26 hours remaining

Teams have won without a franchise QB, outliers for sure, but Denver's last Super Bowl was with a super gimped and dead armed Peyton Manning that won solely because of Von Miller. Philidelphia won using super backup Nick Foles against GOAT Brady, Seattle won when Wilson was in his second season as a starter and that really was more of the Legion of Boom than anything.

The point is, Wilson wanted far too much control over the team, he got OCs fired and ended up breaking up the defense because of his need for control. There were signs years before last off-season's trade demand that the team was having issues with Wilson with the defense getting pissed at the offense (namely Sherman before he was cut and signed with the 49ers). A lot of it can be traced back to the loss to the Patriots in Super Bowl 49 when they passed the ball on the goal line and got it intercepted rather then have Lynch run it. There was speculation that it wasn't Pete or his OC that called that play, but Wilson himself who wanted to be the hero and get a Super Bowl MVP to pump up his prestige.

The Seahawks will be fine, they'll suck for 2 or 3 years, Pete will retire and then they'll gradually get back to being a top team in the league. Wilson won't last long in Denver where they eat QBs for breakfast if they don't win a Super Bowl, and in that division where they have Mahommes and several incredible edge rushers? Yeah, good luck with that.
- DariusKnight

Of course teams have won without a franchise QB, but as I was saying in the past 5 years or so it's shifted more and more towards being a QB/passing focused league.

Wilson definitely wanted more control, and there were definite fissures after the SB loss... lots of talk around it, lots of hearsay, lots of ego, but that broke the team.

Can't wait for Pete to retire. Loved what he did for the team, but the league has changed and he hasn't. He even admitted to that stubbornness/inflexibility this year.

I think Wilson will be fine in Denver. But man oh man, that division is INSANE. Mahomes, Herbert, Wilson, Carr... gonna be fun to be an outsider watching

26 hours remaining
- Reubenkincade

Might need another AGM hired

Good call, just saw the same being speculated on Twitter


Not a fan of that trade unless something worthwhile is added to Dermott
- Nucker101

I agree, but maybe that is the best offer they get for Motte.
We all know what the hysteria will be if they lose him for nothing.
I remember the whining by the fans when Motte and Jokinen were the return for Vanek, or whoever it was. It was deemed a bad trade by most of the fans.

Elliotte Friedman
@FriedgeHNIC
·
12m
Robert Hagg likely to FLA, with the space. They were talking about a 5th-rounder

5th for a depth D.

Might need another AGM hired
- Nucker101

Lol

5th for a depth D.
- manvanfan

Hunt should fetch at least a 4th

I agree, but maybe that is the best offer they get for Motte.
We all know what the hysteria will be if they lose him for nothing.
I remember the whining by the fans when Motte and Jokinen were the return for Vanek, or whoever it was. It was deemed a bad trade by most of the fans.
- Reubenkincade

In relation to the previous two times Vanek had been signed and traded it was pretty underwhelming. Worked out ok player wise I guess, but hasn’t really helped them take a step forward, and now they either need to pay him, trade him or let him walk.

Good call, just saw the same being speculated on Twitter
Not a fan of that trade unless something worthwhile is added to Dermott
- Nucker101

JFresh

A deep dive on Travis Dermott was the first piece I wrote for
@EPRinkside
. It's two seasons out of date (January 2021) but I'm still looking forward to seeing Dermott get a chance in a new environment.

https://eprinkside.com/20...-shine-in-a-top-four-role

And if you have EP ringside to unlock the article.

The whole scenario reminds me of Vince Dunn in STL. People talked about him getting more minutes and a bigger role and he deserves it. Only reason why he was any good was because he was sheltered on a good team with a good defensive structure.

With the right partner and still being in a 3rd pairing role. McDermott can be more than he has been in Toronto. A top 4 role though. I can't see it.

I agree, but maybe that is the best offer they get for Motte.
We all know what the hysteria will be if they lose him for nothing.
I remember the whining by the fans when Motte and Jokinen were the return for Vanek, or whoever it was. It was deemed a bad trade by most of the fans.
- Reubenkincade

In the end, it’ll all mean very little in the big picture if Motte is traded for a player/pick that doesn’t pan out.

Hunt should fetch at least a 4th
- Reubenkincade

That's a stretch, maybe a mid 5th

And if you have EP ringside to unlock the article.

