Ive been saying this exact thing for two years. Its hard to do your job when you don't trust the guy next to you to do his.
- MBFlyerfan

I have faith that yandle will do the job we need him to do tonight.

This is something good to look at when you see how poorly Provy has played away from a reliable partner.
- ClaudeFather

No doubt about it. Not just a defense partner but a team that is poor in coverage and spends too much time defending. It wears a player down.

I have faith that yandle will do the job we need him to do tonight.
- Just5

He has been exceeding OUR expectations all season long.

That's already gone. Bill wrote about it in the blog. On paper, they sent down York and Willman.
- MJL

What!? York was sent down??

More from Giroux on the score App regarding Florida. He started looking when the Flyers were out of the playoffs, watching games, and kept coming back to Florida. He and his wife talked for a few weeks every day approaching the deadline and it was always Florida, it never changed.

Some people suffer from bad trade derangement syndrome.

Because the Risto trade included the Flyers giving up too many assets (see the 2nd rd pick), it seems some suffer from an inability to analyze his play. Also also see the Atkinson trade as an example.

No one thinks the Flyers received fair value in that Risto deal. Even the GM admitted they gave up a ton.

However, some of us can turn the page and analyze his play, especially in person.

Risto is a 2nd pairing guy soon to make 5.1 mill. That’s about right.

Yes, he has coverage issues. He does. Sanheim has issues in his own end as well, but you live with it cause Sanheim he can fly and drives the play down the ice.

You live with Risto’s issues cause he is downright nasty and clears the front of the porch in addition to having good speed for a nasty 6.4 dman and has some good offensive skills see his 4 x 40 years..

I don’t agree they should play together. I feel they both have too many breakdowns, but they are still by far their best pairing.

Many pointed to his analytics when criticizing the trade. They said the Flyers don’t use analytics only to be reminded by Bill here that is not the case. At the time their analytics was avg to above avg. They signed off on the trade.

Then the Flyers grow their staff to be top 3 in the league. They review the prospect of giving Risto 5.1 w term and they sign off on that too. Yes, they signed off this was not Fletcher going against his staff like his predecessor.

7 other teams also were willing to give a1st rounder plus plus for him. Their analytic staffs also signed off.

Do you think maybe just maybe the NHL and their analytic staffs are just not as concerned with the free metrics as Joe GM here?

Maybe they are looking at other numbers. There is a reason why teams spend millions on traveling scouts and analytics staffs.

Otherwise the flyers should just have an intern read the free metrics available and run their team that way. They could fire everyone. Scouts, analytics staff.. fire all of them cause the cracker jacks gms here could run the team better just geeking out on corsi numbers all day.

You don’t spend all that money on increasing a portion of your staff and then turn around and ignore their guidance. They were on board.

What!? York was sent down??
- SuperSchennBros

paper transaction only

No doubt about it. Not just a defense partner but a team that is poor in coverage and spends too much time defending. It wears a player down.
- MJL

Giroux doesn’t get to 900 points in 1000 games without playing with talent, whether he’s the best player on the ice or not. I’m sure Giroux himself would give Briere, Voracek, Hartnell, Simmonds and Jagr some credit. Who can Provorov credit when things are going well for him? One season of Niskanen and about 6 seconds of Ellis.

More from Giroux on the score App regarding Florida. He started looking when the Flyers were out of the playoffs, watching games, and kept coming back to Florida. He and his wife talked for a few weeks every day approaching the deadline and it was always Florida, it never changed.
- ClaudeFather

Tax free income, and lots of sunshine and golf courses! G for the win!

Some people suffer from bad trade derangement syndrome.

Because the Risto trade included the Flyers giving up too many assets (see the 2nd rd pick), it seems some suffer from an inability to analyze his play. Also also see the Atkinson trade as an example.

No one thinks the Flyers received fair value in that Risto deal. Even the GM admitted they gave up a ton.

However, some of us can turn the page and analyze his play, especially in person.

Risto is a 2nd pairing guy soon to make 5.1 mill. That’s about right.

Yes, he has coverage issues. He does. Sanheim has issues in his own end as well, but you live with it cause Sanheim he can fly and drives the play down the ice.

