The Flyers are presently about $2.4 million over the cap ceiling, yet the President/GM is still employed. Future looks good.

His successor doesn't remotely sound like someone who will be successful. Just along for the ride it appears.

So what will it take for the GM to be fired or step down at some point? Does he last the whole season as the GM?

I have such mixed feelings on the up coming season. On one hand I want the Flyers to be tough to play against and the players giving everything they got. On the other side I want a shot at a top 3 draft pick. Is it possible to have both?

Still stuck on the identity and culture BS I see. More bad trades and signings? So to be sure, you no longer feel that what Fletcher did in the summer of 21 put the Flyers on a path to the Stanley Cup?
- MJL

I think a team identity is very important and this team has lost that over the last decade. I think that is one of the reasons Torts was brought in here, because he has a track record of building team identities everywhere he has gone, except Vancouver of course. In the summer of 21' I thought the Flyers needed a major shake up. I felt they had major gaps in their lineup that could not be filled internally and they had some locker room issues. It was also clear that some players did not fit well with AV, namely Ghost. I thought Fletcher was spot on in terms of the problems he saw with the team and the gaps he attempted to fill. Unfortunately, the moves he made did not work out, and what's worse he compounded those mistakes with even more mistakes. I have no problem with a GM that tries to do the right thing and unfortunately makes some moves that don't work out, that's life as a GM. However the big problem I have with Fletcher is there does not seem to be a plan in place that is governing the moves he is making, and that is why I have turned against him.

I absolutely believe that Fletch is on the hot seat and has dug his own grave with some questionable moves. BUT, what would a new GM be able to do at this point? No other team is stepping up to take on JVR or any other dead weight. They won't be able to magically heal Ellis. Best they can do is sell their vision and start the process ASAP. It will still take time.

I believe we are stuck this year and need to plan for 2-3 years down the road. With or without Fletch. Regardless it will be a LONG YEAR... Let's go boys!

Lather, rinse, repeat...

Under redundant in the dictionary it says, "See redundant."

I have such mixed feelings on the up coming season. On one hand I want the Flyers to be tough to play against and the players giving everything they got. On the other side I want a shot at a top 3 draft pick. Is it possible to have both?
- Flybynight88

Not in my opinion, as currently constructed, barring a repeat in injury woes.

For the most part, I think fans have low expectations for this season. I will define that as the team finishing at or near the bottom of the Metro, so no playoffs, and in the bottom 11 of the league wide rankings, so a lottery-eligible pick. The reason most come to this conclusion is, in no particular order: based on the results of the two prior seasons, questions regarding roster holes, health, depth including backup goalie, and the unknowns of team chemistry with a new coach and potentially a new top d-pairing.

However, the one point that I seem to differ with most about is the team’s ceiling. That if everything that can go well, does go perfectly well, can the team be a playoff bubble team, make the playoffs? This has nothing do with hoping for a high draft pick or what one thinks would be best for the long-term future either, just the evaluation of the current ceiling. The problem is that it is hard to imagine all things that can go well, going so well. It is Murphy’s law in reverse so Yhprum’s law. It would be new to us as Flyers fans for certain.

Which brings me to the list of things that will or will not go right for the Flyers. If you feel like ranking them: 1–unlikely 2–iffy, about 50/50 3–likely
The higher the overall score, the more “optimistic” you are for the team to reach its ceiling. Try to be fair with your opinion of each point on its own merit.

