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Forums :: Blog World :: Bill Meltzer: Preseason Gameday: 9/29/23 @ BOS
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Minnyhock
Minnesota Wild
Joined: 06.26.2021

Sep 29 @ 4:07 PM ET
I'm not the Torts Whisper but in the year-plus he has been here, he definitely has his own way of doing things. He may or may not agree -- these are just my own read, and it could be wrong -- but I can see a few parallels here with several things mentioned in the article. Except there's a method to it, not craziness.

"Doesn't practice the power play".... The Flyers do practice the power play under Torts but, in general, he's a big believer in delegating to his assistants. All goaltending issues filter through the goalie coach. Power play through the assistant who runs PP and PK through that assistant. But, in general, the head coach being fairly hands off in terms of the power play was an old school staple. Even Fred Shero, hockey's most innovative coach of his time, believed the power play didn't have to be practiced.

"Yelling at David Booth for being late when he wasn't." I strongly suspect that Torts knew Booth was on time BUT was looking for a confrontation before even heading into the room. A) He probably wanted to see how Booth would react and B) He wanted to see if other Canucks would push back on his behalf. He's always done that sort of thing. Even at last Saturday's second scrimmage, matching two sides in their third scrimmage in two days (after the Day 1 skate test), when Tortorella stopped it midway through to come down and berate the players on the ice, most observers thought the actual simulated game wasn't going THAT badly. Torts may have been looking for an "in" to send a message that he wasn't going to cut any slack no matter how much skating they'd done. Likewise, I doubt it was an accident that he had a lot players in Sunday's double-scrimmage group (their fourth in three days) in Monday's lineup in Newark. He knew they'd be the most dead-legged on Monday and wanted to see who'd overcome it and have a good game. As it turned out, practically no one did.

"Having stars block shots." Yes, that's a non-negotiable with Torts.

"Communicating with players." Although Torts says his favorite part of coaching is getting to know players, their families, etc., he doesn't really talk much one-on-one with players (although he does welcome them to come to his office if they feel they want to discuss something). I don't believe last year that he didn't know he was scratching Frost and Sanheim in front of their families -- that was too coincidental that the lone scratching for both just so happened be in their respective hometown/junior hockey city with their family and friends in the stands. But as Torts explains it and people like Atkinson and Scott Hartnell have said, the relationship is built over more than one year and one off-season. Sanheim this year should have a better relationship with Tortorella, at least in theory. Frost might. York might. We shall see.

"Communicating with anyone." We'll see over time with Jones, Briere, Lappy, etc., but so far they all say on or off the record that they have a strong relationship with Torts.In terms of communicating with the media, it all depends on Torts' mood and the situation. He can be relaxed, instructive, patient, articulate and even friendly. He can be blunt and brief. Or he can get downright surly and confrontational over seemingly routine stuff. There are usually a couple reporters with whom he's the most likely to curse at or cut off. He's usually good with the broadcasters. And in terms of writers, I know I've told the Jay Greenberg story before but I'll repeat it. When Jay was let go by the New York Daily News, the one and only coach he'd covered over his long career who called him on the phone just to ask how he was doing was John Tortorella.

I'll also take issue with the article saying that Tortorella's relationship with Travis Green, by virtue of not discussing what was going on with Utica, showed that he "didn't care". I've heard this first hand: Torts believes in giving the minor league HC the space to run his own team. He doesn't demand they mirror Torts' systems. He doesn't demand players' AHL roles be tailored the way Torts would use them in the NHL. And he doesn't impose he own reads on a player on them, but also isn't going to seek a lot of input the other way on callup players. He finds out the 411 from management and then makes his own calls. You can like it or dislike it, but I don't think "he doesn't care" is accurate.

"Not learning from his mistakes." I would say that's subjective. However, the things he considers non-negotiables don't change from team to team. In general, there is evidence that he's evolved in some ways, held firm in other ways.

"Not practicing the shootout." I'm not sure if there's direct evidence, one way or another, that practicing or not practicing the shootout makes a tangible difference on a team's shootout record. We all know the Flyers have the NHl's worst all-time shootout record. But they've mixed in practices during some regimes, and not done it with others. Leaguewide, I don't know how many coaches either work in to the regimen or do not.