You live with Risto’s issues cause he is downright nasty and clears the front of the porch in addition to having good speed for a nasty 6.4 dman and has some good offensive skills see his 4 x 40 years..

I don’t agree they should play together. I feel they both have too many breakdowns, but they are still by far their best pairing.

Many pointed to his analytics when criticizing the trade. They said the Flyers don’t use analytics only to be reminded by Bill here that is not the case. At the time their analytics was avg to above avg. They signed off on the trade.

Then the Flyers grow their staff to be top 3 in the league. They review the prospect of giving Risto 5.1 w term and they sign off on that too. Yes, they signed off this was not Fletcher going against his staff like his predecessor.

7 other teams also were willing to give a1st rounder plus plus for him. Their analytic staffs also signed off.

Do you think maybe just maybe the NHL and their analytic staffs are just not as concerned with the free metrics as Joe GM here?

Maybe they are looking at other numbers. There is a reason why teams spend millions on traveling scouts and analytics staffs.

Otherwise the flyers should just have an intern read the free metrics available and run their team that way. They could fire everyone. Scouts, analytics staff.. fire all of them cause the cracker jacks gms here could run the team better just geeking out on corsi numbers all day.

You don’t spend all that money on increasing a portion of your staff and then turn around and ignore their guidance. They were on board.
- Joe Nardone

I will just leave this right here for you and the top end analytical team to digest and discuss:

https://www.trendsmap.com...tweet/1418630900456296450

paper transaction only
- corduroy

So he is in tonight? Thank god!

I saw Cam York play In Plymouth Michigan 5 months before we drafted him. Along with Jack Hughes and Cole Caufield. I’m not gonna lie, Caufield stood out among all of them. Brian rolston’s kid was on the team too.

A 1st and a good prospect for a 34 yr old still good rental forward seems about right to me. Folks are looking for some kinda scandal here. Why? Is it that people just love a good soap opera?

I don’t care if they had 30 teams or one team to deal G to. The trade seems fine to me. Like many here I have followed trade deadline deals for many many years. Unless G was going to resign wherever he went, his value was a 1st and a good prospect.

Don’t have a problem with the deadline deals. Non issue..
-Joe Nardone

I don't believe there was a scandal at all. The reality is Fletcher had his hands tied by only being able to negotiate with Florida, and you are right he did the best he could. My only complaint is it could have been even better if Fletcher even had even one other team to negotiate with, like say Colorado. But woulda, coulda, shoulda, its over now, G is on Florida and the Flyers got what seems to be a player in Tippet that has all the skills to be a legitimate top 6 forward in this league. Hopefully he has his head on straight, works hard, plays consistently and gives this team the talent they need. The Flyers need to get some positive things going, its been incredibly bad for too long around here.

I will just leave this right here for you and the top end analytical team to digest and discuss:

https://www.trendsmap.com...tweet/1418630900456296450
- corduroy

Immediate issue with this is we watch the games, he is not as bad as that chart portrays. That’s saying he’s one of the worst Dmen around. He can be an average second pair defender, he’s been playing well lately. How can you take that chart seriously after watching the games this year. Again, not saying he’s great but he’s sure as hell not that bad.

Some people suffer from bad trade derangement syndrome.

Because the Risto trade included the Flyers giving up too many assets (see the 2nd rd pick), it seems some suffer from an inability to analyze his play. Also also see the Atkinson trade as an example.

No one thinks the Flyers received fair value in that Risto deal. Even the GM admitted they gave up a ton.

However, some of us can turn the page and analyze his play, especially in person.

Risto is a 2nd pairing guy soon to make 5.1 mill. That’s about right.

Yes, he has coverage issues. He does. Sanheim has issues in his own end as well, but you live with it cause Sanheim he can fly and drives the play down the ice.

You live with Risto’s issues cause he is downright nasty and clears the front of the porch in addition to having good speed for a nasty 6.4 dman and has some good offensive skills see his 4 x 40 years..

I don’t agree they should play together. I feel they both have too many breakdowns, but they are still by far their best pairing.

Many pointed to his analytics when criticizing the trade. They said the Flyers don’t use analytics only to be reminded by Bill here that is not the case. At the time their analytics was avg to above avg. They signed off on the trade.

Then the Flyers grow their staff to be top 3 in the league. They review the prospect of giving Risto 5.1 w term and they sign off on that too. Yes, they signed off this was not Fletcher going against his staff like his predecessor.