1. In 21-22, the Flyers finished 15th in the EC and last in the Metro with 61 points. In order to have tied with the final EC playoff team, they would have needed 39 more points thereby jumping 3 Metro teams. Is there a path for this year’s Flyers team to jump 3 Metro teams?
2. Will Carter Hart play more than 50 games and win at least 31 games?
3. Will the backup goalie play 25+ games with at least 17 wins?
4. The team’s center depth was hit hard with injuries last season. This year, will the group including Couturier, Hayes, Frost, Laughton, Brown and Laczynski (even if on the Phantoms) all be healthy for 60+ games each?
5. Will Ellis return to play in the second half of the season, 25+ games?
6. Will the pairing of Provorov and DeAngelo mesh well, 52 CF% or higher?
7. Will the team respond well to Torts and the new systems—team rankings of goals against and penalty kill improve?
8. Will either Farabee or TK score 25+ goals, as well as at least one older vet like JVR, Couturier or Atkinson?
9. Will the team’s power play ranking improve from dead last to 20th or higher?
10. Will one young forward (Frost, Tippett, N.Cates, Allison or other rookie) take a leap, scoring in the team’s top 6 for points per game?

I have such mixed feelings on the up coming season. On one hand I want the Flyers to be tough to play against and the players giving everything they got. On the other side I want a shot at a top 3 draft pick. Is it possible to have both?
- Flybynight88

On paper I think we are just slightly better than a bottom 5 team. Unless we get a few injuries. Best we can hope for would be better luck in the draft lottery.

The Flyers are presently about $2.4 million over the cap ceiling, yet the President/GM is still employed. Future looks good.

His successor doesn't remotely sound like someone who will be successful. Just along for the ride it appears.

So what will it take for the GM to be fired or step down at some point? Does he last the whole season as the GM?
- furio16

The season has not started yet, bringing up the Flyers are over the cap is pointless.
Attard and Brink will not be on the starting roster. cates may start with Phantoms as well.

The season has not started yet, bringing up the Flyers are over the cap is pointless.
Attard and Brink will not be on the starting roster. cates may start with Phantoms as well.
- WhiskeyMan

Being a bottom feeding team and over the cap is not pointless to bring up.

Being over the cap limits them to making any moves does it not?

Really going out on a limb about Brink I see.

I think a team identity is very important and this team has lost that over the last decade. I think that is one of the reasons Torts was brought in here, because he has a track record of building team identities everywhere he has gone, except Vancouver of course. In the summer of 21' I thought the Flyers needed a major shake up. I felt they had major gaps in their lineup that could not be filled internally and they had some locker room issues. It was also clear that some players did not fit well with AV, namely Ghost. I thought Fletcher was spot on in terms of the problems he saw with the team and the gaps he attempted to fill. Unfortunately, the moves he made did not work out, and what's worse he compounded those mistakes with even more mistakes. I have no problem with a GM that tries to do the right thing and unfortunately makes some moves that don't work out, that's life as a GM. However the big problem I have with Fletcher is there does not seem to be a plan in place that is governing the moves he is making, and that is why I have turned against him.
- jd250

It is not like he had a plan in 2018 and you were down with the haphazard moves that he made then

As much as I believe this season will not be a good one for the Flyers, I still can't help but get excited for another season.
- hockeylover

This is the first season I haven't been excited to start.
Admittedly, I was even excited about the team last season but not this season. Not at all.
If anything I will be cheering for a tank job because this team needs a generational talent and this is our chance

Guess what I'm really saying is...I don't want to be a bottom 10 team and depend on luck. I want to be a bottom 3 team. The Flyers just don't need a 40 goal scorer from the draft they need a game changing center IMO. If they don't get one we are going to suck for a long long time.

The season has not started yet, bringing up the Flyers are over the cap is pointless.
Attard and Brink will not be on the starting roster. cates may start with Phantoms as well.
- WhiskeyMan

Brink had hip surgery and is out until January. He will start the year on SOIR and then be assigned to the Phantoms when he is cleared.

