How bout some unsigned players on league mins: Nick Cousins or Sammy Blais for the fourth line?

And anyone hear a JBD to VGK rumor with Whitecloud coming back?

Bit strange to have overlooked Batherson (309) and Stutzle (285)... but it certainly illustrates how many games Norris has lost to injury. In fact, despite just coming off their ELC this year, Sanderson (156) and Pinto (140) have nearly caught up in terms of career GP. Notably, pretty much everyone else on the list (in the top-10) plays or played for Buffalo. Basically, the Atlantic Division has been dominated for a long time by 3 teams, who have either won or appeared in the Stanley Cup Finals in each of the last 6 years. They've also each won a President's Trophy in the same timeframe. Then you also have the Maple Leafs winning a lot of regular season games as well. So it's been an unusually hard division, in fairness to both BUF/OTT.
- khawk

Good point about Batherson and Stutzle. I think I was half awake lol

Good point about Batherson and Stutzle. I think I was half awake lol
- AlfieisKing

I maybe phrased it less kindly than I should have - it was genuinely interesting to see how far up the list Stutzle was, despite being a 2020 draft pick. This core group really is overdue to take a major step towards post-season competitiveness. I'll be very curious to see how Green brings the group together differently in training camp in order to get them better prepared for the start of the season.

How bout some unsigned players on league mins: Nick Cousins or Sammy Blais for the fourth line?

And anyone hear a JBD to VGK rumor with Whitecloud coming back?
- GrimmdaGoalie

Would be nice. Where you heard that

Would be nice. Where you heard that
- Crosside

Can't find the link but if I remember, it was a Vegas site that was suggesting the team had to shed salary and how they didn't think Theodore would go as the $$$ was too high for other teams to take, it would more likely be Whitecloud.

Can't find the link but if I remember, it was a Vegas site that was suggesting the team had to shed salary and how they didn't think Theodore would go as the $$$ was too high for other teams to take, it would more likely be Whitecloud.
- GrimmdaGoalie

That move could make sense for both teams especially given the cap limits both teams are working with - but if Bernard-Docker was going the other way it would have to include a decent draft pick. Given the extent to which Staios seems to like closure, maybe include the 3rd (WSH) from the Chychrun trade? Just make sure to disclose any #%$@ no-trade lists JBD might have drafted in his spare time, even without a NTC clause in his contract.

That move could make sense for both teams especially given the cap limits both teams are working with - but if Bernard-Docker was going the other way it would have to include a decent draft pick. Given the extent to which Staios seems to like closure, maybe include the 3rd (WSH) from the Chychrun trade? Just make sure to disclose any #%$@ no-trade lists JBD might have drafted in his spare time, even without a NTC clause in his contract.
- khawk

Why would we do Vegas a favour by including a pick? They are looking to dump salary, so we just offer JBD for Whitecloud straight up, or maybe Vegas should should include a 4rth round in the trade as well. Its about time teams paid us for taking their salary dump. Although all I see is rumours that Vegas could trade Whitecloud if they need to jiggle the salary cap handle for a dump. But no mention of who to trade for.

Why would we do Vegas a favour by including a pick? They are looking to dump salary, so we just offer JBD for Whitecloud straight up, or maybe Vegas should should include a 4rth round in the trade as well. Its about time teams paid us for taking their salary dump. Although all I see is rumours that Vegas could trade Whitecloud if they need to jiggle the salary cap handle for a dump. But no mention of who to trade for.
- OttawaB

If you negotiate a trade by thinking you're doing another team a favour, you better not care much about the outcome. Given the market for veteran RHD and the reasonable contract Whitecloud is on, I doubt VGK will have any problem in making a trade without needing a sweetener. The real question is how comfortable Staios is with having JBD, Kleven, and Hamonic as his #5D-#7D options, given all the pressure on the coming season and the long-term importance of extending Ullmark. There are also relatively few RHD upgrade options available to Staios, so I really wouldn't be surprised if he tabled an offer like JBD +3rd.

Over at the Athletic, they have contract value report cards.

Sens finish right in the middle. They win big on Sanderson, Stutzle and Brady contracts. And the Ullmark contract, which we didn't offer. All are worth more than they are being paid, apparently.

They lose BIG on Norris and Chabot contracts, both getting D's, and both at least over valued by $3million. The Perron deal also does not come off well.

Shockingly, FLA is first. Must be nice to play hockey in FLA.

"Only problem with Florida is that it is full of people from Florida." - Carl Hiassen

Over at the Athletic, they have contract value report cards.

Sens finish right in the middle. They win big on Sanderson, Stutzle and Brady contracts. And the Ullmark contract, which we didn't offer. All are worth more than they are being paid, apparently.

