Bill Meltzer: Free Agency: A "Reverse Kotkaniemi"?

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.

Bill Meltzer: Free Agency: A "Reverse Kotkaniemi"?
- bmeltzer

Not seeing the correlation between the pens keeping their players and this situation.

At some point Chuck the dunce will cave. He will fold under pressure as he is a terrible GM. Would make my day he gives up the Flyers 2023 1st. Even the Florida first it would be a joke to give up.

If JG really so badly wants to play here then he can make it happen. Simple as that. So we shall see how badly he wants it. What's even funnier Chuck the dunce knew well in advance he needed cap space for the hometown hero. Yet here we are him scrambling.

Bill what was the rush to sign Tony D? They could have worked out a deal and waited a little no then use the cap space for JG? OR was it a situation where the Flyers needed to get some press?

The Flyers are going to be bad with or without JG. People will show up to games but once we get into the dog days of January and February, and the Flyers are towards the bottom of the metro, it'll be an empty house again.

The Devils are primed to take a run at him(JG). Not the Flyers.

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

IMO they have an idea who would be no-tendered as I would think those players were offered in a trade. I don't think they misread it, Chuck has tunnel vision.

Bottom line Chuck is just not a good GM.

In bold: Both the current and former GM failed to grasp this concept. Which is 100% correct.

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

Hi JSaq, Long time no speak. Hope all is well.

I agree with your thoughts. We're in limbo and not committed to either path. I wasn't encouraged by the TDA trade because we could have waited. Was there really a lineup of teams waiting to get him?I doubt it.

As for what Bill suggests, that would be some fancy maneuvering if they did indeed sign him to a low amount 1 yr contract and then an 8 year. I doubt an agent would go for that however because what if the player gets hurt etc.. handshake deal out the window. Be interesting to see how it works out.

Bill Meltzer: Free Agency: A "Reverse Kotkaniemi"?

I'm not held accountable for selling tickets at the Wells Fargo Center. From the marketing and fan engagement sides, bringing in a marquee player would raise interest.



- bmeltzer

Hallelujah!

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

Nice to see you again Jsaq. Your knowledge and humor have never been replaced here. "Guacapoopie" must be 13 or so by now?!

The Flyers are going to be bad with or without JG. People will show up to games but once we get into the dog days of January and February, and the Flyers are towards the bottom of the metro, it'll be an empty house again.

The Devils are primed to take a run at him(JG). Not the Flyers.
- Pelle31Forever

I actually think that if the flyers signed JG AND we somehow have a healthy roster (Coots, Bee, Hayes ) Hart plays well as he did for most of last year, then we'd be a team that challenges for a playoff spot and that might get in. That's likely what is being sold to fans is that the team is in the hunt and that if you get in, anyone can win type of thing. But I don't see a contender which is the real issue.

Nice to see you again Jsaq. Your knowledge and humor have never been replaced here. "Guacapoopie" must be 13 or so by now?!
- PT21

Haha that's a blast from the past...

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

Look who’s back.

I love the creative thinking but there's zero chance of that happening. Why would a proven player who controls his destination take that much risk? Just because he grew up watching the laundry?

The absolute best scenario is that Chuck can't find the cap space and JG signs elsewhere. All of the other scenarios are far-fetched or massive asset management blunders.

Sure, having someone to market is great. But what puts butts in seats are wins. JG isn't going to fix their defensive problems (nor TDA). If they really need a marketing theme they should be promoting the kids and giving them a chance to shine.

I actually think that if the flyers signed JG AND we somehow have a healthy roster (Coots, Bee, Hayes ) Hart plays well as he did for most of last year, then we'd be a team that challenges for a playoff spot and that might get in. That's likely what is being sold to fans is that the team is in the hunt and that if you get in, anyone can win type of thing. But I don't see a contender which is the real issue.
- Hextall271

I agree with everything here, and maybe I am being a little bit of a homer but I am hoping Torts can get the younger players ( Cates, Tippett, Allison, York) playing up to their potential. Just maybe the team wont be as bad as everyone thinks. I absolutely would not be on board if CF deals the 1st for 2023, that simply cant be done. I wouldnt be surprised if a possible "multi player" deal is struck with Arizona if they are actually making room for JG

Welcome back! Just mentioned that popping into this place isn’t the same anymore.

