If the plan is to keep Frost and Tippett together, my hope is something much better then Noah Cates is on their left wing. Cates could be legit and I hope he is but we’re talking about a contract year for Morgan Frost and a break out season for both him and Tippett. I personally want to be in the mix with the most skilled guys on the team. Top six players and a lot of power play time.
- SuperSchennBros

i would love to see these 3 gel and become a formidable line. I like what I saw out of Tipper and Cates for the most part. I'm not sold on Frosty but he did play better near the end of the season. As many of us have said, the games didn't mean anything so who knows what these guys are really made of. JVR was producing more in the last 2 months when the games were meaningless. Tipper was noticeable out there so I'm hoping he continues to improve.

I’m not a Hakstol guy. I don’t think it was this ground breaking idea to put your three best players together in Giroux, Voracek and Couturier every time you’re down a goal in the third period. There was a lot to not like about Hakstol. He would absolutely not under and circumstance sit Chris Vandevalde who he had lower level history with and had no business in the nhl.
- SuperSchennBros

Agreed! If he wasn't Hexy's son's coach, he never would have gotten the job. Hak was a hack.

i would love to see these 3 gel and become a formidable line. I like what I saw out of Tipper and Cates for the most part. I'm not sold on Frosty but he did play better near the end of the season. As many of us have said, the games didn't mean anything so who knows what these guys are really made of. JVR was producing more in the last 2 months when the games were meaningless. Tipper was noticeable out there so I'm hoping he continues to improve.
- Don Nachbaur

This "games didn't mean anything" rationale doesn't hold water under any kind of scrutiny.

The games sure meant something to many of the teams they played down the stretch. And the games sure meant something to the players who were auditioning for their jobs/roles next season. The Flyers' chances were dead, but there was still plenty to play for.

Plus, it's generally accepted that it's harder to score later in the season when teams have their systems and chemistry down, versus earlier in the year when teams tends to have more breakdowns trying to get new players and system wrinkles worked in.

And it's not surprising at all that TK, JVR and Frost's production increased once Giroux was traded. All his prime PP and top-line minutes were divvied up to other players, and it's naturally easier to score in those situations.

Coaches like Tortorella who has had a lot of success relish situations like this. They are supremely confident in their abilities and believe that they an fix it.
- MJL

Like AV??

I know most have high hopes for Cates, I’m just not there yet. I need to see more. In my opinion his best game was against Pittsburgh at the end of the season but Pittsburgh didn’t show up that game. They didn’t even care. They were in the playoffs already playing against a non-factor in us.
- SuperSchennBros

He will top out as a bottom 6 forward, in a contending team more 4th line minutes than 3rd. A good nhl player, who can chip in. The flyers have the depth to stock the 3rd and 4th line, the blessing and the challenge

As far as the PP coach, he couldn’t do any worse than what we had last year. I am really wondering about our next captain. I love Giroux as a player, but I prefer the leadership style of Pronger as opposed to Giroux. The “lead by example” only works if everyone follows suit, think Yzerman becoming more defensively responsible and his team following his lead. That never happened here, and nothing was done by the team leaders to address it. Remember when the team actually had pride and would have players only meetings after bad games? When was the last time that happened, instead of just jumping in your Range Rover and driving back to your mansion to see your model quality wife...when you say it loud, it makes it harder to make the team meeting argument

AV is not a bad coach and neither were his assistants. Their failure is proof of the organization wide dysfunction of this franchise. Dave Scott is incompetent, Fletch is just a terrible GM as he has proved over a long time, our scouts can’t identify talent, our medical staff reminds of the “Dizzy Doctors” episode of the Three Stooges, our AHL can’t develop anyone or give them a solid pro foundation of how to play, our leaders can’t/don’t lead, our coaches can’t fix it because the players either won’t listen or aren’t good enough to execute, and if we have a “cap-ologist” employed they should be taken to Rittenhouse Square, tied to a pole, and publicly flogged.

A lot of things need to change before this team is good again. At least we should have some fights to watch will be a lot more entertaining than the 60 minute sleeping pill we have been taking 82 times a year for the last decade.

This "games didn't mean anything" rationale doesn't hold water under any kind of scrutiny.

The games sure meant something to many of the teams they played down the stretch. And the games sure meant something to the players who were auditioning for their jobs/roles next season. The Flyers' chances were dead, but there was still plenty to play for.