I think a team identity is very important and this team has lost that over the last decade. I think that is one of the reasons Torts was brought in here, because he has a track record of building team identities everywhere he has gone, except Vancouver of course. In the summer of 21' I thought the Flyers needed a major shake up. I felt they had major gaps in their lineup that could not be filled internally and they had some locker room issues. It was also clear that some players did not fit well with AV, namely Ghost. I thought Fletcher was spot on in terms of the problems he saw with the team and the gaps he attempted to fill. Unfortunately, the moves he made did not work out, and what's worse he compounded those mistakes with even more mistakes. I have no problem with a GM that tries to do the right thing and unfortunately makes some moves that don't work out, that's life as a GM. However the big problem I have with Fletcher is there does not seem to be a plan in place that is governing the moves he is making, and that is why I have turned against him.
- jd250

Vigneault was brought in for the same reasons. How did that work out? This isn't about identity. It's about talent. You're coming with the same nonsense that you claimed Fletcher was fixing in 21.

Do you even realize that your final statements are a huge contradiction. You have no problem with a GM who tries to do the right thing and if it doesn't work out that's life as a GM. Then you claim he is compounding mistakes with more mistakes. That shows that he didn't have a plan in 21 either! When will you admit how wrong you were. How you argued with me that as I stated, the moves made were more likely to damage the future of the team than help it. You were giddy with the moves and said it was one of the best periods you can remember as a Flyers fan. Fletcher put the team on a path to the Cup according to you. The only reason you have turned against him is because it's been proven to you how wrong you were. Now you pretend like you're on top of things now.

Being a bottom feeding team and over the cap is not pointless to bring up.

Being over the cap limits them to making any moves does it not?

Really going out on a limb about Brink I see.
- furio16

What happens if and when Ellis comes back. That’s really going to mess the cap situation up.
I’m thinking CF knows Ellis is not going to be back anytime soon.
With the flyers luck they have to send a guy or two down to Lehigh that are having very good seasons and they get claimed on waivers.

It is not like he had a plan in 2018 and you were down with the haphazard moves that he made then
- corduroy

What haphazard moves did Fletcher make in 2019 (not 2018)? Signing an experienced head coach with a track record of success in AV? Trading for a top pairing RHS shot defenseman in Niskanen to play with Provorov? Picking up Pitlick to add more grit into the lineup? Signing Hayes to fill the gap Patrick couldn't fill? Bringing up Carter Hart because he was ready to play in the NHL? These are haphazard moves? I think the Flyers were 1 game away from the final 4 that year, weren't they?

I absolutely believe that Fletch is on the hot seat and has dug his own grave with some questionable moves. BUT, what would a new GM be able to do at this point? No other team is stepping up to take on JVR or any other dead weight. They won't be able to magically heal Ellis. Best they can do is sell their vision and start the process ASAP. It will still take time.

I believe we are stuck this year and need to plan for 2-3 years down the road. With or without Fletch. Regardless it will be a LONG YEAR... Let's go boys!

Lather, rinse, repeat...

Under redundant in the dictionary it says, "See redundant."
- cdearth23

So now we're back to planning for 2-3 years down the road. I hope the Flyers learn along with some fans that this is not a 2-3 year fix. It's a 5-10 year fix with hopefully some steady incline of improvement along the way. What the Flyers did in firing Hextall, who wanted a patient approach to what they've done with Fletcher will wind up setting the team back for a decade overall. If they're lucky.

What haphazard moves did Fletcher make in 2019 (not 2018)? Signing an experienced head coach with a track record of success in AV? Trading for a top pairing RHS shot defenseman in Niskanen to play with Provorov? Picking up Pitlick to add more grit into the lineup? Signing Hayes to fill the gap Patrick couldn't fill? Bringing up Carter Hart because he was ready to play in the NHL? These are haphazard moves? I think the Flyers were 1 game away from the final 4 that year, weren't they?
- jd250

Niskanen was about the only good move that Fletcher has made.

Brink had hip surgery and is out until January. He will start the year on SOIR and then be assigned to the Phantoms when he is cleared.
- bmeltzer

yeah that was kind of my point. People are pointing out that the Flyers are over the cap. The roster has not been set yet. Players will be start on IR and players will be sent to the Phantoms. The cap right not is pointless to bring up.

Even Farabee will start on the IR.

