Tavares was winning 56% of his draws and played well defensively. Marner did neither of those things.
- drexel

Tavares was on the ice for 3 EVGA, Marner and Matthews 2 EVGA.

Knies, the guy everybody thinks is a playoff warrior, was on the ice for 5 EVGA. I like the kid but people are being so emotional right now they can't see facts.

Does Tavares kill penalties? Nope. Is Marner supposed to take FOs? Nope.

He's the oldest one. It's obvious who the real odd man out here is.

Marner for Konecny and Frost
- Santo_44

Pacific or central teams only please

We had this convo whipper! Leafs have more room then they've had in years ...they have about $17.5M to spend and this foundation to play with

Knies-Matthews-Marner
McMann-JT-Nylander
Robertson-Holmberg-Jarnkrok
Dewar-Kampf-Reaves
Rielly
McCabe
Benoit-Timmins
Woll

A veteran goalie ....and a 6/7 dman are both cheap. Maybe they bring back Domi. But I think they could spend about 10-12M on a pair of d'men if they like the options.
- The Law

I think Dmen are going to come at a HUGE premium this offseason. Your lineup looks a lot like just running it back again, but if they can pick up a couple of stud dmen, it may work out.

I really hope Timmins gets more of a shot, not sure why he hasn't yet. I love how he moves the puck, and I think with more time the rest of his game rounds into form.

I mean, a lot of the time PP2 looked better than PP1.
- Whipper

And didn't do poop. Had the coach come up with a different system, scrambled the lines better, maybe it would have got them a better result.

so a bit bigger than Gallagher and Marchand
- drexel

Oh, I'm not saying he'll be a bust by any stretch of the imagination. I don't think he has the "snot" that those two have, though. I've said before, hopefully he's more of a St. Louis than a Robertson.

President & Alternate Governor | Brendan Shanahan
General Manager | Brad Treliving
Special Advisor to the General Manager | Shane Doan
Assistant General Manager | Brandon Pridham
Assistant General Manager, Player Personnel | Derek Clancey
Assistant General Manager, Player Development | Dr. Hayley Wickenheiser
Assistant General Manager, Hockey Research & Development | Darryl Metcalf
Assistant General Manager, Minor League Ops & GM, Toronto Marlies | Ryan Hardy
Senior Advisor, Player Personnel | Dave Morrison
Director, Player Personnel & Amateur Scouting | Wes Clark
Director of Goaltending Development and Scouting | Curtis McElhinney
Director, Hockey and Scouting Operations | Reid Mitchell
Director, Hockey Operations & Administration | Leanne Hederson
Director, Development Operations & Analysis | Will Sibley
Director, Team Operations | Brad Lynn
Director, Team Security | Steven Walker

MAPLE LEAFS COACHING STAFF
Head Coach | Sheldon Keefe
Assistant Coaches | Guy Boucher, Dean Chynoweth, Mike Van Ryn, Manny Malhotra
Goaltending Coach | Curtis Sanford
Video Coordinator and Statistical Analyst | Jordan Bean
Video and Coaching Coordinator | Sam Kim
Coaching Development Associate | Harry Mahesh


MAPLE LEAFS PERFORMANCE STAFF
Director, High Performance | Rich Rotenberg
Head Strength and Conditioning Coach | Louis Rojas
Assistant Strength and Conditioning Coach | Artie Hairston
Roving Strength and Conditioning Coach | Trevor Bartoli


PLAYER DEVELOPMENT
Director, Player Development | Danielle Goyette
Player Development | Nik Antropov, Denver Manderson, Thomas Pacina, Rich Clune, Joe Underwood, Patrick O’Sullivan
Skating Consultants | Paul Matheson, Michele Moore Davidson

I think Dmen are going to come at a HUGE premium this offseason. Your lineup looks a lot like just running it back again, but if they can pick up a couple of stud dmen, it may work out.

I really hope Timmins gets more of a shot, not sure why he hasn't yet. I love how he moves the puck, and I think with more time the rest of his game rounds into form.
- Whipper

Depends what type of D. Usually players get paid more to score goals and points, for example, Klingberg got paid multiple times because he scores points but can't play D for poop.

But if you're looking for defensive, low scoring RHD like Pesce and/or DeMelo, I doubt they get more than between 3.5 - 4.5 AAV. Which would be less than what Brodie was getting, for example.

The Leafs have almost 19 million in cap space. If they sign Pesce and DeMelo for 9 AAV combined, they'd still have 10 million left over to keep Domi and add another top-six forward and/or a goalie.