Plus, it's generally accepted that it's harder to score later in the season when teams have their systems and chemistry down, versus earlier in the year when teams tends to have more breakdowns trying to get new players and system wrinkles worked in.

And it's not surprising at all that TK, JVR and Frost's production increased once Giroux was traded. All his prime PP and top-line minutes were divvied up to other players, and it's naturally easier to score in those situations.
- Tomahawk

Sure it does as there is much less pressure.

AV is not a bad coach and neither were his assistants. Their failure is proof of the organization wide dysfunction of this franchise. Dave Scott is incompetent, Fletch is just a terrible GM as he has proved over a long time, our scouts can’t identify talent, our medical staff reminds of the “Dizzy Doctors” episode of the Three Stooges, our AHL can’t develop anyone or give them a solid pro foundation of how to play, our leaders can’t/don’t lead, our coaches can’t fix it because the players either won’t listen or aren’t good enough to execute, and if we have a “cap-ologist” employed they should be taken to Rittenhouse Square, tied to a pole, and publicly flogged.

A lot of things need to change before this team is good again. At least we should have some fights to watch will be a lot more entertaining than the 60 minute sleeping pill we have been taking 82 times a year for the last decade.
- darkerens

Ridding themselves of terrible contracts such as JVRs would certainly help out their - capologist and that has nothing to do with Fletcher. Also they passed on JG which was an outstanding sign or example of maybe the team finally learning a few lessons. Not disagreeing with you, but their issues started long before Fletcher and yes Scott is the common denominator.

Ridding themselves of terrible contracts such as JVRs would certainly help out their - capologist and that has nothing to do with Fletcher. Also they passed on JG which was an outstanding sign or example of maybe the team finally learning a few lessons. Not disagreeing with you, but their issues started long before Fletcher and yes Scott is the common denominator.
- Joe Nardone

Whoever is their capologist is a also a fn clown.

If Ellis gets shut down for the season at some point, would that mean we could take on someone's final year 6 million cap hit and maybe a first rounder for the trouble?
- therabbi

No

Agreed! If he wasn't Hexy's son's coach, he never would have gotten the job. Hak was a hack.
- Don Nachbaur

Hack opinion. For a first time NHL coach who didn't have much talent to work with through the roster. Hakstol did a decent job. Hen got more out of his teams that Vigneault did out his more talented teams.

Like AV??
- hfc355

Yes, exactly.

AV is not a bad coach and neither were his assistants. Their failure is proof of the organization wide dysfunction of this franchise. Dave Scott is incompetent, Fletch is just a terrible GM as he has proved over a long time, our scouts can’t identify talent, our medical staff reminds of the “Dizzy Doctors” episode of the Three Stooges, our AHL can’t develop anyone or give them a solid pro foundation of how to play, our leaders can’t/don’t lead, our coaches can’t fix it because the players either won’t listen or aren’t good enough to execute, and if we have a “cap-ologist” employed they should be taken to Rittenhouse Square, tied to a pole, and publicly flogged.

A lot of things need to change before this team is good again. At least we should have some fights to watch will be a lot more entertaining than the 60 minute sleeping pill we have been taking 82 times a year for the last decade.
- darkerens

Vigneault and his assistants overall did a really poor job here. Inc;uding Yeo when he took over.

Is this a serious post? He’s still a young developing player. He has yet to play a full season in the NHL. A 40 point season would only be a start but fair but any player who was drafted in the first round and formally had 100 plus points in junior is expected to have a high expectation in the big league.
- SuperSchennBros

So the bar this season for Frost has been set at 40+ points in your opinion. If that is only a start what do your foresee Frost being in his prime point wise?

Let’s talk Tippet as well. Since he was a top 10 pick is the expectation higher for him than Frost this upcoming season? Where do you envision him finishing point wise?

So the bar this season for Frost has been set at 40+ points in your opinion. If that is only a start what do your foresee Frost being in his prime point wise?

Let’s talk Tippet as well. Since he was a top 10 pick is the expectation higher for him than Frost this upcoming season? Where do you envision him finishing point wise?
- furio16

Largely depends on usage, especially level of PP time. Frost got the 11th-most (by average time per game) PP time among Flyers forwards last year. After Cates and Tippett, his second most common line combo was with Mayhew and Willman.