7 other teams also were willing to give a1st rounder plus plus for him. Their analytic staffs also signed off.

Do you think maybe just maybe the NHL and their analytic staffs are just not as concerned with the free metrics as Joe GM here?

Maybe they are looking at other numbers. There is a reason why teams spend millions on traveling scouts and analytics staffs.

Otherwise the flyers should just have an intern read the free metrics available and run their team that way. They could fire everyone. Scouts, analytics staff.. fire all of them cause the cracker jacks gms here could run the team better just geeking out on corsi numbers all day.

You don’t spend all that money on increasing a portion of your staff and then turn around and ignore their guidance. They were on board.
- Joe Nardone

What is the basis for your ranking of the Flyers analytic staff to be top 3 in the league? What evidence is there that their analytic staff is effective or used effectively?

Ristolainen doesn't clear the porch, nor is he effective physically. What he does normally is take himself out of the play to make a hit. Or he pushes a player around AFTER a scoring chance or goal occurs. He bleeds scoring chances and goals on the ice. The only regular Flyers defenseman that is worse is Yandle.

The reason why Fletcher re-signed Ristolainen is simple. He played it safe and knows his job is on the line. The Flyers are going to lose two regular defenseman and Ellis is questionable on the right side. He doesn't want to be caught with a deficiency on the right side within the top 4 so he took the safe option. It's what a GM who lack planning and insight does. Makes moves just to make them instead of making the right moves at the right time. Fletcher painted himself into a hole and this is the result.

More from Giroux on the score App regarding Florida. He started looking when the Flyers were out of the playoffs, watching games, and kept coming back to Florida. He and his wife talked for a few weeks every day approaching the deadline and it was always Florida, it never changed.
- ClaudeFather

Still don’t buy it. Giroux is a rental. What happens next season. They over Analyzed some thing that’s only going to last three or four months?

So the Phantoms are dead last in their division and Fletcher just wasted 2 of their 4 remaining non-emergency call-ups. Would love to see Allison, Laczynski, Ratcliffe and Zamula up at some point but I guess there'll have to be injuries to see all four of them.

I don't believe there was a scandal at all. The reality is Fletcher had his hands tied by only being able to negotiate with Florida, and you are right he did the best he could. My only complaint is it could have been even better if Fletcher even had even one other team to negotiate with, like say Colorado. But woulda, coulda, shoulda, its over now, G is on Florida and the Flyers got what seems to be a player in Tippet that has all the skills to be a legitimate top 6 forward in this league. Hopefully he has his head on straight, works hard, plays consistently and gives this team the talent they need. The Flyers need to get some positive things going, its been incredibly bad for too long around here.
- jd250

It was what a week or so ago when you were posting that a return of Tippet as the main player coming back was not good enough. Now you say he has the skills to be a top 6 forward. Flip-flop-flip-flop.

Still don’t buy it. Giroux is a rental. What happens next season. They over Analyzed some thing that’s only going to last three or four months?
- SuperSchennBros

What? What aren’t you buying? What did they over analyze, they knew he had the opportunity to go to another team and they looked around.

No doubt about it. Not just a defense partner but a team that is poor in coverage and spends too much time defending. It wears a player down.
- MJL

At what point does Ivan need to be held accountable? It isn't all on the coaching and partner.

Immediate issue with this is we watch the games, he is not as bad as that chart portrays. That’s saying he’s one of the worst Dmen around. He can be an average second pair defender, he’s been playing well lately. How can you take that chart seriously after watching the games this year. Again, not saying he’s great but he’s sure as hell not that bad.
- ClaudeFather

The player I watch fits that bill. It's extremely accurate and has been his entire career. I think if fans watched more of actually good NHL defenseman play on other teams as much as they watch the Flyers. They'd see the difference.

This is something good to look at when you see how poorly Provy has played away from a reliable partner.
- ClaudeFather

Ive been saying this exact thing for two years. Its hard to do your job when you don't trust the guy next to you to do his.
- MBFlyerfan

We see that in the Flyers game. It's why coaching and playing within the system is so important. The Flyers have no consistency in that same regard. Breakdown after breakdown and running around. The Flyers are certainly not a fast team overall but they also play slow.
- MJL

I know it's not breaking news analysis, but reading the article really freshened things up in my mind. On paper the Flyers always seem to be a deep team, but their consistent play hasn't matched that in a long, long time. Most teams that have been having success tend to be held together by ONE major strong line, but over time fill in depth to get stronger. The Flyers on the other hand seem to try to jump stages and go right for depth.

