Sandin’s market value is only relevant if the Leafs have any intention of trading him. He will get playing time this year between injuries and as the team tries to manage the minutes of the old guys ahead of him on the left side. They also don’t want to stall his development. I expect to see Muzzin gone next year once his full NTC is modified.
- Canada Cup

Unless Muzzin plays the season like he did the post season last year. It may have been a crap season due to his injuries and the playoffs was the first time he actually got past them.

And that’s the exact problem with Sandin. He won’t get a full time job and the market for him is currently next to nothing. Is it him worth a mid round pick? No, please let me be clear about that. Do I think that other teams are looking for a guy like him currently? Also no. Hence the lower than preferred value and why Dubas hasn’t moved him as of yet.

Unless they plug him there to start the year.

Like I’ve mentioned… I personally think he’s an NHLer but I simply don’t see his current fit with the leafs. Hence why I’m thinking that he’s going to get moved or end up playing in Europe this year… especially before the Marlies, hence why he isn’t signing.

I could be wrong but is it 3 years before he becomes a UFA? Based on the age of 25 of course. Please correct me and explain why if I’m wrong.
- Dozzer

I agree with you, right now Sandin is the 7th defenseman on the Leafs team. I don't think Dubas wants to trade him, because he's got a lot of potential, but if Sandin holds out and/or continues to be unhappy, they will have to move him.

I think they sign him at some point, before or after the season starts.
he is still a tweener, in and out of the lineup. anf if injuries happen and vets get rested he get enough games this season. and come next season he is a reg in the top 6
- senstroll

So like I’ve said repeatedly…. Is Sandin willing to be that in and out of the lineup guy? I’m thinking that answer is no. Hence why he hasn’t agreed to a contract. This has nothing to do with the dollar value imo.

Don’t forget about the land shark
- Canada Cup

I believe those are called women...

I agree with you, right now Sandin is the 7th defenseman on the Leafs team. I don't think Dubas wants to trade him, because he's got a lot of potential, but if Sandin holds out and/or continues to be unhappy, they will have to move him.
- PatC80

That’s all I’m saying.

They don’t see him as a guy ready for the top 6 yet, hence the issue.

I’d love it if the leafs kept him too but I simply don’t see him being happy as a 7th guy or a Marlie hence why he hasn’t signed.

Unfortunately I don’t see him worth much yet because every other GM in the league is going to wonder why he isn’t an NHLer by year 5. I soooooooo wish rebuilding teams would offer a prospect or a pick for him but that’s not what rebuilding teams do.

Unless Muzzin plays the season like he did the post season last year. It may have been a crap season due to his injuries and the playoffs was the first time he actually got past them.

And that’s the exact problem with Sandin. He won’t get a full time job and the market for him is currently next to nothing. Is it him worth a mid round pick? No, please let me be clear about that. Do I think that other teams are looking for a guy like him currently? Also no. Hence the lower than preferred value and why Dubas hasn’t moved him as of yet.
- Dozzer

It's tough because no way the 3 Leaf D men 33 and older play 82 ... None.
So they need him for that eventuality. But in the meantime where does he go.

If I were Dubie I'd be looking to sweeten the pot for someone to take Muzz & his NMC if that is even doable. That and then sign Sandin and have the cap space also.

Would you rather be attacked by a bear or be attacked by a shark?
- Canada Cup

Neither
BUT
What kind of bear and what kind of shark are we talking about?

It's tough because no way the 3 Leaf D men 33 and older play 82 ... None.
So they need him for that eventuality. But in the meantime where does he go.

If I were Dubie I'd be looking to sweeten the pot for someone to take Muzz & his NMC if that is even doable. That and then sign Sandin and have the cap space also.
- dozerD10

I get what you’re saying about Muzzin but that will never happen. The guy is from Woodstock Ontario which is only about an hour and a half outside of Toronto. He won’t want to go hence the need for the damn NMC to sign him.

I can’t say this enough. Would I like to see Sandin moved? No. Do I see him resigning for the current role available? Also no. Hence the hiccup for Dubas.

It's tough because no way the 3 Leaf D men 33 and older play 82 ... None.
So they need him for that eventuality. But in the meantime where does he go.

If I were Dubie I'd be looking to sweeten the pot for someone to take Muzz & his NMC if that is even doable. That and then sign Sandin and have the cap space also.
- dozerD10

Muzzin will get injured, it's a matter of when and not if. Also, I am sure Gio will be given some "Maintenance" days off. Rielly is the #1 guy on the team.. Brodie plays the right side and that's not something Sandin has shown that he can handle.

I get what Dozzer's saying; I think Sandin will get ice time and he will get into a fair share of games, if he's not happy being the 7th defenseman, then it's up to Dubas to figure this all out.

Unless Muzzin plays the season like he did the post season last year. It may have been a crap season due to his injuries and the playoffs was the first time he actually got past them.

And that’s the exact problem with Sandin. He won’t get a full time job and the market for him is currently next to nothing. Is it him worth a mid round pick? No, please let me be clear about that. Do I think that other teams are looking for a guy like him currently? Also no. Hence the lower than preferred value and why Dubas hasn’t moved him as of yet.
- Dozzer

Sandin's value far exceeds a mid round pick. However most teams do have similar prospects in their systems. How does it look to that 20 year old that you drafted and worked through your system to turn around and sign another teams(slightly more maturated) prospect? Teams do it all the time(i know). And until we know the salary demands it is all a moot point. No team will trade for Sandin without knowing what it will take to sign him. If the "ASK" is under 2 mil. The value is there(for the Leafs as well).