❤️
- Woderwick

Baja style ....on a tortilla ...with some jalapeno slaw and pico de gallo ..and a Modelo or 2.

And didn't do poop. Had the coach come up with a different system, scrambled the lines better, maybe it would have got them a better result.
- Rare_Jewel

Agreed, lets get a completely new coaching staff

Tavares was on the ice for 3 EVGA, Marner and Matthews 2 EVGA.

Knies, the guy everybody thinks is a playoff warrior, was on the ice for 5 EVGA. I like the kid but people are being so emotional right now they can't see facts.

Does Tavares kill penalties? Nope. Is Marner supposed to take FOs? Nope.

He's the oldest one. It's obvious who the real odd man out here is.
- Rare_Jewel

where are you getting this from?
I see 5v5 he was 4-3
Tavares 3-2

At least we know the windows are clean in here.
- .HOHO.

Not if you are in Buffalo.

Wait till next year, that’s what I’ve been saying since 67.
- shack67

Yep, and honestly, I’ve been over it for years.
Self preservation.
Win - Fantastic
Lose - life goes on

I’ve learned to embrace the entertainment the Leafs provide, good and bad.

Stop being hurt that I disagree with you.

I am not going to not want Konency because he didnt have a good playoffs when he was 22 years old.

Don't be butt hurt, move on.

If you care then good for you.
- Santo_44

Yes man, take your advice but will not even agree that the sky is blue.

We had this convo whipper! Leafs have more room then they've had in years ...they have about $17.5M to spend and this foundation to play with

Knies-Matthews-Marner
McMann-JT-Nylander
Robertson-Holmberg-Jarnkrok
Dewar-Kampf-Reaves
Rielly
McCabe
Benoit-Timmins
Woll

A veteran goalie ....and a 6/7 dman are both cheap. Maybe they bring back Domi. But I think they could spend about 10-12M on a pair of d'men if they like the options.
- The Law

I just realized reading back that you don't have Bert or Domi on there. Surely, you bring back Domi at least, right?!?

Sorry, I'll stop calling your Shirley.

President & Alternate Governor | Brendan Shanahan
General Manager | Brad Treliving
Special Advisor to the General Manager | Shane Doan
Assistant General Manager | Brandon Pridham
Assistant General Manager, Player Personnel | Derek Clancey
Assistant General Manager, Player Development | Dr. Hayley Wickenheiser
Assistant General Manager, Hockey Research & Development | Darryl Metcalf
Assistant General Manager, Minor League Ops & GM, Toronto Marlies | Ryan Hardy
Senior Advisor, Player Personnel | Dave Morrison
Director, Player Personnel & Amateur Scouting | Wes Clark
Director of Goaltending Development and Scouting | Curtis McElhinney
Director, Hockey and Scouting Operations | Reid Mitchell
Director, Hockey Operations & Administration | Leanne Hederson
Director, Development Operations & Analysis | Will Sibley
Director, Team Operations | Brad Lynn
Director, Team Security | Steven Walker

MAPLE LEAFS COACHING STAFF
Head Coach | Sheldon Keefe
Assistant Coaches | Guy Boucher, Dean Chynoweth, Mike Van Ryn, Manny Malhotra
Goaltending Coach | Curtis Sanford
Video Coordinator and Statistical Analyst | Jordan Bean
Video and Coaching Coordinator | Sam Kim
Coaching Development Associate | Harry Mahesh


MAPLE LEAFS PERFORMANCE STAFF
Director, High Performance | Rich Rotenberg
Head Strength and Conditioning Coach | Louis Rojas
Assistant Strength and Conditioning Coach | Artie Hairston
Roving Strength and Conditioning Coach | Trevor Bartoli


PLAYER DEVELOPMENT
Director, Player Development | Danielle Goyette
Player Development | Nik Antropov, Denver Manderson, Thomas Pacina, Rich Clune, Joe Underwood, Patrick O’Sullivan
Skating Consultants | Paul Matheson, Michele Moore Davidson



- AdamFrench

the Fraser Minten and perhaps Easton Cowan eras begin next year too.
- drexel

Both might still need some time before having an impact/ be NHL regulars though.

Just look at Robertson. He's getting there but it took him a few years as a pro.