As for the Flyers, you said exactly what I planned on waking up this morning. Most fans wanted it torn down, at least the ones that could see the writing on the wall. Only to be told they would be aggressively retooling.

Then they don’t trade three picks for DeBrincat, but trade them for Tony DeAngelo? And now they are surprised that they are going to be raked along the coals to move JVR? He had no foresight. None. They are a mess and the fact that Fletcher gets to keep his job is embarrassing.

Now you must find a way to bring in Gaudreau because nothing else makes sense. Backed themselves into the corner here.

Not seeing the correlation between the pens keeping their players and this situation.

At some point Chuck the dunce will cave. He will fold under pressure as he is a terrible GM. Would make my day he gives up the Flyers 2023 1st. Even the Florida first it would be a joke to give up.

If JG really so badly wants to play here then he can make it happen. Simple as that. So we shall see how badly he wants it. What's even funnier Chuck the dunce knew well in advance he needed cap space for the hometown hero. Yet here we are him scrambling.

Bill what was the rush to sign Tony D? They could have worked out a deal and waited a little no then use the cap space for JG? OR was it a situation where the Flyers needed to get some press?
- hello it's me 2050

The correlation is that another division rival found a way to get everyone they truly wanted under contract. It's no secret that the Flyers Plan A has been JG.

1) I am on the record in saying that I do not believe the Flyers' long-term interests are best served by tying themselves into any long-term deals right now and that cap space, an emphasis on asset management and giving some of the younger players in the organization an extended opportunity to take on bigger roles at the NHL level should be the more immediate steps. I believe there's a time to make a bold move to try to add a big-ticket player at the necessary cost, but that the time isn't now because there are so many other question marks and limited cap dollars.

The time to add the high priced vets is to complement and ascending team with young elite players already on the roster. The Flyers don't have their stamkos/hedman, MacKinnon/Makar, or even Crosby/Malkin/Fleury. And they don't want players like that because if they did they'd understand drafting 1-4 overall (and hitting on those picks) is necessary for long term success.

It feels like the PR department is driving the franchise, as people have said, to generate excitement to put people in the seats while neglecting that by december the seats will still be empty if the team doesn't win but hey the PR department did their job, you can't expect them to build a winning team as well.

The lack of any sort of long term plan is glaring but I doubt Fletcher is on the hotseat. Why? Because he doesn't make any decisions. For him to be held responsible he'd have to be responsible for something. Anyone who would fire him has agreed with everything he's done or else he wouldn't have done them.

I love the creative thinking but there's zero chance of that happening. Why would a proven player who controls his destination take that much risk? Just because he grew up watching the laundry?

The absolute best scenario is that Chuck can't find the cap space and JG signs elsewhere. All of the other scenarios are far-fetched or massive asset management blunders.

Sure, having someone to market is great. But what puts butts in seats are wins. JG isn't going to fix their defensive problems (nor TDA). If they really need a marketing theme they should be promoting the kids and giving them a chance to shine.
- atibus

What I will say is this, the agent and the Calgary GM stated last night that it's a family decision ie: wanting to be close to home. So I think right there, you narrow it down to Philly and NJ. Out of those two, if what I read is true, his wife works in Philly etc, and likely would prefer that they live there. If this aspect is really holding heavy weight, then I would say that the wives (or people) would rather live in Philly than NJ but regardless it's not big distance.

I wouldn't be shocked if today, they say..look Philly.. we want to come there, but can you make it work? Then it'll be up to chuck to tell him yea or nay.

One question, we see these reports from random twitter accounts saying a deal is in place with NJ, that's tampering and not likely correct right? The window to negotiate doesn't start til noon today?

Look who’s back.
- SuperSchennBros

How do you think the Pistons off season has gone so far?

Welcome back! Just mentioned that popping into this place isn’t the same anymore.

As for the Flyers, you said exactly what I planned on waking up this morning. Most fans wanted it torn down, at least the ones that could see the writing on the wall. Only to be told they would be aggressively retooling.