"Not practicing anything." This is not accurate. Tortorella absolutely does watch prescout video, does watch and critique his own teams' game video (although the assistant coaches do the heavy lifting in what to select and review with players), and he does target specific areas for practice. Now, that being said, the Torts Flyers do heavily systems-focused work at a later point in training camp than I've seen with previous regimes in camp. He is big on the skating volume, conditioning grind, lots of battle drills and small-area stuff and the level of compete in scrimmages on the front end of camp, and systems work later on.

"Benching Luongo for the Heritage Classic." I can't speak to that particular situation. But, as per the Frost (in Toronto) and Sanheim (in Calgary) scratches last year, I do believe that, if he wants to send a message to a player, doing it in a game the player is especially psyched to play very well could be a deliberate calculation even if that motivation is denied publicly.

"Storming Calgary's dressing room." The previous items on this last might have been categorized as "crazy" by the headline, but I wouldn't call any of them actually crazy. The Calgary thing, though, yeah that nuts. Vancouver has been his only short coaching stint in the NHL. The rest have been rather long-lasting, especially for a coach with the rep for pushing hard. I do think he realizes the Calgary incident was over the line for any professional.

- bmeltzer


The drafting of Michkov imo says that Torts is a dead man walking. Michkov is already dealing with Torts-like mind games. Do you think he’ll be allowed to do that to Michkov? The volatile personality doesn’t play well today. Players today respond better to consistency and stability from their coach. The over scrimmaging/ brutal skate is akin to hazing. He’s a caretaker until Michkov gets over.

ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

Sep 29 @ 4:11 PM ET
The drafting of Michkov imo says that Torts is a dead man walking. Michkov is already dealing with Torts-like mind games. Do you think he’ll be allowed to do that to Michkov? The volatile personality doesn’t play well today. Players today respond better to consistency and stability from their coach. The over scrimmaging/ brutal skate is akin to hazing. He’s a caretaker until Michkov gets over.
- Minnyhock

Dream scenario is Cutter has an absolute monster season, land slide hobey baker award winner, BC wins national championship and he doesn’t get any regular season NHL time. Demands Torts gone in the summer or he will go back to BC
THE EVIL WITHIN
Season Ticket Holder
Location: NJ
Joined: 11.20.2017

Sep 29 @ 4:14 PM ET
I'm not the Torts Whisper but in the year-plus he has been here, he definitely has his own way of doing things. He may or may not agree -- these are just my own read, and it could be wrong -- but I can see a few parallels here with several things mentioned in the article. Except there's a method to it, not craziness.

"Doesn't practice the power play".... The Flyers do practice the power play under Torts but, in general, he's a big believer in delegating to his assistants. All goaltending issues filter through the goalie coach. Power play through the assistant who runs PP and PK through that assistant. But, in general, the head coach being fairly hands off in terms of the power play was an old school staple. Even Fred Shero, hockey's most innovative coach of his time, believed the power play didn't have to be practiced.

"Yelling at David Booth for being late when he wasn't." I strongly suspect that Torts knew Booth was on time BUT was looking for a confrontation before even heading into the room. A) He probably wanted to see how Booth would react and B) He wanted to see if other Canucks would push back on his behalf. He's always done that sort of thing. Even at last Saturday's second scrimmage, matching two sides in their third scrimmage in two days (after the Day 1 skate test), when Tortorella stopped it midway through to come down and berate the players on the ice, most observers thought the actual simulated game wasn't going THAT badly. Torts may have been looking for an "in" to send a message that he wasn't going to cut any slack no matter how much skating they'd done. Likewise, I doubt it was an accident that he had a lot players in Sunday's double-scrimmage group (their fourth in three days) in Monday's lineup in Newark. He knew they'd be the most dead-legged on Monday and wanted to see who'd overcome it and have a good game. As it turned out, practically no one did.

"Having stars block shots." Yes, that's a non-negotiable with Torts.

"Communicating with players." Although Torts says his favorite part of coaching is getting to know players, their families, etc., he doesn't really talk much one-on-one with players (although he does welcome them to come to his office if they feel they want to discuss something). I don't believe last year that he didn't know he was scratching Frost and Sanheim in front of their families -- that was too coincidental that the lone scratching for both just so happened be in their respective hometown/junior hockey city with their family and friends in the stands. But as Torts explains it and people like Atkinson and Scott Hartnell have said, the relationship is built over more than one year and one off-season. Sanheim this year should have a better relationship with Tortorella, at least in theory. Frost might. York might. We shall see.

