Not true.

Tree wanted Z and Tanev and salary retention. He was greedy IMO.
- underhill14

Good thing it didn't work out, because that would have been pricey. Also, D wasn't our problem in the playoffs.

We'll just ignore what you need for now. You must be quite proud!

I always note with Matthews that he hasn't led us anywhere in the playoffs and that is obviously his largest drawback. That said Matthews has won a Calder, 3 Richard trophies, a Hart and a Pearson (Lindsay). He's been a 1st team allstar and this year he (or McDavid) has a solid shot at being the 2nd team allstar behind MacKinnon. I don't think he's winning the Byng, Selke or Lindsay this year - but he's in the top-3.

Matthews' new contract is based at 15.2% and MacKinnon's new contract is based at 15.1% of the cap the first year they are in effect. McDavid's is a 15.7% deal expiring in two years. Ovechkin's big deal in 2008 was 16.8%; Crosby's, signed the same year, was 15.4%.

In the constantly shifting sands of player evaluation, Matthews does an awful lot of things better than almost anyone else. You look at Selke voting and you'll see Matthews and Marner there pretty routinely. Back in 2021 MacKinnon was 22nd and McDavid was 27th - that's about where they each peaked in Selke voting.

Matthews is probably paid pretty fairly - and I hope that will reflect itself as the cap raises and his salary aligns into the elite sphere. Marner shouldn't be underrated. The guy is an elite player - a 2 time 1st team All-Star and 3rd in Selke voting last year. His playoff woes shouldn't make us rush to try and offload him unless there is a value in making the move.
- Monkeypunk

1. I didn't say I NEEDED anything (especially not big hard D) and I also didn't say I have it so nothing to be proud of. lol

2. I'm not 'in a rush' to get rid of Marner. I am hoping this team is in a rush to address and remedy the issue that exists in relation to the piss poor results year over year in the playoffs and the clear relationship that has with the distribution of the salary cap on this team.

That means taking money that is currently invested in 'elite offense' (which apparently doesn't translate to even adequate or average offense cone playoffs) and moving some of it to other areas / other types of players.

As I said with AM and WN locked up and JT coming off the books and gaining money there I also think MM should be (will be the easier piece) to move to accomplish this.

Nobody is discrediting (ok I'm not anyway) Marner's skill set, ability or accolades - but not getting it done in the playoffs is not a new thing for him. How long do you wait enjoying regular season awesomeness and playoff m'eh or worse before you try something different?

Sorry but I am firmly in the camp of needing to try a new approach at this point, this core has had it's time to try and has failed for whatever reason so time for a new look/feel/make up.

for you and other yes
for some us NO it's not
- dmnted

*Checks*

No I did not force anyone against their will to say Marner not leaving is a failure.

Good thing it didn't work out, because that would have been pricey. Also, D wasn't our problem in the playoffs.
- Whipper

Defending wasn't our problem but our blueline was/is/has for along time been a big part of the problem.

You watch some other teams ...the blueliners are heavily influencing the transition and offense.

Defending wasn't our problem but our blueline was/is/has for along time been a big part of the problem.

You watch some other teams ...the blueliners are heavily influencing the transition and offense.
- The Law

If Mitch digs his heels in and insists on staying, throw him on D next year. 😉

Why does everyone say Tavares is an impossible to move? Is there not a team (like Anaheim) that has the cap space and needs to add some veteran leadership to support their outstanding young prospects?

I wonder. Why is Tavares playing at the world championships? Is he trying to send a message? I think you would have multiple teams interested in Tavares if the Leafs retained 40 or 50%. It would free up more money in the quest for goaltending and defence. It would also make the idea of retaining Marner more popular.

*Checks*

No I did not force anyone against their will to say Marner not leaving is a failure.
- Santo_44

who's saying you forced people in saying that ??? Who???

Why does everyone say Tavares is an impossible to move? Is there not a team (like Anaheim) that has the cap space and needs to add some veteran leadership to support their outstanding young prospects?

I wonder. Why is Tavares playing at the world championships? Is he trying to send a message? I think you would have multiple teams interested in Tavares if the Leafs retained 40 or 50%. It would free up more money in the quest for goaltending and defence. It would also make the idea of retaining Marner more popular.
- spatso

He's not impossible to move at all. Unless he refuses to go. In that case... impossible.

who's saying you forced people in saying that ??? Who???
- dmnted

For YOU it may not seem so

but for OTHERS absolutely

Why does everyone say Tavares is an impossible to move? Is there not a team (like Anaheim) that has the cap space and needs to add some veteran leadership to support their outstanding young prospects?

I wonder. Why is Tavares playing at the world championships? Is he trying to send a message? I think you would have multiple teams interested in Tavares if the Leafs retained 40 or 50%. It would free up more money in the quest for goaltending and defence. It would also make the idea of retaining Marner more popular.
- spatso

cause it will cost the Leafs to much to move him then to keep him.
Look at the Marleau deal. It took a 1st to move him without retention .
it will cost the same to move the last year of Tavares contract.
the whole point of moving Tavares or Marner is to regain cap space and if you retain, you lose that cap space.

Why does everyone say Tavares is an impossible to move? Is there not a team (like Anaheim) that has the cap space and needs to add some veteran leadership to support their outstanding young prospects?

I wonder. Why is Tavares playing at the world championships? Is he trying to send a message? I think you would have multiple teams interested in Tavares if the Leafs retained 40 or 50%. It would free up more money in the quest for goaltending and defence. It would also make the idea of retaining Marner more popular.
- spatso

He's not impossible to move, but he's not going to bring a return that strongly moves the needle. If you retain 50% on him, you are saving about $5.5m on the cap? You have to replace his production (29g, 65p) and the going rate for 30g centers is probably that much or more. His contract is up in one year. If you are going to shoot him into the Sun, then don't retain anything and take a diminished return - especially if you're not adverse to letting him walk for nothing after this coming season. Tree is gonna keep him.