They lose BIG on Norris and Chabot contracts, both getting D's, and both at least over valued by $3million. The Perron deal also does not come off well.

Shockingly, FLA is first. Must be nice to play hockey in FLA.

"Only problem with Florida is that it is full of people from Florida." - Carl Hiassen
- GrimmdaGoalie

I have a lot more tolerance for Chabot's contract - for three major reasons. 1) In terms of position, he was the closest thing the franchise had to a future #1D, and he was signed a year before Sanderson was even drafted. It was also less than a year after Karlsson was traded, so having that stability on the blue line meant something. 2) In terms of $$$/AAV it was a very big contract, but he was coming off a ~60pts scoring pace, and it was signed pre-COVID when the salary cap was increasing each year. 3) Most importantly, Chabot was the first young player to commit long-term to the Senators. The symbolic value of his 8-year contract shouldn't be under-estimated, especially given how difficult the scorched-Earth rebuild was on the fanbase.

None of these things were true of the Norris contract. The chronic injury problems weren't known at that point, but his career-best 35G season was the result of playing the whole year on the top line with Tkachuk/Batherson, and having an unsustainable 20% shooting percentage. Even so, Stutzle at just 20yo finished the year with more points, and was just starting to find his game and challenge for a top-2C position. Norris' contract was also signed right in the middle of COVID, so the NHL salary cap was frozen without a clear timeframe for it to return to annual increases. They also had Chabot, Tkachuk, and Batherson signed long-term by that point, and didn't need to commit 8 years of term without fully understanding their forward line structure.

Jakob Chychrun - 26 years old
14 goals 41 points (10th among D-men in Goals. 34th in Points)
46th in ice time in the NHL (Tied with Sergachev & Pulock)
Entering final year of 4.6M - likely gets 60M

Nick Jensen - 34 years old in 8 weeks
Last season had 1 goal, 14 points.
Tied for 146th in ice time (many forwards ahead of him)
2 years @4.05M. Then will be UFA, a 36 year old D-man

Conclusion: Trading a D-man that can score 12-15 goals, 40-45 points each year, is tall, heavy, and is 7 years younger - for a D-man that will not be useful to this team when they are competing for the cup was not only short sited, it was a horrible horrible measure of Staios' judgement. I would've been happier waiting until the deadline, hoping Chychrun either comes in under 7M or he plays well again and you get a better return. Trying to justify the value loss for positional need is like Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson

I agree.

I would have kept him. But I can see the other side of it. He's was injury prone (except last season) He also is very timid for his size. He's a gym rat beast apparently and Don Cherry probably thinks he plays like an 80's european. He rarely hits. So...move him now while he's still healthy rather be stuck with him at the deadline after another weak plus/minus season, maybe 18 goals and he's hurt and you can't move him.

Jensen is very un-sexy. He better channel his inner Marc Methot back there.

Sometimes a trade isn't about who got the better player, it is about who is a better fit. Having another right d-man was not a fit. And playing Chabot and Chychrun together as a disaster. Playing one of them on the 3rd pairing was a waste because neither brought the physicality that is needed for a 3rd pairing. Jensen is a better fit for the Senators now. It allows Chabot to be a bit more offensive minded, and we have a proper right d-man. Plus it allows Klevin the chance to move into the 3rd pairing .... Chychrun would have blocked his ascension playing 3rd pairing. Klevin's game is more physical.
With this "new" team, its all about roles and how a player fits. This will all help the team play better.
If you look at Chychrun's stats, he got worse when Martin took over from DJ Smith. He appears to prefer the game to be less structured and when asked to play with more structure he got worse. A -31 is not something the Sens will miss. We have plenty of scoring potential. We need guys/a team that will allow less goals and less chances and less shots ...... a team that plays with defensive structure. Our defence needed to change .... and I still believe we need to change out Hamonic and JBD. I certainly look forward to what Guenette can bring to the table. Maybe Mantinpalo as well with 1 year of North American pro under his belt.

The reality is that Chychrun completely and utterly failed to address the primary reason for his acquisition - to stabilize the top-4D on the RHD side. Unfortunately, he's an offensive-minded LHD who needs a defensive-minded partner just as badly as Chabot does (if not more), which means he was a total disaster in his own zone last year. If you exclude SJS/CHI/ANA as the 3 worst teams in the league, his -30 rating was the 2nd worst among all other D-man in the NHL. It was also pretty clear by year-end that he wasn't interested in staying with the team, and quite frankly I'm not surprised given that he's heading into his pre-UFA contract season.