The other thing that pops out right away is the fact is most teams that end up finding success have rough periods prior playing many young guys, where the Flyers always have to fill in with "experienced" vets that force young guys to "prove it". Vets do come with experience that can teach young guys the right way, but they also come with stubborn bad habits as well. You would think a team would want their young guys to go through the same thing at the same time to build that trust together.

A 1st and a good prospect for a 34 yr old still good rental forward seems about right to me. Folks are looking for some kinda scandal here. Why? Is it that people just love a good soap opera?

I don’t care if they had 30 teams or one team to deal G to. The trade seems fine to me. Like many here I have followed trade deadline deals for many many years. Unless G was going to resign wherever he went, his value was a 1st and a good prospect.

Don’t have a problem with the deadline deals. Non issue..
- Joe Nardone

Yeah.....wait until this kid turns into a stud

https://www.eliteprospect...470025/mackie-samoskevich

I read an article yesterday that for some reason jumped out at me:

https://milehighsports.co...quitting-hockey-as-a-kid/

The key part of the article for me was



I know if I had to worry about my job and someone else as well I would probably lose my passion for playing and always have a slow start to the game.
- Glak18

You mean like, ill go out on a limb here.......Ivan Provorov

Yeah.....wait until this kid turns into a stud

https://www.eliteprospect...470025/mackie-samoskevich
- THE BLACK HAND

Surprised the Flyers didn't go all in on another NCAA player to add to the bunch. Can never have too little 24 year old rookies that spend another 2 years developing in the AHL only to disappear.

Some people suffer from bad trade derangement syndrome.

Because the Risto trade included the Flyers giving up too many assets (see the 2nd rd pick), it seems some suffer from an inability to analyze his play. Also also see the Atkinson trade as an example.

No one thinks the Flyers received fair value in that Risto deal. Even the GM admitted they gave up a ton.

However, some of us can turn the page and analyze his play, especially in person.

Risto is a 2nd pairing guy soon to make 5.1 mill. That’s about right.

Yes, he has coverage issues. He does. Sanheim has issues in his own end as well, but you live with it cause Sanheim he can fly and drives the play down the ice.

You live with Risto’s issues cause he is downright nasty and clears the front of the porch in addition to having good speed for a nasty 6.4 dman and has some good offensive skills see his 4 x 40 years..

I don’t agree they should play together. I feel they both have too many breakdowns, but they are still by far their best pairing.

Many pointed to his analytics when criticizing the trade. They said the Flyers don’t use analytics only to be reminded by Bill here that is not the case. At the time their analytics was avg to above avg. They signed off on the trade.

Then the Flyers grow their staff to be top 3 in the league. They review the prospect of giving Risto 5.1 w term and they sign off on that too. Yes, they signed off this was not Fletcher going against his staff like his predecessor.

7 other teams also were willing to give a1st rounder plus plus for him. Their analytic staffs also signed off.

Do you think maybe just maybe the NHL and their analytic staffs are just not as concerned with the free metrics as Joe GM here?

Maybe they are looking at other numbers. There is a reason why teams spend millions on traveling scouts and analytics staffs.

Otherwise the flyers should just have an intern read the free metrics available and run their team that way. They could fire everyone. Scouts, analytics staff.. fire all of them cause the cracker jacks gms here could run the team better just geeking out on corsi numbers all day.

You don’t spend all that money on increasing a portion of your staff and then turn around and ignore their guidance. They were on board.
- Joe Nardone

It is so overblown he is nasty to play against as well as his clearing the front of the porch. His play is average. That is it. A team will never go far or win anything with him in a top 4 role.

Just curious are GM's, scouts, and whoever else infallible? Chuck has been chasing RR for years. So maybe just maybe his judgement is a little clouded.

Do you have any tangible evidence "they" were on board at all? Can you also provide any link that shows what each team has (number of employees) analytics wise on their staff.