"Communicating with anyone." We'll see over time with Jones, Briere, Lappy, etc., but so far they all say on or off the record that they have a strong relationship with Torts.In terms of communicating with the media, it all depends on Torts' mood and the situation. He can be relaxed, instructive, patient, articulate and even friendly. He can be blunt and brief. Or he can get downright surly and confrontational over seemingly routine stuff. There are usually a couple reporters with whom he's the most likely to curse at or cut off. He's usually good with the broadcasters. And in terms of writers, I know I've told the Jay Greenberg story before but I'll repeat it. When Jay was let go by the New York Daily News, the one and only coach he'd covered over his long career who called him on the phone just to ask how he was doing was John Tortorella.

I'll also take issue with the article saying that Tortorella's relationship with Travis Green, by virtue of not discussing what was going on with Utica, showed that he "didn't care". I've heard this first hand: Torts believes in giving the minor league HC the space to run his own team. He doesn't demand they mirror Torts' systems. He doesn't demand players' AHL roles be tailored the way Torts would use them in the NHL. And he doesn't impose he own reads on a player on them, but also isn't going to seek a lot of input the other way on callup players. He finds out the 411 from management and then makes his own calls. You can like it or dislike it, but I don't think "he doesn't care" is accurate.

"Not learning from his mistakes." I would say that's subjective. However, the things he considers non-negotiables don't change from team to team. In general, there is evidence that he's evolved in some ways, held firm in other ways.

"Not practicing the shootout." I'm not sure if there's direct evidence, one way or another, that practicing or not practicing the shootout makes a tangible difference on a team's shootout record. We all know the Flyers have the NHl's worst all-time shootout record. But they've mixed in practices during some regimes, and not done it with others. Leaguewide, I don't know how many coaches either work in to the regimen or do not.

"Not practicing anything." This is not accurate. Tortorella absolutely does watch prescout video, does watch and critique his own teams' game video (although the assistant coaches do the heavy lifting in what to select and review with players), and he does target specific areas for practice. Now, that being said, the Torts Flyers do heavily systems-focused work at a later point in training camp than I've seen with previous regimes in camp. He is big on the skating volume, conditioning grind, lots of battle drills and small-area stuff and the level of compete in scrimmages on the front end of camp, and systems work later on.

"Benching Luongo for the Heritage Classic." I can't speak to that particular situation. But, as per the Frost (in Toronto) and Sanheim (in Calgary) scratches last year, I do believe that, if he wants to send a message to a player, doing it in a game the player is especially psyched to play very well could be a deliberate calculation even if that motivation is denied publicly.

"Storming Calgary's dressing room." The previous items on this last might have been categorized as "crazy" by the headline, but I wouldn't call any of them actually crazy. The Calgary thing, though, yeah that nuts. Vancouver has been his only short coaching stint in the NHL. The rest have been rather long-lasting, especially for a coach with the rep for pushing hard. I do think he realizes the Calgary incident was over the line for any professional.

- bmeltzer

😆 The hockey hating sports shows called the Torts Calgary Flames stunt for wrestling antics.
THE EVIL WITHIN
Season Ticket Holder
Location: NJ
Joined: 11.20.2017

Sep 29 @ 4:16 PM ET
Can't come soon enough.
- MJL

Rocky or Laperriere will replace him. Not really modern hockey big vision guys.
Bill Meltzer
Editor
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Joined: 07.13.2006

Sep 29 @ 4:23 PM ET
Rocky or Laperriere will replace him. Not really modern hockey big vision guys.
- THE EVIL WITHIN


Don't confuse Rocky Thompson the player with the coach. He's a lot more "modern" as a coach than you might think.
Phillywhiteout
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: West Chester, PA
Joined: 08.11.2020

Sep 29 @ 4:27 PM ET
Dream scenario is Cutter has an absolute monster season, land slide hobey baker award winner, BC wins national championship and he doesn’t get any regular season NHL time. Demands Torts gone in the summer or he will go back to BC
- ClaudeFather
I think this will stay a dream scenario. You really think a college kid coming into the NHL is gonna make that kind of demand? And even if he did do you really think an NHL organization would get rid of a veteran coach at his request? I don't...not for one fleeting second.
ClaudeFather
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: west haven, CT
Joined: 08.14.2015

Sep 29 @ 4:35 PM ET
I think this will stay a dream scenario. You really think a college kid coming into the NHL is gonna make that kind of demand? And even if he did do you really think an NHL organization would get rid of a veteran coach at his request? I don't...not for one fleeting second.
- Phillywhiteout

You never know! Hence the dream scenario. Maybe the only possibility would be Cutter had the same agent as half the team, this upcoming season is absolute hell with Torts, and the agent/Cutter draw the line in the sand on behalf of the team. One can dream.
Minnyhock
Minnesota Wild
Joined: 06.26.2021

Sep 29 @ 4:38 PM ET
Don't confuse Rocky Thompson the player with the coach. He's a lot more "modern" as a coach than you might think.
- bmeltzer


Always liked Rocky. A black mark on the Sharks for doing him like that.