As for Jensen, there's nothing spectacular about his game, but the difference is that he plays the kind of pro-defensive game that can make someone like Chabot a better player. He can also be far more effective veteran role model than Chychrun, who by the end of last year looked like he was suffering from PTSD in media interviews. As for the TOI difference between them, it's entirely because of PP time. In fact, if you isolate ES/SH ice time the difference between them last season was just 8 seconds... and it's no secret which of them was more effective in those situations. WSH also set a new NHL record for negative goal differential by a playoff team last year, meaning they were a team that knew how to play in close games. Valuable experience for a team whose playoff chances could rest on a knife edge.

As for the trade itself, I completely disagree that they should have waited for the trade deadline. The priority this year is to adopt more of a winning culture, prove to guys like Ullmark/Giroux that they should sign UFA extensions, and re-assure Tkachuk that they're serious about taking the next step as a playoff contender. You don't achieve those things by trading away a top-4D at the trade deadline just so you can 'maybe' get a better return. That's the definition of penny-wise/pound-foolish, and fortunately Staios had the perspective not to go down that road. They want to turn the page in every way possible by the time training camp comes around, which includes a new coaching staff, new goaltender, quality veteran supporting talent, and zero distractions from players who don't want to be there.

I agree.

I would have kept him. But I can see the other side of it. He's was injury prone (except last season) He also is very timid for his size. He's a gym rat beast apparently and Don Cherry probably thinks he plays like an 80's european. He rarely hits. So...move him now while he's still healthy rather be stuck with him at the deadline after another weak plus/minus season, maybe 18 goals and he's hurt and you can't move him.

Jensen is very un-sexy. He better channel his inner Marc Methot back there.
- Octavarium

I get you.

Methot was 27 when traded for....... 27!! He was no where close to 33. sorry, this trade might work for a year but after that has potential for disaster

Sens writer...... winning culture and hard work, all teams get that.....talent & asset management is key.

All these 1st rounders....down the f'ing drain.

Sens writer...... winning culture and hard work, all teams get that.....talent & asset management is key.

All these 1st rounders....down the f'ing drain.
- AlfieisKing

No, they don't - which is kind of the point. Accountability and developing a winning culture are literally the two biggest things that Staios has been actively changing with every single move of the off-season. These are common problems for young teams to have, and it's a scathing indictment of the previous coaching staff that they so clearly failed to prepare the team's young core for the challenges of NHL success. However, it's the reality of where the team is at, and it's an issue that needs to be addressed if the team is ever going to start realizing its potential.

No, they don't - which is kind of the point. Accountability and developing a winning culture are literally the two biggest things that Staios has been actively changing with every single move of the off-season. These are common problems for young teams to have, and it's a scathing indictment of the previous coaching staff that they so clearly failed to prepare the team's young core for the challenges of NHL success. However, it's the reality of where the team is at, and it's an issue that needs to be addressed if the team is ever going to start realizing its potential.
- khawk

Few teams go without playoffs for >4 years. It's a parody league! Otherwise every team has it. It's basic. You do that with a team that is at the beginning of a rebuild, not in year 6 of one. I get that Staios wasn't here before last year, but trading away Jakob Chychrun for a 34 year old D-man really changed my opinion of him as a GM. My reaction after Green hire too. The Ullmark trade was a beauty in that it got rid of Korpisalo AND brought in a true #1 goalie, but resigning him under 7M is a priority otherwise trading a 1st round pick for 1 year of Ullmark will be another 1st round pick that didn't work out:

2015 1st (Still paying for his buyout)
2015 2nd (36th pick overall Gabriel Gagne played 0 games)
2016 1st (+3rd rounder got a flop in Logan Brown over McAvoy)
2017 1st (Bowers gone for Duchene)
2018 1st (Jacob Bernard Docker was placed on waivers)
2019 1st (Lassi Thomson was placed on waivers)
2020 2nd (33rd Pick Jarventie, almost a 1st traded for nothing)
2021 1st (Tyler Boucher another flop instead of using asset)
2022 1st (7th pick overall for essentially Ullmark)
2023 1st (Got Chychrun for 12th overall AND TWO 2nds)

Way too many picks that busted. In 2022-2023, DJ Smith coached the team to a 21st place finish. 11th in the East. 86 points is the benchmark/minimum

Sometimes a trade isn't about who got the better player, it is about who is a better fit. Having another right d-man was not a fit. And playing Chabot and Chychrun together as a disaster. Playing one of them on the 3rd pairing was a waste because neither brought the physicality that is needed for a 3rd pairing. Jensen is a better fit for the Senators now. It allows Chabot to be a bit more offensive minded, and we have a proper right d-man. Plus it allows Klevin the chance to move into the 3rd pairing .... Chychrun would have blocked his ascension playing 3rd pairing. Klevin's game is more physical.
With this "new" team, its all about roles and how a player fits. This will all help the team play better.
If you look at Chychrun's stats, he got worse when Martin took over from DJ Smith. He appears to prefer the game to be less structured and when asked to play with more structure he got worse. A -31 is not something the Sens will miss. We have plenty of scoring potential. We need guys/a team that will allow less goals and less chances and less shots ...... a team that plays with defensive structure. Our defence needed to change .... and I still believe we need to change out Hamonic and JBD. I certainly look forward to what Guenette can bring to the table. Maybe Mantinpalo as well with 1 year of North American pro under his belt.
- OttawaB