Then they don’t trade three picks for DeBrincat, but trade them for Tony DeAngelo? And now they are surprised that they are going to be raked along the coals to move JVR? He had no foresight. None. They are a mess and the fact that Fletcher gets to keep his job is embarrassing.

Now you must find a way to bring in Gaudreau because nothing else makes sense. Backed themselves into the corner here.
- Flyers1218

I would also like to know how those contract negotiations went seeing as how it was reported that TDA was asking for much less from Carolina in term and money to stay. My guess is that the Flyers bid against themselves with both the picks and contract.

CF must use a magic 8 ball as an advisor because he is all over the place.
Who is going to play goal behind Hart? I would assume Sandstrom at this point.
That is a leap of faith you can’t afford to take if your going all in on JG.
If Hart gets hurt your putting the season in the hands of an unknown player.
The flyers also can’t afford to trade either first round pick.
If you have thoughts of getting JG then the Deangelo trade makes even less sense.
Without looking at cap hits etc if the flyers held status quo on D even with knowing Ellis would be put on LTIR they could have held onto 1st rounders.
That may require a contract for JG to be back loaded.
Even the reported term of 7 years that NJ offered is to long.
I wouldn’t go past 4 years.
Just forget about it Chuck.

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

No doubt about it. Shows a complete lack of proper cap management skills. Chasing his own tail.

Good to see you post again.

My issue is that the Flyers seem to have misread the marketplace & are scrambling. They quickly expended valuable draft assets on DeAngelo, without waiting to see who would be non tendered. They re-signed Ristolainen, rather than flipping him for draft capital at the TDL. Now, the inability to clear space for a Gaudreau offer, despite buying out a popular player in Lindblom.

If you are going to go aggressive retool, do it. If you’re going to tear it down to the studs, then do that. Choosing the middle here is only going to prolong the issues and leave them with fewer assets to ultimately correct the problem.

I’m not saying Fletcher should trade the 2023 1st to free up space, I’m lamenting the moves that preceded this and has him over the barrell.
- Jsaquella

The middle ground is for scared dogs.

All the moves that have him over a barrel were not needed. All self inflicted.

The lack of any sort of long term plan is glaring but I doubt Fletcher is on the hotseat. Why? Because he doesn't make any decisions. For him to be held responsible he'd have to be responsible for something. Anyone who would fire him has agreed with everything he's done or else he wouldn't have done them.
- Flyers_01

Spot on!

Bill Meltzer: Free Agency: A "Reverse Kotkaniemi"?
- bmeltzer

https://twitter.com/charl...5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=

What surgery did he get Bill?

I agree with everything here, and maybe I am being a little bit of a homer but I am hoping Torts can get the younger players ( Cates, Tippett, Allison, York) playing up to their potential. Just maybe the team wont be as bad as everyone thinks. I absolutely would not be on board if CF deals the 1st for 2023, that simply cant be done. I wouldnt be surprised if a possible "multi player" deal is struck with Arizona if they are actually making room for JG
- 3flyerkids

Yeah. that's a likely scenario. I just DO NOT want to see high picks flying out the door. That is your insurance if the season does go off the rails.. you'd then get a lottery pick and it eases the pain for the franchise and fans.

I don't necessarily like the path they are on and haven't since the end of the 2019-2020 season when Nisky retired. Chuck has been scrambling since.

I won't however cheer against the team in hopes that they lose every game for the next ten years in the hope of landing a mcdavid as it doesn't guarantee success. Keep picks. Make smart trades from a position of strength, smart UFa signings and hope that you bring in the right coach and development staff to get the young prospects to their potential ceiling.

To me, the real crux of the issue with the team in recent years is the regression of their young players. You could say they all suck and were never any good, but that's not true. When they were properly supported (on and off ice), Provy, TK and Hart all excelled. Last two years, major regression. Whether it's coach or development staff, that's where we've failed. If by some chance those players get back to where they were or beyond, then this might be a different conversation. This is the biggest part the GM needs to get right. Figure out why they've regressed and rectify.