For YOU it may not seem so

but for OTHERS absolutely
- Santo_44

yeah, so nothing.

yeah, so nothing.
- dmnted

the name checks out for you

cause it will cost the Leafs to much to move him then to keep him.
Look at the Marleau deal. It took a 1st to move him without retention .
it will cost the same to move the last year of Tavares contract.
the whole point of moving Tavares or Marner is to regain cap space and if you retain, you lose that cap space.
- dmnted

The Leafs can eat some cap space. The actual $ owed is next to nothing. It was front loaded cash. It's definitely moveable.

He's not impossible to move, but he's not going to bring a return that strongly moves the needle. If you retain 50% on him, you are saving about $5.5m on the cap? You have to replace his production (29g, 65p) and the going rate for 30g centers is probably that much or more. His contract is up in one year. If you are going to shoot him into the Sun, then don't retain anything and take a diminished return - especially if you're not adverse to letting him walk for nothing after this coming season. Tree is gonna keep him.
- GalacticStone

yeah If I am moving Tavres, im not retaining anything and not adding a sweetener.
he will be just cap hit and no $$. Thats valuable to teams who dont want to spend to the cap

Assuming that none of the Core 5 go..I think there is about 23 million to spend

I would try to trade for a goalie but barring that

Trade Kampf/Lily
Sign 2C - Chandler Stevenson/Elias Lindolm ($4-5 mil), Monahan on the cheap at $2 mil
Don't sign Domi
Don't sign Bertuzzi
Sign Corey Perry - ($1.25 mil)
Sign Matt Duchense - ($ 3.5 mil)
Sign RD - Montour/Pesce ($6-7 mill)
Sign LD - Brendon Dillon/Sean Walker ($ 3-4 mil)
Sign 2 Goalie - Brossoit/Stolarz/Luukkonen/Jones(Unless there is a trade for a Number 1)($ 3 mil)


Knies - Matthews - Duchense
McMann - Stephenson/Linkholm - Marner
Robertson - JT - Nylander
Cowan/Perry - Holmberg - Dewar
Reavo/Bellows

Reilly - Montour/Pesce
Benoit - McCabe
Dillon/Walker - Niemela

Kokonen

Woll
Brossoit/Stolarz/Luukkonen
Jones
- Azuredoom

I have to say, I like most of what you have laid out here. Probably wont have enough money for it all, but its decent. I think resigning one of Domi/Bertuzzi would be good if they can make it work though instead of Duchene.

the name checks out for you
- Santo_44

correct, the name Santos_44 sure does.

The Leafs can eat some cap space. The actual $ owed is next to nothing. It was front loaded cash. It's definitely moveable.
- fifty__missions

some yeah ok but not much.
at least there is a positive that 98% of his contract will be paid out come July 1st
the contract is moveable if the Leafs want to ship out a high draft pick with him.

If Mitch digs his heels in and insists on staying, throw him on D next year. 😉
- fifty__missions

Make him the practice goalie.

Orcas sank another sailboat off the coast of Morocco.

That would be some scary poop.

cause it will cost the Leafs to much to move him then to keep him.
Look at the Marleau deal. It took a 1st to move him without retention .
it will cost the same to move the last year of Tavares contract.
the whole point of moving Tavares or Marner is to regain cap space and if you retain, you lose that cap space.
- dmnted

It's a very difficult proposition either way. You're right - Tavares has negative trade value based on his contract. Not that we wouldn't likely get a good pick back with 50% retention, for instance, but if we didn't want to retain, we're paying. Either way it's not what we want.

With Marner, you'd ideally be moving him for a return in an area of need - to a destination of his choosing - so it becomes it's own challenge as well. Marner, at least, has positive trade value - he'd be moved in a hockey trade that would ostensibly leave several million in addition on the table.

There's almost nothing in the goalie market for UFA this year and there are a lot of defensemen primed to be overpaid - Pesce, Tanev, Zadorov, Walker, Skjei, OEL, Kylington ... and a few guys I like because they are versatile and know defense - like Dillon, Demelo - or even a lower pairing guy like Forbort are all probably less expensive options who could put up some decent numbers and offer change.

Up front the UFA market is littered with decent options, so I suppose remaking notable portions of the team is quite possible.

I can sincerely say that I have no idea what they'll do, who they'd target, or what it would all entail.

He's not impossible to move, but he's not going to bring a return that strongly moves the needle. If you retain 50% on him, you are saving about $5.5m on the cap? You have to replace his production (29g, 65p) and the going rate for 30g centers is probably that much or more. His contract is up in one year. If you are going to shoot him into the Sun, then don't retain anything and take a diminished return - especially if you're not adverse to letting him walk for nothing after this coming season. Tree is gonna keep him.
- GalacticStone

Exactly this. There's just no reason to move him. The only value you get in moving him, you lose in replacing him. For one year it's not worth it.

I think we are long overdue another "worst Leafs poster" tournament.

Exactly this. There's just no reason to move him. The only value you get in moving him, you lose in replacing him. For one year it's not worth it.
- Monkeypunk

I can't imagine any situation where he goes. He still puts up a decent amount of points, wins a heck of a lot of faceoffs, and is the Captain. I think the C has to wind up on Matthews soon, but that's another story.

I fully expect him to sign a team friendly extension July 1st.

I think we are long overdue another "worst Leafs poster" tournament.
- Scabeh

Why, we all know who the clear winner is...