According to BetOnline...

The swarm has the 3rd best odds of getting clipped this yr...
15-2

But it has Keefe in 2nd @ 13-2 Seems rather harsh...
And Hakstol leading the pack @ 7-1

round out the top 6
Lavi
Ruff.. my favorite and
Rod the Bod.

10.75 x 8 for MacK.
Could happen tomorrow or sometime in the next year.

But those are the numbers...give or take a million or so per year...maybe.
Per Fakesources.

So I was just thinking….

Look at the leafs left side

Bunting
Kerfoot
Engvall
Whoever is on the 4th
Rielly
Muzzin
Giordano

And compare it to their right side

Marner
Nylander
Jarnkrok (a guess)
Whoever is on the 4th
Brodie
Holl
Liljegren

If I’m the competition’s coach I’d be advising my players to attack the right side… hate to say it but when it comes to defensive capabilities the leafs are heavily more strong on the left side.

Sandin's value far exceeds a mid round pick. However most teams do have similar prospects in their systems. How does it look to that 20 year old that you drafted and worked through your system to turn around and sign another teams(slightly more maturated) prospect? Teams do it all the time(i know). And until we know the salary demands it is all a moot point. No team will trade for Sandin without knowing what it will take to sign him. If the "ASK" is under 2 mil. The value is there(for the Leafs as well).
- camfor

Oh I agree. I think he’s an NHLer just not with the leafs currently. So unless the leafs can convince him to remain a non-full time NHL player they need to move him. Problem is just like you said, every team has a decently strong offensive d man in their pool who is questionable defensively. Hence why I think Dubas is sitting on his hands and waiting to see if another team suffers an early injury which would enable him to “up” the current price for Sandin.

Muzzin will get injured, it's a matter of when and not if. Also, I am sure Gio will be given some "Maintenance" days off. Rielly is the #1 guy on the team.. Brodie plays the right side and that's not something Sandin has shown that he can handle.

I get what Dozzer's saying; I think Sandin will get ice time and he will get into a fair share of games, if he's not happy being the 7th defenseman, then it's up to Dubas to figure this all out.
- PatC80

Thank you. That’s all I’m saying. I think Sandin has talent but he doesn’t really fit with the leafs atm when it comes to being a regular player.

Ek says Nylander and Sandin for Chychrun

So I was just thinking….

Look at the leafs left side

Bunting
Kerfoot
Engvall
Whoever is on the 4th
Rielly
Muzzin
Giordano

And compare it to their right side

Marner
Nylander
Jarnkrok (a guess)
Whoever is on the 4th
Brodie
Holl
Liljegren

If I’m the competition’s coach I’d be advising my players to attack the right side… hate to say it but when it comes to defensive capabilities the leafs are heavily more strong on the left side.
- Dozzer

Willie is the only “weak” forward on the right side. Jarnrok is solid but could just as easily be playing on the left and they have plenty of strong defensive options for the 4th line. I’m also not sure Brodie is a big liability compared to Rielly

Thank you. That’s all I’m saying. I think Sandin has talent but he doesn’t really fit with the leafs atm when it comes to being a regular player.
- Dozzer

And it sucks for him but if he wants to play in the NHL he’s going to have to play in and out of the lineup this year and see what next year brings.

Ek says Nylander and Sandin for Chychrun
- mr.sir

Ek trying to generate hits?
IMO that is too much for the leafs to give up.

Ek trying to generate hits?
IMO that is too much for the leafs to give up.
- Fakepartofme

But…… just think of the cap space!!!

And, can we switch Sandin for Holl?

Willie is the only “weak” forward on the right side. Jarnrok is solid but could just as easily be playing on the left and they have plenty of strong defensive options for the 4th line. I’m also not sure Brodie is a big liability compared to Rielly
- Canada Cup

No no no please I’m not trying to blow it out of proportion

It’s more of a

Marner is decent but physical
Nylander is questionable
Jarnkrok is good I agree
Who the hell knows lol
Brodie is solid 100%
Holl is a decent but still only a 2 mill guy
Liljegren is young but who the (frank) know he might have a stand up season

Against

Bunting who made the first line by playing physical and defensive
Kerfoot who is primarily defensive
Engvall who is primarily defensive
Who the hell knows lol
Rielly is offensive enough to make up for it
Muzzin who is a primary defensive guy if he stays healthy (I’m believing I that btw)
Giordano who is late in his career but solid defensively still

That’s all I’m saying… a little more questionable on the right side hence why I think opposition coaches will prefer to attack that.

And it sucks for him but if he wants to play in the NHL he’s going to have to play in and out of the lineup this year and see what next year brings.
- Canada Cup

That’s what I’m trying to say… it’s beyond his talent now… does what he want match it? I’m thinking the answer is no.

But…… just think of the cap space!!!

And, can we switch Sandin for Holl?
- mr.sir

Oh if we include holl, then of course....trade him for anything.
Leafs would need the cap space to get another winger to replace Wilster.

But…… just think of the cap space!!!

And, can we switch Sandin for Holl?
- mr.sir

You want the leafs to have only one right handed d man?

Oh if we include holl, then of course....trade him for anything.
Leafs would need the cap space to get another winger to replace Wilster.
- Fakepartofme

Btw how’s the judgemental poster doing these days?