I would assume a lot of the missed draft choices has to do with Melynk gutting the front office and especially the scouting staff. And Dorion in retrospect doesn't seem like the best evaluator of talent at a pro level, let alone an amateur level.

Until Dorion speaks, we will never know how hampered he was by internal limitations by Melynk.

It is telling the DJ Smith is still in the league and has a coaching job. But Dorion has all but disappeared.

I would assume a lot of the missed draft choices has to do with Melynk gutting the front office and especially the scouting staff. And Dorion in retrospect doesn't seem like the best evaluator of talent at a pro level, let alone an amateur level.

Until Dorion speaks, we will never know how hampered he was by internal limitations by Melynk.

It is telling the DJ Smith is still in the league and has a coaching job. But Dorion has all but disappeared.
- GrimmdaGoalie

I remember a TSN interview 2 years ago with Dorion saying he wrote in BOLD in his agenda "SOGAARD = READY FOR NHL". Nothing against Sogaard but boy was he wrong.

I remember a TSN interview 2 years ago with Dorion saying he wrote in BOLD in his agenda "SOGAARD = READY FOR NHL". Nothing against Sogaard but boy was he wrong.
- Not_Yan

He better be by next year. Both Forsberg and Ullmark are UFA's. The assumption is Sogaard would be the backup next year to whomever is the 1A, hopefully Ullmark after a good season.

IF not, we are looking AGAIN for goaltending next year....

It is nice they have a bit of wiggle cap space compared to last year

Few teams go without playoffs for >4 years. It's a parody league! Otherwise every team has it. It's basic. You do that with a team that is at the beginning of a rebuild, not in year 6 of one. I get that Staios wasn't here before last year, but trading away Jakob Chychrun for a 34 year old D-man really changed my opinion of him as a GM. My reaction after Green hire too. The Ullmark trade was a beauty in that it got rid of Korpisalo AND brought in a true #1 goalie, but resigning him under 7M is a priority otherwise trading a 1st round pick for 1 year of Ullmark will be another 1st round pick that didn't work out:

2015 1st (Still paying for his buyout)
2015 2nd (36th pick overall Gabriel Gagne played 0 games)
2016 1st (+3rd rounder got a flop in Logan Brown over McAvoy)
2017 1st (Bowers gone for Duchene)
2018 1st (Jacob Bernard Docker was placed on waivers)
2019 1st (Lassi Thomson was placed on waivers)
2020 2nd (33rd Pick Jarventie, almost a 1st traded for nothing)
2021 1st (Tyler Boucher another flop instead of using asset)
2022 1st (7th pick overall for essentially Ullmark)
2023 1st (Got Chychrun for 12th overall AND TWO 2nds)

Way too many picks that busted. In 2022-2023, DJ Smith coached the team to a 21st place finish. 11th in the East. 86 points is the benchmark/minimum
- AlfieisKing

As a guess i would have to say there is more reasons why chychrun was traded at so low ofvalue and so hastily. I don't think it is the girouix rumour ,he laid that to rest.
I think jensens is a fine addition.

Or perhaps it is as simple as Ottawa overpaid for a player they didn't need. And had to solve that at a loss .
I also like the fact of no distractions moving forward. That in itself is priceless.

I think some of those pics, prospects MIGHT have gotten the experience they needed to make the jump better if our idiot coach had realised we were in a rebuild and they needed to be played. Instead he played veterans major minutes. Lassie, JBD should have had their 15-20-30 minute nights with a veteran beside them. And ya, we would have lost WAY more games. But they might have turned into what we thought when we drafted them. Instead, given 6 minutes over two games and sent back down. It was a rebuild!!!! Play the kids. Ughhh...

I remember a TSN interview 2 years ago with Dorion saying he wrote in BOLD in his agenda "SOGAARD = READY FOR NHL". Nothing against Sogaard but boy was he wrong.
- Not_Yan

Aside calling Erik Brannstrom a sexual young man (1:10) Dorion said the best piece he got was Brannstrom - more than Brady Tkachuk or any other piece in the rebuild (18:30). Man o Man, we should have to hold GMs accountable by recording and showcasing what they say and showing what they said in the past

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wLkUCrhEElA&t=116s