Talk about the coach is really intersting, since all the players seem to love him. But fans and analysts all seem on the complete other side and hate him, as well as feeling he is not the coach needed to get this team over the hump.

Also intersting the players love him, but is he the guy keeping them from getting into the playoffs, which so many of them want so badly.
- david22

Leadership and coaching are very different things. I believe Smith wants Brady Tkachuk and Thomas Chabot to lead this team. Just based on observation I think he has encouraged a few vets (especially Giroux and Hamonic) to have a little extra voice.

If this team is going to do something special it will require strong dressing room leadership. Are Tkachuk, Chabot, Giroux and possibly Hamonic up to for the long haul?

Look at the experience of Boston and Vegas over the last two years and try to convince someone that the regular season and playoff results were the direct result of coaching.

Toronto is a good example. Great technical coach, popular with players, leading edge analytical support. But his teams always run out of gas in the playoffs. Many Leaf fans want to fire the coach. But what is a guy going to do when he looks down the bench and has nothing but AHL talent for his 3rd and 4th line?

If we assume that Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson, Kasper, Wallinder, Cossa, and Rasmussen are off the table, which one of the following Red Wings prospects would you target in a DeBrincat trade, in addition to the 17 overall pick:

Zadina, Veleno, Berggren, Soderblom, McIsaac, Hanas, James

Personally, I think Zadina/Berggren are the only ones with significant upside, but there are some good potential middle-six type prospects in there, and I'm curious what impression other people have.

If we assume that Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson, Kasper, Wallinder, Cossa, and Rasmussen are off the table, which one of the following Red Wings prospects would you target in a DeBrincat trade, in addition to the 17 overall pick:

Zadina, Veleno, Berggren, Soderblom, McIsaac, Hanas, James

Personally, I think Zadina/Berggren are the only ones with legitimate top-6 upside, but I'm curious what impression other people have.
- khawk

none, OTT is never going to trade Cat to a divisional rival who they are in DERECT competition for a playoff spot with, remember Dorion trade hoffman for less to SJS than within he division.

and if DET does call, his first two things out of his mouth should 9th and 17th OA then ask for ++ or no deal

If we assume that Seider, Raymond, Edvinsson, Kasper, Wallinder, Cossa, and Rasmussen are off the table, which one of the following Red Wings prospects would you target in a DeBrincat trade, in addition to the 17 overall pick:

Zadina, Veleno, Berggren, Soderblom, McIsaac, Hanas, James

Personally, I think Zadina/Berggren are the only ones with legitimate top-6 upside, but I'm curious what impression other people have.
- khawk

I don't think the Sens would have any interest in picks and/or prospects other than as an asset that could be flipped in a parallel or 3 way deal. For multiple reasons, I believe Dorion wants to win now.

none, OTT is never going to trade Cat to a divisional rival who they are in DERECT competition for a playoff spot with, remember Dorion trade hoffman for less to SJS than within he division.

and if DET does call, his first two ask should be 9th and 17th OA ++
- Mithos

I'm sorry, you think the Hoffman trade proved anything but the futility of trying to keep a player out of your division? SJ literally flipped him the same day over to FLA for a better trade return, and Hoffman has played 4 of the past 5 seasons in the Atlantic Division. Not to mention that there were all kinds of weird emotions in the Hoffman situation that aren't in play with DeBrincat.

If OTT is going to be a legitimate Cup-quality team, it's juvenile to worry about what another team in the division is doing. If the Red Wings put the best offer on the table, you take it and make your team better. If anything, Dorion should have learned his lesson with Hoffman... selling him cheap to one team doesn't keep him away from the division, it just means you get pennies on the dollar.

Just take the best deal on the table and move on.

I don't think the Sens would have any interest in picks and/or prospects other than as an asset that could be flipped in a parallel or 3 way deal. For multiple reasons, I believe Dorion wants to win now.
- spatso

Well, the picks and prospects could be flipped in a separate trade for more established players - that doesn't mean they wouldn't be the targeted assets in a trade with the Red Wings. On the flip side, do you think Dorion might target someone like Fabbri or Rasmussen, who are more capable of stepping in and making an impact?