The whole scenario reminds me of Vince Dunn in STL. People talked about him getting more minutes and a bigger role and he deserves it. Only reason why he was any good was because he was sheltered on a good team with a good defensive structure.

With the right partner and still being in a 3rd pairing role. McDermott can be more than he has been in Toronto. A top 4 role though. I can't see it.
- manvanfan

Yup

This is where relying on fancy stats alone (frank)s you over.

In the end, it’ll all mean very little in the big picture if Motte is traded for a player/pick that doesn’t pan out.
- Nucker101

That's something, I've always liked about TB. Even when it doesn't work out. They still look to get something.

Asset management has been

That's a stretch, maybe a mid 5th
- manvanfan

He’d clear waivers. Most depth guys that get moved at TDL have some size/grit or both.

In relation to the previous two times Vanek had been signed and traded it was pretty underwhelming. Worked out ok player wise I guess, but hasn’t really helped them take a step forward, and now they either need to pay him, trade him or let him walk.
- 1970vintage

Sadly enough, the Canucks have improved very little, if at all, in the 4 seasons Motte has been here.

That's a stretch, maybe a mid 5th
- manvanfan

Sold.

And if you have EP ringside to unlock the article.

The whole scenario reminds me of Vince Dunn in STL. People talked about him getting more minutes and a bigger role and he deserves it. Only reason why he was any good was because he was sheltered on a good team with a good defensive structure.

With the right partner and still being in a 3rd pairing role. McDermott can be more than he has been in Toronto. A top 4 role though. I can't see it.
- manvanfan

The other way to look at this is its growing pains of a guy moving into top minutes. Will be interesting to see how/if he improves

Yup

This is where relying on fancy stats alone (frank)s you over.
- Nucker101

Exactly, you watch his game and you just can see that it's not going to happen. Dude is not going to be a top 4 regular guy on a good team. That's not to say a player can't ever change or grow.

That's one of those situations where you take the gamble but for very little.

In this scenario. Leafs wants Hamonic and are willing to pay a 3rd (hypothetically) Allvin says throw in McDermott as well and they are like, sure that helps our cap.

You aren't having to pay anything for him so no risk and could be all reward.

In the end, it’ll all mean very little in the big picture if Motte is traded for a player/pick that doesn’t pan out.
- Nucker101

In the end, they have to start somewhere.
Would prefer seeing one or both Boeser and Garland traded, to start.
I would really like to see Brock gone, he has to be the softest and easiest player to play against.

Exactly, you watch his game and you just can see that it's not going to happen. Dude is not going to be a top 4 regular guy on a good team. That's not to say a player can't ever change or grow.

That's one of those situations where you take the gamble but for very little.

In this scenario. Leafs wants Hamonic and are willing to pay a 3rd (hypothetically) Allvin says throw in McDermott as well and they are like, sure that helps our cap.

You aren't having to pay anything for him so no risk and could be all reward.
- manvanfan

Totally agree

The other way to look at this is its growing pains of a guy moving into top minutes. Will be interesting to see how/if he improves
- neem55

Seattle isn't the best team but his defensive play contributes to that. I don't think he's a bad player but I think after this year he has shown that unless you have a strong front 3 in front of him, he's a 3rd pairing guy. That you are paying 4M for per season.

Yup

This is where relying on fancy stats alone (frank)s you over.
- Nucker101

Did your reliance on the 5v5 stats for Garland make you reconsider this

In the end, they have to start somewhere.
Would prefer seeing one or both Boeser and Garland traded, to start.
I would really like to see Brock gone, he has to be the softest and easiest player to play against.
- Reubenkincade

Canucks are in a position where they basically need to pull off a couple of home runs. Either by drafting great or making a steal of a trade.


The type of trade that looks okay in the moment but turns out to be a steal where you get a long term core player and didn’t give up a high pick or long term core player in return.

Did your reliance on the 5v5 stats for Garland make you reconsider this
- Reubenkincade

That and a few other things.

Seattle isn't the best team but his defensive play contributes to that. I don't think he's a bad player but I think after this year he has shown that unless you have a strong front 3 in front of him, he's a 3rd pairing guy. That you are paying 4M for per season.
- manvanfan

Similar to Dermott, is he really as good as he ever is going to be? Chychrun is having a garbage year, arguably worse than Dunn, everyone seems to still hold him in high regard yet its his first year playing top pair.