Yeo said at one point almost verbatim, "Points are not my main objective with Frosty right now. I want him to work right now on moving his feet more, not getting stationary. Being first on pucks and heavier. If he does those things, the points will come, too."

That's exactly what Frost did over the rest of the season. And the points DID start coming over the final 12 games.

The key now is for Frost not to revert but to pick up where he left off (he seems aware that the adjustments were crucial and they were starting to work). Also key for Torts to put him in position to succeed. Playing more with Tippett and Cates could be such an opportunity. That line had a similar chemistry to what he had in the Soo with Raddysh (Tippett) and Katchouk (Cates). Similar distribution of roles and abilities.

So the bar this season for Frost has been set at 40+ points in your opinion. If that is only a start what do your foresee Frost being in his prime point wise?

Let’s talk Tippet as well. Since he was a top 10 pick is the expectation higher for him than Frost this upcoming season? Where do you envision him finishing point wise?
- furio16

What? 40 points is what you presented. I expect Frost is be a regular offensive contributor to this team should he be healthy and see a full season with the Flyers. Should Frost be unable to do this, he offers very little to this team or any other team.

As far as the PP coach, he couldn’t do any worse than what we had last year. I am really wondering about our next captain. I love Giroux as a player, but I prefer the leadership style of Pronger as opposed to Giroux. The “lead by example” only works if everyone follows suit, think Yzerman becoming more defensively responsible and his team following his lead. That never happened here, and nothing was done by the team leaders to address it. Remember when the team actually had pride and would have players only meetings after bad games? When was the last time that happened, instead of just jumping in your Range Rover and driving back to your mansion to see your model quality wife...when you say it loud, it makes it harder to make the team meeting argument
- darkerens

Lead by example really only works when the other players are capable of following the example. When half the roster is not NHL level talent generally it doesn't matter how good of an example is provided.

"something Mike Keenan still holds a grudge against Peter Laviolette for allegedly doing to him in Boston when Lavi was a young coach (he vehemently denies it to this day)"


Bill - this is why you're the best. I always learn something new!!

What? 40 points is what you presented. I expect Frost is be a regular offensive contributor to this team should he be healthy and see a full season with the Flyers. Should Frost be unable to do this, he offers very little to this team or any other team.
- SuperSchennBros

You said 40 points is a start did you not? So do you not expect 40+ points? Let’s be clear on what you expect.

Define a regular offensive contributor.

You said 40 points is a start did you not? So do you not expect 40+ points? Let’s be clear on what you expect.

Define a regular offensive contributor.
- furio16

I would be happy with 40 points from Frost this season. That would mean he is producing well at 5 on 5 for a third line center. Probably also means he is getting regularly powerplay time. That would be a nice solid season for him. Good stepping stone season.

Hack opinion. For a first time NHL coach who didn't have much talent to work with through the roster. Hakstol did a decent job. Hen got more out of his teams that Vigneault did out his more talented teams.
- MJL

AV had one of the best teams in the league going before Covid hit. Hack did not exceed any expectations.

I would be happy with 40 points from Frost this season. That would mean he is producing well at 5 on 5 for a third line center. Probably also means he is getting regularly powerplay time. That would be a nice solid season for him. Good stepping stone season.
- mickel25

I don’t not expect him to get 40 at all. Doesn’t mean it wasn’t a good season.

What I want to see is him play 70+ games. Show he is a an everyday NHL player. Be consistent. Then go from there.

Same with Tippet. I don’t expect 40 at all.

I don’t not expect him to get 40 at all. Doesn’t mean it wasn’t a good season.

What I want to see is him play 70+ games. Show he is a an everyday NHL player. Be consistent. Then go from there.

Same with Tippet. I don’t expect 40 at all.
- furio16

I do not expect it either. I said I would be happy with it. Availability and continual improvement should be the baseline. I agree there. I do think 40 points is a reasonable number though. Just not likely.

AV had one of the best teams in the league going before Covid hit. Hack did not exceed any expectations.
- ClaudeFather

Vigeneault had his team in that position for a couple of months. Then struggled to beat Montreal in the playoffs.
Hakstol got more with less that Vigneault did overall. Vigneault overall was bad. Hakstol did a decent job.