I'm sorry, you think the Hoffman trade proved anything but the futility of trying to keep a player out of your division? SJ literally flipped him the same day over to FLA for a better trade return, and Hoffman has played 4 of the past 5 seasons in the Atlantic Division. Not to mention that there were all kinds of weird emotions in the Hoffman situation that aren't in play with DeBrincat.

If OTT is going to be a legitimate Cup-quality team, it's juvenile to worry about what another team in the division is doing. If the Red Wings put the best offer on the table, you take it and make your team better. If anything, Dorion should have learned his lesson with Hoffman... selling him cheap to one team doesn't keep him away from the division, it just means you get pennies on the dollar.

Just take the best deal on the table and move on.
- khawk

it is monumental level of stupidity to trade a 40+ goal scorer in his prime to a divisional rival who is in the same compete stage as you, you hurt your chances more by trading Cat to DET than to say NSH, or SEA, or CAR for less.

there is a reason every single analyst in every network, blog, site keep saying teams trade top players in the other conference as those teams do not want the player they traded to bite them in the ass 4+ times a year or in the first round.

also he did learn from the hoffman trade with the EK trade, it had conditions on picks if SJS trade EK to a Eastern conference team.

"****Sens receive a 1st round pick from the Sharks (no later than 2022) if Karlsson is on an Eastern Conference roster (reserve list) during the 2018-19 season.
****Result: Condition not met, no pick is transferred."

it is monumental level of stupidity to trade a 40+ goal scorer in his prime to a divisional rival who is in the same compete stage as you, you hurt your chances more by trading Cat to DET than to say NSH, or SEA, or CAR for less.

there is a reason every single analyst in every network, blog, site keep saying teams trade top players in the other conference as those teams do not want the player they traded to bite them in the ass 4+ times a year or in the first round.

also he did learn from the hoffman trade with the EK trade, it had conditions on picks if SJS trade EK to a Eastern conference team.

"****Sens receive a 1st round pick from the Sharks (no later than 2022) if Karlsson is on an Eastern Conference roster (reserve list) during the 2018-19 season.
****Result: Condition not met, no pick is transferred."
- Mithos

I like Debrincat's skill, but he doesn't scare me in the playoffs. Not at all. And if he eats up 8-8.5M of cap space of DET - excellent

none, OTT is never going to trade Cat to a divisional rival who they are in DERECT competition for a playoff spot with, remember Dorion trade hoffman for less to SJS than within he division.

and if DET does call, his first two things out of his mouth should 9th and 17th OA then ask for ++ or no deal
- Mithos

9th overall straight up for DeBrincat is closer to what his trade value is. I'm not saying it's enough but this seems to be a deeper draft than 2023.

Would you accept Picks 17, 42, 43?

it is monumental level of stupidity to trade a 40+ goal scorer in his prime to a divisional rival who is in the same compete stage as you, you hurt your chances more by trading Cat to DET than to say NSH, or SEA, or CAR for less.

there is a reason every single analyst in every network, blog, site keep saying teams trade top players in the other conference as those teams do not want the player they traded to bite them in the ass 4+ times a year or in the first round.

also he did learn from the hoffman trade with the EK trade, it had conditions on picks if SJS trade EK to a Eastern conference team.

"****Sens receive a 1st round pick from the Sharks (no later than 2022) if Karlsson is on an Eastern Conference roster (reserve list) during the 2018-19 season.
****Result: Condition not met, no pick is transferred."
- Mithos

Yes, for one insignificant year there was a punitive element about Karlsson being traded back to the Eastern Conference - yet Karlsson could be playing in the division right now, and Dorion couldn't do a thing about it. In fact, it would be far worse for Karlsson to suddenly show up in the Eastern Conference now when the Senators are actually trying to win games. I can understand the general preference for not having traded players in your division, but pretending you can actually control where a player winds up is a fool's game - even if they have a TV show. And recent deals like the Reinhart & Severson trades suggest it's hardly a rule that nobody breaks.