People just need something to complain about to make themselves feel good

What haphazard moves did Fletcher make in 2019 (not 2018)? Signing an experienced head coach with a track record of success in AV? Trading for a top pairing RHS shot defenseman in Niskanen to play with Provorov? Picking up Pitlick to add more grit into the lineup? Signing Hayes to fill the gap Patrick couldn't fill? Bringing up Carter Hart because he was ready to play in the NHL? These are haphazard moves? I think the Flyers were 1 game away from the final 4 that year, weren't they?
- jd250

overpaying for hayes = haphazard

overpaying for braun via trade = haphazard

bringing up Hart early in 18/19 due to injuries = haphazard

hiring a name instead of doing due diligence to match a coaching philosophy to the talent and type of players on the roster = haphazard

Vigneault was brought in for the same reasons. How did that work out? This isn't about identity. It's about talent. You're coming with the same nonsense that you claimed Fletcher was fixing in 21.

Do you even realize that your final statements are a huge contradiction. You have no problem with a GM who tries to do the right thing and if it doesn't work out that's life as a GM. Then you claim he is compounding mistakes with more mistakes. That shows that he didn't have a plan in 21 either! When will you admit how wrong you were. How you argued with me that as I stated, the moves made were more likely to damage the future of the team than help it. You were giddy with the moves and said it was one of the best periods you can remember as a Flyers fan. Fletcher put the team on a path to the Cup according to you. The only reason you have turned against him is because it's been proven to you how wrong you were. Now you pretend like you're on top of things now.
- MJL

Again, its impossible to have an intelligent back and forth with you about this, or anything to be honest, if all you want to do is look for any contradiction. The bottom line from me on this topic, and this is my last reply on it, is I was on board with the changes made in 21' and thought they had a good chance to work out and get this team to the next level. It all went to sh*t as it turned out, and now a new plan needs to put in place, not more band-aids. Fletcher has not demonstrated he has such a plan and that, and only that, is the reason I have lost confidence in him.

yeah that was kind of my point. People are pointing out that the Flyers are over the cap. The roster has not been set yet. Players will be start on IR and players will be sent to the Phantoms. The cap right not is pointless to bring up.

Even Farabee will start on the IR.

People just need something to complain about to make themselves feel good
- WhiskeyMan

IR is different than LTIR

I believe they need to be cap compliant before using any LTIR - I could be wrong though

Vigneault was brought in for the same reasons. How did that work out? This isn't about identity. It's about talent. You're coming with the same nonsense that you claimed Fletcher was fixing in 21.

Do you even realize that your final statements are a huge contradiction. You have no problem with a GM who tries to do the right thing and if it doesn't work out that's life as a GM. Then you claim he is compounding mistakes with more mistakes. That shows that he didn't have a plan in 21 either! When will you admit how wrong you were. How you argued with me that as I stated, the moves made were more likely to damage the future of the team than help it. You were giddy with the moves and said it was one of the best periods you can remember as a Flyers fan. Fletcher put the team on a path to the Cup according to you. The only reason you have turned against him is because it's been proven to you how wrong you were. Now you pretend like you're on top of things now.
- MJL

Talk about beating a dead horse. This guy has admitted he was wrong on numerus occasions. Yet you keep asking him the same question week after week.

Move on already.

yeah that was kind of my point. People are pointing out that the Flyers are over the cap. The roster has not been set yet. Players will be start on IR and players will be sent to the Phantoms. The cap right not is pointless to bring up.

Even Farabee will start on the IR.

People just need something to complain about to make themselves feel good
- WhiskeyMan

It is not pointless. They really cant make any moves. Why cant you grasp that concept.

Couple solid fee agents still out there to be had. You think having no cap space is a good thing?

overpaying for hayes = haphazard

overpaying for braun via trade = haphazard

bringing up Hart early in 18/19 due to injuries = haphazard

hiring a name instead of doing due diligence to match a coaching philosophy to the talent and type of players on the roster = haphazard
- corduroy

These are in reverse order of my dislike. No. 4 being the most costly.