WhiskeyMan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: PA
Joined: 04.27.2018

Sep 29 @ 4:56 PM ET
The drafting of Michkov imo says that Torts is a dead man walking. Michkov is already dealing with Torts-like mind games. Do you think he’ll be allowed to do that to Michkov? The volatile personality doesn’t play well today. Players today respond better to consistency and stability from their coach. The over scrimmaging/ brutal skate is akin to hazing. He’s a caretaker until Michkov gets over.
- Minnyhock


Are you seriously comparing a Russian dictator regime and a Russian Oligarch to the way Torts coaches?

I have heardbof grasping at straws, but the comparison is ridiculous.
Minnyhock
Minnesota Wild
Joined: 06.26.2021

Sep 29 @ 5:03 PM ET
Are you seriously comparing a Russian dictator regime and a Russian Oligarch to the way Torts coaches?

I have heardbof grasping at straws, but the comparison is ridiculous.

- WhiskeyMan


Calm down. This isn’t political. I’m talking about how his hockey coaches over there are treating him.

MJL
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Candyland, PA
Joined: 09.20.2007

Sep 29 @ 5:06 PM ET
Don't confuse Rocky Thompson the player with the coach. He's a lot more "modern" as a coach than you might think.
- bmeltzer


Maybe but I didn't see any evidence of that. From him or the entire coaching staff.
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:02 PM ET
Oh boy, we get to listen to Jack Edwards?


Why does he sound like Will Ferrell doing Harry Caray?
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:20 PM ET
Snipe
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:22 PM ET
Bobby Brink being noticeable early.
missingmike
Joined: 07.08.2011

Sep 29 @ 7:31 PM ET
Can we offer Cal to Tampa?
missingmike
Joined: 07.08.2011

Sep 29 @ 7:33 PM ET
That was a Chinese fire drill
SuperSchennBros
Location: Not protected by the Mods...I mean Mob. Take your best shot!
Joined: 09.01.2012

Sep 29 @ 7:34 PM ET
Why Pasta isn’t Captain is beyond me. He’s young. He can be the face of the bruins for along time. The Bruins are begging to have Marchand embarrass them.
Letterkenney
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Dementia Patient in the White House, DC, PA
Joined: 03.20.2020

Sep 29 @ 7:37 PM ET
Looks like the Meat got tenderized by the Rat!
Letterkenney
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Dementia Patient in the White House, DC, PA
Joined: 03.20.2020

Sep 29 @ 7:37 PM ET
That was a Chinese fire drill
- missingmike


Get used to it
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:39 PM ET
Can we offer Cal to Tampa?
- missingmike



They are in cap hell.
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:41 PM ET
Brink making a case IMO.
SuperSchennBros
Location: Not protected by the Mods...I mean Mob. Take your best shot!
Joined: 09.01.2012

Sep 29 @ 7:41 PM ET
Brink gonna take Foerster’s spot
Letterkenney
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Dementia Patient in the White House, DC, PA
Joined: 03.20.2020

Sep 29 @ 7:42 PM ET
Brink looked really good on that PP. And a nice pass to finish it off. Good work by the little guy.
MBFlyerfan
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Be nice from now on, NJ
Joined: 03.17.2006

Sep 29 @ 7:44 PM ET
Brink looked really good on that PP. And a nice pass to finish it off. Good work by the little guy.

- Letterkenney



He has had a very strong game so far. He looks very quick.
Letterkenney
Philadelphia Flyers
Location: Dementia Patient in the White House, DC, PA
Joined: 03.20.2020

Sep 29 @ 7:46 PM ET
He has had a very strong game so far. He looks very quick.
- MBFlyerfan


Not only that but if you watched where he was going and what he was doing on the ice it's apparent that his hockey IQ is very high. Smart player.
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