As for DeBrincat, the whole point is that he's not a proven 40G+ player when he's not playing beside a HOF puck-distributor like Patrick Kane. Had DeBrincat actually scored 40G last year (or come close), I don't think there'd be any conversation about trading him. It's the fact that DeBrincat will expect a $8M-$9M contract as a 5'8 forward coming off of a 25G/65Pts season that represents the risk of that long-term extension. And that contract risk could be just as negative for the Red Wings as it could be for the Senators.

Yes, for one insignificant year there was a punitive element about Karlsson being traded back to the Eastern Conference - yet Karlsson could be playing in the division right now, and Dorion couldn't do a thing about it. In fact, it would be far worse for Karlsson to suddenly show up in the Eastern Conference now when the Senators are actually trying to win games. I can understand the general preference for not having traded players in your division, but pretending you can actually control where a player winds up is a fool's game - even if they have a TV show. And recent deals like the Reinhart & Severson trades suggest it's hardly a rule that nobody breaks.

As for DeBrincat, the whole point is that he's not a proven 40G+ player when he's not playing beside a HOF puck-distributor like Patrick Kane. Had DeBrincat actually scored 40G last year (or come close), I don't think there'd be any conversation about trading him. It's the fact that DeBrincat will expect a $8M-$9M contract as a 5'8 forward coming off of a 25G/65Pts season that represents the risk of that long-term extension. And that contract risk could be just as negative for the Red Wings as it could be for the Senators.
- khawk

I agree. Nothing in DeBrincat's play this past year caused me to think he would help the Sens go deep in the playoffs.

But I can think of multiple big bodies that would be a great fit starting with PLD and including Tom Wison and others.

I agree. Nothing in DeBrincat's play this past year caused me to think he would help the Sens go deep in the playoffs.

But I can think of multiple big bodies that would be a great fit starting with PLD and including Tom Wison and others.
- spatso

idk what is it with your love affair with PLD, from what many many ppl say, he rarely gives his 100% in games and is bad in the locker room and WSH aint trading wilson unles they rebuild and they aint gonna rebuild until Ovie retires and if he hits UFA, no thanks he will be 30 then and looking for a long term contract at 6-7M from his current 5.1M

Ya, not sure what the infatuation is with PLD or Tom Wilson. PLD just always seems to be disappointing and never plays up to his potential .... and seems to be someone who plays for himself. Plus, with one year left, it doesn't seem like he would re-sign here in Ottawa ie ... not his preferred destination. As for Wilson ... his brand/style of hockey just doesn't age well as injuries become more prevalent with these types of players.

I don't know what the Senators plan on doing but my list of expendable /tradeable players would be:
DeBrincat
Forsberg (if we trade for a bonafide starter)
Mathieu Joseph
Batherson (unless someone can figure out how to get him to have some defensive awareness)
Kelly
Formenton
Sokolov
Greig
Zub (only if, for example, we traded with a team like Carolina and brought in Pesce as part of the package .... as part of a broader/larger trade).
Brannstrom

Basically my untouchables would be ... Chabot, Sanderson, Chychrun, Tkachuk, Stutzle, Giroux, Norris, Pinto, Kastellic (because we need quality and cheap on the bottom line).
Everybody else is a tradable component for the right pieces.

idk what is it with your love affair with PLD, from what many many ppl say, he rarely gives his 100% in games and is bad in the locker room and WSH aint trading wilson unles they rebuild and they aint gonna rebuild until Ovie retires and if he hits UFA, no thanks he will be 30 then and looking for a long term contract at 6-7M from his current 5.1M
- Mithos

When PLD was traded from Columbus he had the reputation as being one of best up and coming young defensive centres in the NHL. I heard folks liken his play to Barkov. I think his defensive game got lost in Winnipeg where a few veteran players seem to run the show and shut out the coach. You hear lots of inside chatter about the interest surrounding PLD. I think it is about the defensive and match up game he might bring to a team looking to go deep into the playoffs..

