they'll try to make the POs next season again.
- Tomahawk

This is the only time in my life where I've felt that as a Flyers fan, I'm completely screwed.