President & Alternate Governor | Brendan Shanahan
General Manager | Brad Treliving
Special Advisor to the General Manager | Shane Doan
Assistant General Manager | Brandon Pridham
Assistant General Manager, Player Personnel | Derek Clancey
Assistant General Manager, Player Development | Dr. Hayley Wickenheiser
Assistant General Manager, Hockey Research & Development | Darryl Metcalf
Assistant General Manager, Minor League Ops & GM, Toronto Marlies | Ryan Hardy
Senior Advisor, Player Personnel | Dave Morrison
Director, Player Personnel & Amateur Scouting | Wes Clark
Director of Goaltending Development and Scouting | Curtis McElhinney
Director, Hockey and Scouting Operations | Reid Mitchell
Director, Hockey Operations & Administration | Leanne Hederson
Director, Development Operations & Analysis | Will Sibley
Director, Team Operations | Brad Lynn
Director, Team Security | Steven Walker

MAPLE LEAFS COACHING STAFF
Head Coach | Sheldon Keefe
Assistant Coaches | Guy Boucher, Dean Chynoweth, Mike Van Ryn, Manny Malhotra
Goaltending Coach | Curtis Sanford
Video Coordinator and Statistical Analyst | Jordan Bean
Video and Coaching Coordinator | Sam Kim
Coaching Development Associate | Harry Mahesh


MAPLE LEAFS PERFORMANCE STAFF
Director, High Performance | Rich Rotenberg
Head Strength and Conditioning Coach | Louis Rojas
Assistant Strength and Conditioning Coach | Artie Hairston
Roving Strength and Conditioning Coach | Trevor Bartoli


PLAYER DEVELOPMENT
Director, Player Development | Danielle Goyette
Player Development | Nik Antropov, Denver Manderson, Thomas Pacina, Rich Clune, Joe Underwood, Patrick O’Sullivan
Skating Consultants | Paul Matheson, Michele Moore Davidson



- AdamFrench

A few useless virtue signal hires, a lot of bad coaches and a lot more useless positions of pencil pushers.

Mike Van Ryn, no wonder the PK sucked, he was a bottom pair D who went to Robidas Island before it even existed.

Nik Antropov, player development. What does he develop? How to be useless and injured most of your career?

Curtis McElhinney, no wonder the Leafs haven't developed a starting goalie since Felix Potvin.

Curtis Sanford as the goalie coach? No surprise Samsonov sucks and continues to suck.

At the end of the day, all of this falls on Shanahan. He's at the top of Pyramid Power failure.

AAV champs to keep God status
- senstroll

so cheating while playing video games.

Both might still need some time before having an impact/ be NHL regulars though.

Just look at Robertson. He's getting there but it took him a few years as a pro.
- Scabeh

yeah but he sucks at D thats why he gets yanked. The other 2 are apparently good at team D to begin with. Cowan likely C for the world junior team at current pace

where are you getting this from?
I see 5v5 he was 4-3
Tavares 3-2
- senstroll

NHL.com

https://www.nhl.com/stats...gainst&page=0&pageSize=50

Beef up this defense:

Marner to Saint Louis for Parayko,etc.
Sign Pesce.
Find a goalie to pair with Woll.
- wingz4life

A rosee or a pinot noir.

is what came to mind.

A few useless virtue signal hires, a lot of bad coaches and a lot more useless positions of pencil pushers.

Mike Van Ryn, no wonder the PK sucked, he was a bottom pair D who went to Robidas Island before it even existed.

Nik Antropov, player development. What does he develop? How to be useless and injured most of your career?

Curtis McElhinney, no wonder the Leafs haven't developed a starting goalie since Felix Potvin.

Curtis Sanford as the goalie coach? No surprise Samsonov sucks and continues to suck.

At the end of the day, all of this falls on Shanahan. He's at the top of Pyramid Power failure.
- Rare_Jewel

I think hes mentoring Woll

Willy didn't just come off a 6 year deal he hasn't lived up too, he was actually incredibly underpaid through his previous deal. So big difference there.
- joel878

big deal he did not get any signing bonuses as in his first deal.

Marner has more playoff GWG (the same amount as Nylander: 3) since Tavares has been a Leaf. Tavares has 1.
- Rare_Jewel

And that makes JT a playoff loser?
In his career JT has more than 2x the number of playoff goals than Marner does.

You can't call JT a playoff loser without including Marner in that.

Agreed, lets get a completely new coaching staff
- Whipper

New coach: Joel Quenneville

And a new goalie. Woll simply can't be trusted to stay healthy. As great as he was when he was playing, he screwed us twice this year with injuries. Not his fault but if he keeps getting hurt, you need another option.

Given how limited the Leafs are with cap space (unless they can dump Tavares), I think their only cheap options would be Cam Talbot as a UFA or Logan Thompson as a trade option.

Logan Thompson is a 1 year 700K deal and becomes a UFA. You could catch lightning in a bottle for a mid round pick.