Ya, not sure what the infatuation is with PLD or Tom Wilson. PLD just always seems to be disappointing and never plays up to his potential .... and seems to be someone who plays for himself. Plus, with one year left, it doesn't seem like he would re-sign here in Ottawa ie ... not his preferred destination. As for Wilson ... his brand/style of hockey just doesn't age well as injuries become more prevalent with these types of players.

I don't know what the Senators plan on doing but my list of expendable /tradeable players would be:
DeBrincat
Forsberg (if we trade for a bonafide starter)
Mathieu Joseph
Batherson (unless someone can figure out how to get him to have some defensive awareness)
Kelly
Formenton
Sokolov
Greig
Zub (only if, for example, we traded with a team like Carolina and brought in Pesce as part of the package .... as part of a broader/larger trade).
Brannstrom

Basically my untouchables would be ... Chabot, Sanderson, Chychrun, Tkachuk, Stutzle, Giroux, Norris, Pinto, Kastellic (because we need quality and cheap on the bottom line).
Everybody else is a tradable component for the right pieces.
- OttawaB

A+ on Pesce proposal.

OEL bought out by van, man did he ever fall off a cliff, was he not sloted at like a top 10 dman in the nhl a few years ago

9th overall straight up for DeBrincat is closer to what his trade value is. I'm not saying it's enough but this seems to be a deeper draft than 2023.

Would you accept Picks 17, 42, 43?
- AlfieisKing

Yes.

OEL bought out by van, man did he ever fall off a cliff, was he not sloted at like a top 10 dman in the nhl a few years ago
- Mithos

The OEL trade made by Vancouver is quite possibly the single worst trade of the past 5-10 years...
https://www.capfriendly.c...yers/oliver-ekman-larsson

The sheer amount of $$$/AAV it cost them, combined with giving up a top-10 draft pick that turned into Dylan Guenther, and now taking on a $17M buyout that will last 8yrs... all just 2yrs after the trade was made. Not to mention that all of the player contracts they were trying to move out were the direct result of terrible UFA over-payments to being with.

It's an unmitigated disaster.

The OEL trade made by Vancouver is quite possibly the single worst trade of the past 5-10 years...
https://www.capfriendly.c...yers/oliver-ekman-larsson

The sheer amount of $$$/AAV it cost them, combined with giving up a top-10 draft pick that turned into Dylan Guenther, and now taking on a $17M buyout that will last 8yrs... all just 2yrs after the trade was made. Not to mention that all of the player contracts they were trying to move out were the direct result of terrible UFA over-payments to being with.

It's an unmitigated disaster.
- khawk

Yes. It is ugly.

Vancouver is really hard to understand. They have some elite players. I have seen games where they look really good followed by games where they looked like they did not care. Maybe the buy out on Ekman-Larsson is the beginning of a full tear down and rebuild.

Would you guys trade Mathieu Joseph for Kailer Yamamoto? KY has 1 more year where Joseph has term. EDM wants to trade him, buyout could be an option

Would you guys trade Mathieu Joseph for Kailer Yamamoto? KY has 1 more year where Joseph has term. EDM wants to trade him, buyout could be an option
- AlfieisKing

No. I like Joseph for the defence he brings.

Listening to a hockey panel on Serius 91 this morning and the consensus was the LA Kings are "all in" big time on PLD. They have a deep pool of prospects and young assets and the panel seemed to agree the Kings are not going to be outbid. I guess I am destined to be disappointed.

PLD would be in Ottawa for 1 year before leaving as a UFA. I doubt he would sign here. Not worth trading for. So go ahead and be disappointed.

PLD would be in Ottawa for 1 year before leaving as a UFA. I doubt he would sign here. Not worth trading for. So go ahead and be disappointed.
- OttawaB

Would not support Sens dealing for anyone unless there was the certainty of a long term deal. Also, I can't imagine the Kings or anyone else doing a deal for PLD unless it came with the long term contract.

If I’m PD I would say ok Detroit ya want our 40goal player to come home

To Detroit:
Debrincat

To Ottawa:
Detroit 1st rd pick
Decent prospect

OR

Islanders 1st rd pick
Detroit 2nd
Kubalic